WAV vs MP3 and Metadata

[LesSampou]

Hello to all tech heads,

one question that has taken me some time to get close to the bottom of and now it relates to the rally as well:

You can't put meta data in Wav or aiff files, right? You can on mp3's (although iTunes doest always translate from computer to computer even so)

I heard on Taxi TV it's better to record Wavs (aiffs) to your CDR for Rally submissions than MP3s....that said, you can't add any written info to the tracks so the trade off would be to use wav and your info'll be found on one's cdr Label or the outside envelope/jewel box. ?

so what is the consensus: Mp3 vs. Wav?? And is there outside software that does metatagging better than iTunes?

very curious,
Les

[Len911]

Hello to all tech heads,

one question that has taken me some time to get close to the bottom of and now it relates to the rally as well:

You can't put meta data in Wav or aiff files, right? You can on mp3's (although iTunes doest always translate from computer to computer even so)

I heard on Taxi TV it's better to record Wavs (aiffs) to your CDR for Rally submissions than MP3s....that said, you can't add any written info to the tracks so the trade off would be to use wav and your info'll be found on one's cdr Label or the outside envelope/jewel box. ?

so what is the consensus: Mp3 vs. Wav?? And is there outside software that does metatagging better than iTunes?

very curious,
Les

cd files are .cda files not wav or aiff or mp3. You convert wav, aiff and mp3 to .cda files to burn onto a cd. The cd creation software does the converting, so no reason for less quality mp3. Cd text is the "metadata" that shows up on a cd player if the player has that capability. Cd text is created by the cd burning software. It is still necessary to label the jewel box and cd for the rally.

If you email someone an mp3 or aiff, that's when a metadata may be embedded.

*if I'm not mistaken, if you use itunes to burn a cd, you can write cd text though it won't read cd text.

[Casey H]

Yes, burn your CDs from highest res sources you have such was wav or aiff.

Wavs do not hold metadata but aiffs do. That being said, I still haven't figured out how to get my track, artist, and album names to show up on players when I burn a CD. I tried checking the box in iTunes that says "Include CD Text" but then when I play the CD on other players, it comes up Track 1, Track 2, Track 3, etc.

I know others have found solutions to this, I hope they chime in.

Casey

[Len911]

You probably need to get a software like toast for mac instead of using itunes.

http://howto.corel.com/en/r/Adding_CD_T ... ast_or_Jam

[Casey H]

UPDATE: IGNORE THE STUFF ABOUT THE BRAND OF CD, SONY, ETC!!! IT WAS WRONG!

You probably need to get a software like toast for mac instead of using itunes.

http://howto.corel.com/en/r/Adding_CD_T ... ast_or_Jam

Been doing some research and the problem doesn't appear to be a software one. ITunes has "Write CD Text" capability and you can choose that option. However, not all CD burners and not all CD-Rs themselves support CD Text. I read that Sony CD-R's are most likely to have the capability. I'd have to try a Sony CD and see what happens, assuming the burner in my computer can do it.

PS I'm not 100% sure of anything having spent quite a bit of time Google-ing, trying to make heads or tails of this.

Casey

PPS If anyone successfully burns **AUDIO** CDs (Not mp3 CDs!) from iTunes and the track names stick when playing on a car player, please let me know.

[LesSampou]

"cd files are .cda files not wav or aiff or mp3. You convert wav, aiff and mp3 to .cda files to burn onto a cd. The cd creation software does the converting, so no reason for less quality mp3. Cd text is the "metadata" that shows up on a cd player if the player has that capability. Cd text is created by the cd burning software. It is still necessary to label the jewel box and cd for the rally.

If you email someone an mp3 or aiff, that's when a metadata may be embedded.

*if I'm not mistaken, if you use itunes to burn a cd, you can write cd text though it won't read cd text."



Hi Len911, I believe wav is the same as aiff just a mac vs. windows differentiation, I was told by someone who does LOGIC PRO at Apple. However, you could very well be right. I have not yet worked with a .cda file to my knowledge unless you are saying that is way the burning process works? Good point about the CD player having the capability. But, when going from one laptop to another with a cdr, you would think of all devices to have "capability" it would be a computer program. And no, the text inserted via iTunes did NOT convert, show up, etc. Emailing, interesting....
Les

[LesSampou]

"Len911 wrote:
You probably need to get a software like toast for mac instead of using itunes.

http://howto.corel.com/en/r/Adding_CD_T ... ast_or_Jam


Been doing some research and the problem doesn't appear to be a software one. ITunes has "Write CD Text" capability and you can choose that option. However, not all CD burners and not all CD-Rs themselves support CD Text. I read that Sony CD-R's are most likely to have the capability. I'd have to try a Sony CD and see what happens, assuming the burner in my computer can do it.

PS I'm not 100% sure of anything having spent quite a bit of time Google-ing, trying to make heads or tails of this.

Casey

PPS If anyone successfully burns **AUDIO** CDs (Not mp3 CDs!) from iTunes and the track names stick when playing on a car player, please let me know."


Hi Casey,
DItto, I'd love to get to the bottom of this. Plaguing me for a while now.
I think bottom line, iTunes is pretty useless in terms of metadata, unless as Lens says you want to simply email as opposed to burn, i'll have to try that. And how interesting that the CDRs are partly "to blame" so you have to shop for text capable cdrs?
Very interesting...keep me posted too.
Les

[Casey H]

I figured it out!!

The track info DOES appear in my car player but not when you play the CD with most programs on computers. It has nothing to do with the brand of CD.

ITunes has CD Text WRITE capability but not read, as someone said. So if you burn a CD with iTunes with that box checked, it's meaningless if the CD is taken to another computer and played with iTunes, Windows Media Player, or any program that doesn't have CD Text read capability. But the data IS on the CD and can be read by a player that has read capability.

I burned a CD from iTunes, checked the box for CD Text, and the track info appeared in my car player which has the read functionality (I assume most modern car players have that). Unfortunately, I didn't have that box checked when I burned all my rally CDs which are all labeled and ready to go. Oh well... Next year.

However, since many people who get your CD will play it with iTunes or WMP, it doesn't matter for those situations anyway.

HTH
Casey

[kclements]

What I have done is create my playlist and add all the metadata within iTunes. Burn the cd and then upload that cd info to Gracenote or CDDB. Usually within a couple hours, or a day at most, it is updated.

Then I check by putting that cd in another computer that didn't have the info and it should come up. Sometimes there are a couple CDs that you have to choose from, but it is pretty obvious which one they would have to choose. Then the metadata is downloaded to anyone's iTunes that puts that cd in.

I don't know if this is the "proper" use for Gracenote or CDDB, but it works.

Cheers
kc

[Casey H]

More...

Since iTunes and other programs such as WMP can't READ CD text, the only way they get the track info is from a database accessed over the internet. Songs/albums get registered with Gracenote who maintains a database for song recognition. (There may be other services besides Gracenote, not sure).

So if you want to create an album such as your rally CD, and have track info recognized by someone else's iTunes, you can send it all to Gracenote from a menu option in iTunes. Just make sure all your metadata is properly entered first. It may take 2-3 days (Maybe more?) for the process to complete. Once the process is complete, is should work.

So, to have the track info show on a CD player such as in a car, make sure you check the "Include CD Text" box. If you want the info to appear on other computer's programs, when the cd is plugged in (do not import it), there is an option for "Submit CD Track Names". I have not tested this yet.

Casey