Any advice about using KAT KTMP1 (or other pad controller)?

[jonnybutter]

After all these years, I finally decided to get a multi-pad to play drums and percussion parts, and I have run into the same problem a lot of other people have: I always wondered why these drum pads always come with internal sounds, and now maybe I know. Perhaps it's tricky to get your samples and pad to play well together?

What I find to be happening is that the samples speak pretty well for a few bars, but then start to lag way behind - samples speak a good half a second after I hit the pad, or stutter. This is using the same pads and same sounds. It's as if some buffer somewhere is getting saturated. It happens with Stormdrum/Play and Addictive Drums. The 'Sensitivity' settings on the VIs and the Kat itself kind of confuse me, but I don't think that's the problem. I got the KAT because you are supposed to be able to play with your hands, and it works OK (not perfect but acceptable) for, as I said, a few bars. Then it goes wacky.

I have a mac pro with 16 gb of RAM and am still running Mountain Lion. If I load all the samples of Stormdrum3 into RAM, that doesn't fix the problem, nor does closing every other plug in Logic (i.e. running only PLAY or AD).

Any suggestions, however general? Thanks in advance

[jonnybutter]

So, for anyone who read this and wondered, here is my work around: I listen to the internal sounds as I play, but record the midi and play that back through my good samples. I usually have to edit the midi, but that's hardly unusual. Not ideal but better than no pad input at all.

Seems like a big hole in the market for a finger-playable pad controller that isn't super expensive. The Handsonic had always played very well, but it is too expensive and has no MIDI out. Everything else seems to be sticks, except this KAT.

[Russell Landwehr]

Heya, Jon.

I saw your post earlier... was waiting to see if anyone had an ideas. This is a very strange problem you are talking about here. It almost sounds like there is some sort of sync mismatch going on. Or a disagreement between your DAW and your hardware (in and out).

So lemme see if I got this right... when you first start playing percussion notes, the latency seems to be pretty much real-time, but as you go, the latency increases little by little.

Does this happen when you play those instruments with a MIDI keyboard?

Russell

Edit: more questions

I see the KAT has midi out as well as USB. which are you using? if you are using USB, are you running through a USB hub? (sometimes hubs can be flaky)

[jonnybutter]

Hey Russ - thanks for the reply. Yeah, it's a weird problem.

Seems to be the same with either MIDI plug or USB - latency is there in the beginning, but tolerable. Then it gets wacky and glitchy and unpredictable- not really little by little, but within 5-8 seconds. Not just late in a predictable way, but goofy. It kind of reminds me of what MIDI data jams used to sound like when you had a bunch of multi timbral synths going and the computer freaked for a moment.

I agree that it sounds like a sync issue of some kind but I dont even know where to start on that. My MIDI hub is a recent MOTU, and of course the USB would bypass that. Did you mean that there might be a problem with the *audio* interface and sync? My Yamaha weighted keyboard does send out MIDI clock continuously and I can't seem to turn it off or filter it, but when I turn the keyboard off the problem with the KAT persists.

I don't use a USB hub anymore (yes, flakey) and the keyboard controllers I use don't have this problem at all.

I am going to go get on the KAT forum tonight (was not so easy to find) and see if there's anything there re: this.

It would be awesome to get it figured out, since the KAT multipad is only about $120, and does work with fingers or sticks. I think it could be a hit with a lot of people!

I'll report back.

thanks man

[mojobone]

Yeah, that's definitely an unusual symptom, and there are a number of possible diseases. I'd start by having a look at what's running in the background, disconnecting your machine from internet and wi-fi and making sure your sample drive(s) is optimized for streaming samples. Try disabling your virus-checker when you're recording, too. Latency is usually a constant, unless something's robbing system resources, so unless that's the problem, (might be you just don't have enough RAM, or your 5200 RPM hard drive can't keep up) your bottleneck probably has more to do with sample playback. MIDI is just not that data-intensive. I might have some more suggestions, if you can tell us more about your setup.....

[Russell Landwehr]

Since it doesn't happen with the keyboard...

Try plugging the kat into the MOTU midi port that the keyboard is plugged into. If that doesn't do the trick, you may have a bad kat? or there is some setting on the kat that needs turned off?

Edit: I have an Alesis trigger plugged into a Simmons multi pad, that would give me double midi notes. one day after experimenting with the Simmons and the extra trigggers and cords and stuff... it started working properly.... and I don't know why.

[jonnybutter]

I think I may have found the problem. The KAT seems to be triggering from the bottom as well as the top. I found this out by picking up the unit up and gently dropping it (like from an inch high) onto a hard surface - it triggers. That may be clogging things up since for - perhaps - most or all notes played on the pad, two or more midi notes (on and off), controllers, etc. are being sent down the midi cable from the bottom. If you play some fast percussion stuff, that can be a whole lotta data I guess!

I will experiment with mounting the KAT with clamps or something and see if things work better.

After having read up on this stuff some I gather than triggers and pads is an arcane mysterious topic!

thanks Russell

[jonnybutter]

yep. That's all it was. Device should be mounted - esp if you're going to play with fingers. arg.

FWIW, Stormdrum3 on PLAY is still a little logey, but that's not the KAT multi's fault!

thanks RL and Mojo

[jonnybutter]

didn't see your reply before Mojo B - sorry. Thanks for taking the time

[Russell Landwehr]

Cool, glad it is working now.