ASCAP vs BMI

[horacejesse]

Here is one there should be a lot of opinions on.The two orgs. are not the same. A difference I know of is that if you do not have a publisher and are not officially registered as your own publisher and your song happens to hit anyway, you will not receive the publisher's share of the royalties from ASCAP, but from BMI you will. This seems pretty important.What happens to those royalties? Does ASCAP just keep them? Can you collect the publisher's share later after you register yourself as the publisher, or is it by then too late?Today I received a dispatch listing for a library which takes none of the publishing royalties. They only take 40% of the licensing fee. In a case like this the above difference in money might be huge for the songwriter without a publisher.Is anyone aware of other differences and/or disadvantages of one or the other of these organizations?

[Casey H]

Quote:Here is one there should be a lot of opinions on.The two orgs. are not the same. A difference I know of is that if you do not have a publisher and are not officially registered as your own publisher and your song happens to hit anyway, you will not receive the publisher's share of the royalties from ASCAP, but from BMI you will. This seems pretty important.What happens to those royalties? Does ASCAP just keep them? Can you collect the publisher's share later after you register yourself as the publisher, or is it by then too late?Today I received a dispatch listing for a library which takes none of the publishing royalties. They only take 40% of the licensing fee. In a case like this the above difference in money might be huge for the songwriter without a publisher.Is anyone aware of other differences and/or disadvantages of one or the other of these organizations?Not true about ASCAP. You can register a song, naming yourself as the publisher and collect both shares. Besides, if you have a song cut by an artist, why wouldn't you register your own publishing company regardless of whether you are with ASCAP or BMI? It's very easy with either PRO. I created an ASCAP publishing company- all I had to do was fill out some forms and send them in. When I did it, there was no fee. I'm not sure if that's the case now.Bottom line is it is very simple to collect both the writer's and publisher's share. Not worth worrying about until you are close to a placement. Casey

[nomiyah]

I'll tell you why I picked ASCAP. I worked for a couple of years in the office of a nightclub. We were constantly in the red and only paid the most important bills. BMI sent a bill once or twice a year but that's it. ASCAP was much more aggresive in collecting payments, sending frequent invoices, using collection agencies, imposing penalties. All the years I worked there, we never paid BMI but we did pay ASCAP. I figured if that was the case in one club, it was probably going on in lots of other music-using venues. So that's why I joined ASCAP.

[horacejesse]

Yo Hurowitz,You misread what I said.What I said was you cannot collect the publisher's share of the the royalties from ASCAP unless you are registered with them as a publisher. With BMI you can.What I asked was if you can register as a publisher after the fact (the song becomes a hit without a registered publisher) and then collect the publisher's share of the royalties from ASCAP.If it is as easy and cheap as you say, it would be hard to find excuses not register as a publisher.

[horacejesse]

Interesting indeed, Nomiyah. I will talk to some other nightclub owners. What state was that in?

[Casey H]

Quote:Yo Hurowitz,You misread what I said.What I said was you cannot collect the publisher's share of the the royalties from ASCAP unless you are registered with them as a publisher. With BMI you can.What I asked was if you can register as a publisher after the fact (the song becomes a hit without a registered publisher) and then collect the publisher's share of the royalties from ASCAP.If it is as easy and cheap as you say, it would be hard to find excuses not register as a publisher.You can register (song, songwriter, publisher, whatever) with ASCAP when your song gets cut or is about to get airplay. The process takes about 4-6 weeks and they look back either 3 or 6 (?) months regarding royalties, so you don't lose anything. I am NOT saying ASCAP is better than BMI, just stating with what I know from working with them. Casey

[edteja]

I registered my publishing company with ASCAP for free about six months ago. No sweat. Download the PDF and fill it in.I was with ASCAP a LONG time ago. When I did my CD in 2001 I thought about going with BMI cause I liked some of the people they had on the ground in Austin (where I was living then) and some of the goog work the were doing. But when I got into trying to sign up, the people in the main office were so incredibly rude and unhelpful (not to mention they flat lied to me), that I decided I didn't want to do business with them. THat was those people, and does not mean there is anything wrong with the orgranization, but I had to deal with those gatekeepers and I didn't enjoy the experience. But both have advantages and disadvantages. It used to have a lot to do with what kind of music you wrote. ASCAP was pop and BMI country, but I don't see that as an issue these days. But maybe it is. A lot of Nashville publishers are BMI only (or say they are).

[nomiyah]

Quote:Interesting indeed, Nomiyah. I will talk to some other nightclub owners. What state was that in?California in the mid-90's.

[nomiyah]

Quote:[quote author=horacejesse board=listings thread=1156900138 post=1156929389]You can register (song, songwriter, publisher, whatever) with ASCAP when your song gets cut or is about to get airplay. The process takes about 4-6 weeks and they look back either 3 or 6 (?) months regarding royalties, so you don't lose anything. I am NOT saying ASCAP is better than BMI, just stating with what I know from working with them.They go back 6 months before you become a member.

[matto]

You'll find about as many opinions on this as there are songriters and publishers. Among the libraries that I work with, the majority opinion seems to be that BMI takes better care and is more responsive to "the little guy" (i.e. the no name music library composer). Although there are also those who disagree, saying ASCAP pays better for such uses.If you're a top hit writer, BMI apparently pays better due to a multi-tiered "bonus system" (witness the recent switch from A to B by artists such as Michelle Branch and Christina Aguilera).The thing horacejesse brought up originally, used to be an issue years ago, when both ASCAP and BMI were charging yearly dues to publishers. On BMI's works registration form you could simply indicate your writer's share as "200%" and collect the full writer's and publisher's shares without joining as a publisher, thus avoiding the yearly dues. Of course now, with the yearly dues gone, this is a moot point.FWIW, I feel very well taken care of as a BMI member and have no desire to switch. And my gut instinct tells me I'd feel exactly the same way had I gone with ASCAP... mattoBTW WHY is this thread in "Listings"??