New Pop Formula

[NaeDae]

So now-a-days I've realized that the Katy Perry era of pop is over, and we've reached a new fad to replace VPCVPCBCC Structure. And it's due to modern pop songs having dance breakdowns.

So the new formula for AC pop is Verse-Prechorus-Chorus-BREAKDOWN-Verse-Prechorus-Chorus-BREAKDOWN. For some reason I'm just really trying to write songs like this. Maybe it's cause it comes across as a hard formula to follow, but it's starting to make sense.

Anyone here trying to hit-write and come across this? Any ideas on what specific techniques make songs hits?

One specific pattern I've noticed is that most top 40 songs tend to be written within a day, and typically by one person.

[NoizeeBhoy]

Maybe I've missed something but don't the trends show that most 'hits' are actually written by teams of writers rather than one person????

[WeWillWriteUaSong]

Almost every hit on the charts (save a few) are written by teams of writers...usually multiple teams in different rooms. Each room brainstorming different top lines and hooks and such. The artists (or reps/producers) go into each room and pluck out different pieces they like and puzzle them together. This is why a lot of pop songs sound the same. Ryan Tedder talked about this before. Kelly Clarkson "someones gotta go" and beyonce "halo" were written like this and countless others. The leftover pieces become other songs for other artists. A lot of industry writers/producers/artists discuss this process. It is severely lacking in creativity....and is usually about quantity. This usually applies to the "modern" pop stuff. Country and singer/songwriter don't really follow this formula. Mostly the "chris browns" and "rihannas" and "beyonces" follow this formula bc they have absolutely no writing skills whatsoever. So the labels trust "teams" like Stargate to make it happen....by any means necessary sometimes.

[Len911]

The only way a song can ever become a hit is if it is exposed to a great number of people. I suppose that is the obvious factor,lol!

The problem with trend tracking, or even hit tracking, is that once you think you find a pattern, Katy Perry releases a new album, or Bob Dylan or Leonard Cohen, or Adele or Simon and Garfunkel reunite, then you have everything trending differently, and no more dance breakdowns,lol!

Timing. I think even release dates of albums and songs make a big difference. If you are a new artist and release when all the big acts do you can be obscured very easily.

[WeWillWriteUaSong]

Rihanna - Needed Me : Dijon McFarlane Robyn Fenty Nick Audino Lewis Hughes Khaled Rohaim Te Whiti Warbrick Adam Feeney Brittany Hazzard Charles Hinshaw Derrus Rachel

Major Lazer - Cold Water : Ed Sheeran Benjamin Levin Karen Marie Ørsted Thomas Pentz Justin Bieber Jamie Scott Philip Meckseper Henry Allen

DJ Snake - Let Me Love You : William Grigahcine Justin Bieber Andrew Watt Ali Tamposi Brian Lee Louis Bell

Fifth Harmony - Work From Home : Joshua Coleman Jude Demorest Tyrone Griffin, Jr. Alexander Izquierdo Brian Lee (none of the girls in the group)

Usher - No Limit : Usher Raymond IV Brandon "B.A.M" Hodge Christopher Perry Theron Thomas Timothy Thomas Keith Thomas Jeffrey Lamar Williams


I still admire the songwriters....like the one's here on TAXI. We pull from inspiration...they pull from desperation.. BE YOU!

[LyricsMatter]

I still admire the songwriters....like the one's here on TAXI. We pull from inspiration...they pull from desperation.. BE YOU!

_________________
Marcus aka CaiNo

Word, Marcus! Word.

[NaeDae]

I still admire the songwriters....like the one's here on TAXI. We pull from inspiration...they pull from desperation.. BE YOU! [/quote]

Eh no reason to belittle their process. I respect a well-written pop song, cause I've seen failed attempts and can tell you it's not easy to make a well-constructed Top 40-ish song.

The 'innovators' are typically already famous and already have a means to make any song they make catch fire. The rest of us (if we're trying for hits) should model our songs around theirs if we want to make it. Not copy, but study. Those people are experts, and if you write them off as desperate or unimaginative, you're writing off the best material to learn from.

[NoizeeBhoy]

I agree with Nae. I've a huge amount of respect for the etams behind this hits - if writing a Top 40 hit were easy or failsafe formulaic everyone on here would be writing them (at least for the $£ ven if their heart wasn't in it as they could continue writing their own blues, folk, jazz etc on the side while resting easy on their millions).

I also agree with Nae's original post re the revised structure.I still think lyrical hook and repetition in the chorus and pre are vital but there is a breakdown in Major Lazer and Chainsmokers type hits lately. That's a real boot in the nuts for lyricists like me! I mean I can write a fairly catchy, non-sensical hook lyrically but how to I write a breakdown!!!!

I'd be interested to see/hear how you tweak your craft accordingly and would be interested in hearing the fruits of your labour. And hey if you ever get a pretty dope beat that needs some fairly standard lyrics drop me a line....

[TheElement]

I don't think the arrangement has changed . there are several. and the arrangement is not the deciding factor if its a hit or not.

I can see from edm and dance pop a popular arrangement is: verse 1 > build/pre chorus > chorus/drop > verse 2 > build/pre chorus > chorus/drop > bridge/breakdown > build/pre chorus (or go straight into chorus/drop) > chorus/drop > chorus/drop and out.

sometimes after first chorus/drop there is a small break or rest at around the 1 minute mark. and you dont need a bridge/breakdown at around the 2 minute mark in every song. depends on how the song is flowing. Once you hit around 3 minutes your song is done. 3:30 is good to aim for. Back in the day hit songs were 2:30 in length. The idea is to make the listener hit replay over and over to sink the hooks into their subconscious.

for those hit songs simplicity is key. choosing the right chords and layering infectious hooks over them. also for dance the beat is so important as well. you need a good solid beat. it doesnt have to be all over the place and complicated. again simplicity works better as people can then remember the song.

Of course thats just my opinion and I haven't written a hit.

[Paulie]

I read a book a few months ago called "The Song Machine" by John Seabrook. It breaks down the music industry and goes into detail about how Max Martin came to be successful, how writing has moved from collaborations to a full on factory assembly line concept. A very interesting read for writers, and a Kindle version is available.

Check it out!