Vague comment on return - please give advice

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Oma
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Vague comment on return - please give advice

Post by Oma » Wed Jun 11, 2014 4:08 am

Dear fellow forumites,

I'd really appreciate your take on this. I recently just signed back to Taxi and on my first submission, I'm getting a return for which the reason is not quite clear to me. I understand it's not a full critique but the screener #255 said the song was returned based on lyrics, his comments, "It might be effective to isolate the title within the choruses in order to give the song a definite identity".

The song is 'Mirror' on my soundcloud page below, also see lyrics below. To me the identity of the song seems pretty clear, or am I missing something, someone please help, I really want to know what I can do better.

Verse 1
Mirror mirror on the wall
Who’s the fairest of them all
I tried to find out who I was
From the mirror mirror in the world
Mirror mirror here I fall
Like humpty dumpty from the wall
Because I defined my image by the world
Instead of the mirror mirror in your word

Chorus
Make me beautiful you say
Turn my scars into portraits of gold
Mirror mirror reveal who I truly am
I am beautiful today
I don’t care what they may say
Mirror mirror says it all

Verse 2
Mirror mirror in the word
I look at me and I see God
Perfection in each patch each stitch
There’s no mirror mirror quite like this
So mirror mirror tell me more
So I can tell the ones like me
Forget the screens and magazines
There’s a mirror mirror in us all

Chorus
Make me beautiful you say
Turn my scars into portraits of gold
Mirror mirror reveal who I truly am
I am beautiful today
I don’t care what they may say
Mirror mirror says it all


Bridge
If you wanna know who you are
Look into the you in your heart
Every curve, every edge
Every pore and every hair
Every boy, every girl
Every colour, every shape
Say I am beautiful, beautiful
Beautiful today

Mirror mirror reveal who I truly am
I am beautiful today
I don’t care what they may say
Mirror mirror says it all
Mirror mirror says it all


https://soundcloud.com/omaa-1/mirror


CONTEMPORARY CHRISTIAN SONGS with FEMALE VOCALS are needed by a Nashville-based Independent Record Label pitching to the fantastic artists on their roster. They're on a mission to find passionate Mid-to-Up-Tempo Songs that would appeal to the fans of Francesca Battistelli, Meredith Andreas, Moriah Peters, etc. Quoting the source: "I need Songs with Christian lyrics that speak to a younger, more impressionable audience. A really big chorus is a must for this." Give them emotionally moving Songs with lyrics that focus on a relationship with God, in a fresh, creative and original way. Please submit Songs with a strong melodic structure, solid hooks, and an uplifting chorus with a powerful Christian message. Stripped-down demos and full productions are both okay to submit. Your recording quality (even for stripped-down demos) needs to be clean, clear, well balanced, and good enough to represent your song well. Please submit one to three Songs online or per CD, include lyrics. All submissions will be screened on a Yes/No basis - No full critiques. Submissions must be received no later than Thursday, June 5, 2014.
TAXI # Y140605CC

Len911
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Re: Vague comment on return - please give advice

Post by Len911 » Wed Jun 11, 2014 5:12 pm

Oma, what I think he meant was that by having the word "mirror" in all of the sections of the song and in different phrases, it's not as effective as if the word mirror was anchored in the chorus and part of the hook.

It's supposed to be a "Christian" song, that means to me, something to do with Jesus, and I don't see any reference at all to Jesus. :?
Mirroring Jesus, reflecting the word of God, I sort of get it, though the mirror, mirror on the wall thing, harkens back to witchcraft or sorcery. Also, wasn't it Narcissus whom saw his reflection in a pool of water, and thought he was the fairest of them all?? :o

Most Christian themes have to do with how Jesus saved me, sacrificed for me, healed me,fought for me, empowered me, was a friend to me, etc. etc. How I was the lowest of the low, and Jesus lifted me up. 8-)

I'm not sure mixing Disney parables, Greek mythology and nursery rhyme characters aren't a little awkward in a religious song?? ;)
https://soundcloud.com/huck-sawyer-finn
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Re: Vague comment on return - please give advice

Post by Oma » Thu Jun 12, 2014 3:43 am

Okay thanks Len, I understand it better now. On the theme, I was just trying to be a bit inventive in a way everyone can relate to, but point taken. On including the title in the verses, I know a few songs where the hook/title also features in the verses, and reading a few songwritting books I thought this was sometimes acceptable, but lesson learnt and moving ahead and back to the drawing board.

Thanks for reading and commenting.

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Re: Vague comment on return - please give advice

Post by 2lane » Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:41 am

Hey Oma,
I think Len nailed it on the reason.
Also, I'd add that if you started the chorus with the higher melody of the
" Mirror mirror reveal who I truly am" line, it would be a much stronger chorus.
It would give it lift over the verse more I think?
Just my 2 cents

You got a great voice Oma, that's for sure :D

Steve
Worse, how can it be worse...Jehova Jehova Jehova

Oma
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Re: Vague comment on return - please give advice

Post by Oma » Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:27 am

Thanks Steve, the analysis is very helpful. I guess I need to critically write and re-write my lyrics in future, and I wish I could take credit for the voice, but I have someone singing for me. I'll pass on the compliment. Thanks a bunch.

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Re: Vague comment on return - please give advice

Post by Len911 » Thu Jun 12, 2014 9:36 am

Oma, I don't know if it helps, and although songwriting books may give a lot of condensed technical advice and devices, if you can envision a song actually being performed, it will be a better guide imo. In theater or Broadway songs, the songs are written and fitted to the "book" or the play, almost never the play written around the songs. I suppose the same can be said of film and tv. My point is that if you write a song about a scene in your mind, you are less likely to stray from the theme and more apt to use the devices in the songwriting books to the best advantage.

Your song, "Mirror". You know it has to be a "Christian" song in this case, so whom is the character singing to? A congregation, her fiance, Jesus, God, her mother?? What is the character saying? Maybe the mother said to her, "Have you looked in the mirror lately?" And that might lead into song "Mirror" in context that the mother asked it, although I didn't give any pretext,lol! I need to think about why the mother would say that to her in the first place. It would probably be best to begin with a theme about mirror and then the scene would be much easier. :?

* I have judged myself by the priorities and propaganda of celebrity and the society at large, which is a mere temporary fashion, and should instead be looking at the permanence and standard of the word in Jesus. Is beauty the former or the latter? Which standard do I bear? Which standard have I been bearing?

That seems to me to be the premise of your song. Then we need to develop a scene around the premise. Maybe the mother is trying to tell her that she needs to quit partying and sleeping around, and settle down with a future, husband and children? That probably isn't the best scene,lol, hopefully it illustrates the point. It still needs a Christian theme to go along with it. Of course the mirror somehow needs to fit in there somewhere.

This is sort of a fwiw post, maybe there's something maybe there isn't,lol! All the best!
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Re: Vague comment on return - please give advice

Post by Oma » Fri Jun 13, 2014 5:57 am

Thanks Len, I guess I should write considering who is the character and who is the audience. I notice that my natural style is to write in an abstract way, but it seems the preference is for a storyline. Although sometimes when I listen to the A'las given in the listing and study the songs, they don't always follow these rules, for example some of the artists' songs are very simple and a bit common (if I say so mayself), I guess they are already stars and don't have to prove anything. But we up and coming have to really bring our best to cut through, no complaints though it just pushes me to take my craft to the next level. I really appreciate the detailed analysis and help.

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Re: Vague comment on return - please give advice

Post by Len911 » Fri Jun 13, 2014 12:43 pm

Abstract versus simple and common, it's probably "craft" that takes the abstract and makes it simple and common or easily understood. At least that seems to be what I've found when I read lyrics that I think are very well written.

I googled abstract songwriter, I thought maybe Bob Dylan might pop up, actually the ones popping up were songwriters who also painted, and they painted in the abstract. :o Maybe instead of the word abstract, it should be mysterious maybe?? Hmm
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