Didn't understand the critique for "Ghost-hunting" Cue

[Freakwichtel]

Hey guys,

my song for the following listing was rejected:

SIMPLE, GHOST-HUNTING INSTRUMENTAL CUES are needed for NON-Exclusive Placements by the Music Supervisor of a Ghost Hunting-type Reality TV Show
We’d like to stress the simplicity they need, and suggest that you don’t go overboard and work to impress them with your compositional or production virtuosity for this pitch.
Give them straightforward Instrumental Cues in ALL-TEMPOS that focus on a singular melodic theme
Try pieces with a piano, harp, harpsichord, bells, or a de-tuned music box being the primary focus of your Cue. Please AVOID big orchestral Cue
but don’t go overboard and add too much “stuff!” Remember, the simpler the better

https://soundcloud.com/jochenwingerter/empty-room

Critique was: This is a nice initial thematic idea. Your piano sounds very thin. It could have been possibly supported with some other loops or pads to help create harmonic tension.Then bringing in the drums really doesn't work. Instead of feeling like it's building the piece it feels out of context. There are percussion loops that you could use that would work better for this style of music.

So, I used a slight piano sound for simple melodies and a loop like it was asked for and then it's called to thin and I should add more instruments to the arrangement?
Really, I didn't get it...
If they would have critised, that it' not enough tension within or the melodie don't fit that's ok... but that the arrangement is to simple, while the listing definitly asked fo it multiple times, sorry, that is no comprehensible critique.

[jonnybutter]

Honestly, I liked your cue and don't see why it wouldn't be useful in a show like this. I didn't think the drums coming in sounded out of place. I didn't think the piano sounded particularly thin either. Maybe someone else can hear something relevant that I can't

[andygabrys]

IMO....

i didn't find it "thin" either, but i did notice the mood shifted somewhat in the heavier sections. Sometimes a different mood wouldn't fit the picture and that would be a reason to replace the cue with something that was more constant throughout.

i think the comment about the percussion is there is stuff that is more biased towards hi-hat and percussion that provides motion without kick and snare - when the kick and snare enter it can sound much heavier.

if something is thin by itself, yes you could double it with another keyboard, a synth or rhodes, or celesta or glock etc.

Lots of other people posted with forewords for this listing - I would listen to all of them, and look for the common elements between those forwards, and then examine your piece and see whether your piece also has those elements or techniques.

[jonnybutter]

Andy's a much older hand at TV cues than I am, so I would listen to what he says, but I would bet that the sheer volume of submissions might have played a role too. The original listing said the guy already had tons of material from the first listing, and also that he was using everything Taxi was sending him, so.. I bet there were tons of submissions, so the bar went higher.

If you have 10 jobs to fill, and 5000 out of the 20,000 people who apply are reasonably qualified, and you have to *give a detailed reason* to the 4990 why they didn't make it, how do you do it? I bet it's hard!

[Freakwichtel]

Hey guys,
thanks for your comments!!
I totally understand the flood of submitted songs for every screening...
But I listened to all of the forwarded pieces in the other section and some are really great ones, but some of them are totally out of range from what was mentioned in the description. Pad-oriented, layered pieces without melodies.... Sounds scary, but definitly not, what was asked for...
So, this listing may be one of the counter examples for the advice, that you should normally stick to the detailed description in the listings.
But more for the "if it gives the vibe, it's right" direction of writing.
Challenge accepted!!

And congrats to all forwarded writers!!

[jonnybutter]

Hey guys,
thanks for your comments!!
I totally understand the flood of submitted songs for every screening...

I don't imagine that *every* listing gets a flood of submissions. And that this listing did is pure conjecture on my part!

[VanderBoegh]

Nice piece, man. I took a listen and enjoyed it. Although it's more emotionally haunting than creepy. And for a ghost-hunting show, I imagine they'd want something more downright creepy.

A couple of production notes you may want to check out though:

The boom/kick drums that come in at the :53 section don't totally line up with the beat. Make sure everything is hitting where it needs to (just quantize them if they're midi notes, or snap them to a grid if they're audio files).

There's a click/pop/glitch at 1:14 that you'll want to look into and see if it's in your master version. Sometimes little things like that can cost you an opportunity!

Best of luck,

~~Matt

[Russell Landwehr]

Andy's a much older hand at TV cues than I am, so I would listen to what he says, but I would bet that the sheer volume of submissions might have played a role too. The original listing said the guy already had tons of material from the first listing, and also that he was using everything Taxi was sending him, so.. I bet there were tons of submissions, so the bar went higher.

If you have 10 jobs to fill, and 5000 out of the 20,000 people who apply are reasonably qualified, and you have to *give a detailed reason* to the 4990 why they didn't make it, how do you do it? I bet it's hard!

Heya, Jon

TAXI doesn't fill a quota when they forward stuff to the listing parties. If every submission is on target they will send them all. If only one submission is on target they will send only that one.

Regards
Russell

[jonnybutter]

Hey Russell,

I know Taxi doesn't have quotas - that is one of the many good and fair attributes to the system here. But what is the screener supposed to do if the client says, 'This time, only send me the very best of the very best, the tippy top! I have a ton of music already and don't want and don't have time to sift through 1500 cues - that's your [Taxi's] job! Raise the bar!"

So my metaphor of the job openings isn't right, since there isn't a set amount of 'slots'. But what I was trying to convey was the problem of a super high bar in a situation where 'competitive' can go only so far - a very very narrow sub genre, i.e. rewrites of 'Halloween' et. al. You have to wonder eventually, how high can the bar actually get? I wouldn't say that the quality of cues this show uses doesn't matter, but beyond a certain level of technical and compositional quality, how much better can they really be? The producer wants what he wants because he knows what works - the function of the music is to telegraph the right feel and move the show along, not to impress anyone with how super creative it is, musically. The dea is not to impress or distract the viewer. So...

I don't think anyone was being dishonest here, I just think it's one of those things. And that it might be a mistake to always take the screener's comments too literally - in this case, to worry that "OMG, my piano is too thin! I better additive-EQ it to death!"; That doesn't mean there wasn't something that could be improved on.

[Onaginoffegin]

Piano didn't sound thin to me either. One thing you might consider is shortening the piece, and pack the diverse elements into two minutes, for instance. But that's just me.
Also, I don't know if I'm allowed to give out the exact numbers, as I'm new to the forums, but I do happen to know that TAXI received a very large number of submissions for this listing. The number of forwards was also quite high.