registering vocal songs and their bedtracks with PRO's
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registering vocal songs and their bedtracks with PRO's
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Until now, when self publishing, I register a vocal song and it's associated bedtrack as 2 separate titles with ASCAP, like this:
My Song
My Song (instrumental)
This works. Some libraries do it this way. But it is cumbersome.
From now on I am thinking of just registering one title, the vocal song, and putting the title of the bedtrack as an 'alternate title'. Do you know of any problems with this method? Any reasons not to do this?
Thanks
Until now, when self publishing, I register a vocal song and it's associated bedtrack as 2 separate titles with ASCAP, like this:
My Song
My Song (instrumental)
This works. Some libraries do it this way. But it is cumbersome.
From now on I am thinking of just registering one title, the vocal song, and putting the title of the bedtrack as an 'alternate title'. Do you know of any problems with this method? Any reasons not to do this?
Thanks
Last edited by deantaylor on Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- pboss
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Re: registering vocal songs and their bedtracks with PRO's
Others will have more specific experience with this, but it seems to me that if you register an alternate title, it may bring up issues or complicate matters if you sign a track exclusively, then the publisher would also need to register the instrumental and .... well, it just seems to me that it may cause confusion among a publisher or possibly a music supe. If you are going non-exclusive, then it's another matter, and may not be an issue. I'm sure someone else here can give you a more concise answer - it is a great question though.
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- mazz
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Re: registering vocal songs and their bedtracks with PRO's
Personally I would wait to register with the PRO until such time as you are certain that you will be self publishing it and are actively pitching it on your own. Otherwise, it may cause more work for a publisher to switch the information.
Every publisher has their own method for registration. In my experience, some publishers only register the main version and not the alternate versions, some register all versions and some re-register every time they do a different sub publishing deal. In my ASCAP catalog, I have 4 or 5 registrations of the same piece registered with different prefix numbers (all done by the publisher, BTW). In this case it appears that the publisher is co-publishing with different production entities which requires a new registration every time.
So I would hold off until either you know you got a placement on your own or if you know you will eventually sign it and the publisher will take care of the registration. This will save work for everyone down the line.
My 2c
Every publisher has their own method for registration. In my experience, some publishers only register the main version and not the alternate versions, some register all versions and some re-register every time they do a different sub publishing deal. In my ASCAP catalog, I have 4 or 5 registrations of the same piece registered with different prefix numbers (all done by the publisher, BTW). In this case it appears that the publisher is co-publishing with different production entities which requires a new registration every time.
So I would hold off until either you know you got a placement on your own or if you know you will eventually sign it and the publisher will take care of the registration. This will save work for everyone down the line.
My 2c
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Re: registering vocal songs and their bedtracks with PRO's
I already know I am self publishing it. I thought that was understood. So is it ok to register it as one title, with the instrumental bedtrack as an alternate title?mazz wrote:Personally I would wait to register with the PRO until such time as you are certain that you will be self publishing it and are actively pitching it on your own. Otherwise, it may cause more work for a publisher to switch the information.
Every publisher has their own method for registration. In my experience, some publishers only register the main version and not the alternate versions, some register all versions and some re-register every time they do a different sub publishing deal. In my ASCAP catalog, I have 4 or 5 registrations of the same piece registered with different prefix numbers (all done by the publisher, BTW). In this case it appears that the publisher is co-publishing with different production entities which requires a new registration every time.
So I would hold off until either you know you got a placement on your own or if you know you will eventually sign it and the publisher will take care of the registration. This will save work for everyone down the line.
My 2c
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Re: registering vocal songs and their bedtracks with PRO's
I guess I didn't make the connection from your post that you were self publishing, since you mentioned other publishers and libraries in there. It wasn't clear to me
I've seen it done both ways. Not sure of the reasons the alternate title is registered. It may just be the way a certain publisher likes it done for their record keeping.
Sorry I can't be of more assistance.
I've seen it done both ways. Not sure of the reasons the alternate title is registered. It may just be the way a certain publisher likes it done for their record keeping.
Sorry I can't be of more assistance.
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Re: registering vocal songs and their bedtracks with PRO's
thanks Mazz. that is helpful. you seem to agree with my conclusion ... libraries do it both ways, so either way must be fine.
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Re: registering vocal songs and their bedtracks with PRO's
hey guys. good question. i'm not sure either.
I often compose instrumental tracks first and then later a vocalist may end up writing lyrics and a top melody to it. The resulting vocal song is registered as a 50/50 share. However my co-writer technically has no percentage in the instrumental version of the finished song (as i already composed that before). Which means if only the instrumental version would get licensed - it could/should be registered separately.
A related issue is re-titling. I've posted about this here: http://forums.taxi.com/topic32004-40.html (very interesting thread)
but I'm still stuck for an answer so hope it's ok I paste my question below.
1. Is there considered to be any difference between re-titling by:
A) giving a song two or more completely different titles (Original Title, New Title, Different Title)
B) only adding a prefix/suffix relating to the library to the original title? (xxx-Original Title, yyy-Original Title)
Appreciate your thoughts
Thanks
I often compose instrumental tracks first and then later a vocalist may end up writing lyrics and a top melody to it. The resulting vocal song is registered as a 50/50 share. However my co-writer technically has no percentage in the instrumental version of the finished song (as i already composed that before). Which means if only the instrumental version would get licensed - it could/should be registered separately.
A related issue is re-titling. I've posted about this here: http://forums.taxi.com/topic32004-40.html (very interesting thread)
but I'm still stuck for an answer so hope it's ok I paste my question below.
1. Is there considered to be any difference between re-titling by:
A) giving a song two or more completely different titles (Original Title, New Title, Different Title)
B) only adding a prefix/suffix relating to the library to the original title? (xxx-Original Title, yyy-Original Title)
Appreciate your thoughts
Thanks
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Re: registering vocal songs and their bedtracks with PRO's
Hi Jayjaysoul wrote: I'm still stuck for an answer so hope it's ok I paste my question below.
1. Is there considered to be any difference between re-titling by:
A) giving a song two or more completely different titles (Original Title, New Title, Different Title)
B) only adding a prefix/suffix relating to the library to the original title? (xxx-Original Title, yyy-Original Title)
From a practical perspective as far as maintaining non-exclusivity and how PRO royalties would get paid to the correct parties, there is no difference in these re-title techniques.
However, the "tag" method does have some advantages. If, for some reason, a music sup DOES get the same track from multiple sources, it is more obvious that it is the same track (e.g. less listening to tracks that turn out to be the same ans wasting time) and it is clearer which library should get credit. It also relates the PRO title to the composer's orginal title, something that IMHO can only be a good thing. I actually wish all re-title libraries would have used this technique. It wouldn't have solved all problems but it would have made things cleaner in many situations.
Note, that in my answer here, I make no value judgement as far as placing the same track in multiple re-title libraries. That's a whole debate to itself.
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Re: registering vocal songs and their bedtracks with PRO's
Thanks once again for your detailed and helpful answers, Casey. Good karma all the way!
I totally agree with your reasoning. Whether it's smart to work with tons of re-title libraries is indeed another thing, but yes I would also think that adding some kind of handle to the original title is a cleaner and easier solution for all involved than having multiple different titles for your songs.
Cheers!
I totally agree with your reasoning. Whether it's smart to work with tons of re-title libraries is indeed another thing, but yes I would also think that adding some kind of handle to the original title is a cleaner and easier solution for all involved than having multiple different titles for your songs.
Cheers!
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Re: registering vocal songs and their bedtracks with PRO's
Wow,
this is interesting. Thanks for posting this question.
So, the general consensus is if you have one song (or multiple songs) in a library that you are then putting into a different library it is potentially beneficial, with no side effects, to register an alternate title with your PRO to the effect of: "my song 123" and "my song 456".
-Just want to make sure I understand cause I think it is a good idea that I could potentially immediately implement.
this is interesting. Thanks for posting this question.
So, the general consensus is if you have one song (or multiple songs) in a library that you are then putting into a different library it is potentially beneficial, with no side effects, to register an alternate title with your PRO to the effect of: "my song 123" and "my song 456".
-Just want to make sure I understand cause I think it is a good idea that I could potentially immediately implement.
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