I apologize for this newb question

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brianzilm
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I apologize for this newb question

Post by brianzilm » Sun Jul 14, 2019 6:56 am

Hello new friends on taxi, I’m still really, really green when it comes to the music business industry. So many of you offer great insight and I’m hoping for some here. I’m trying to decide if pursuing a publisher deal is where I should start for my end goal or if I should aim towards libraries. Or both!
I’m honestly not certain which of the two would be the best for me right now. My ultimate goal is to be a professional songwriter. Writing and working with talented people every day on music for other performing artists is my dream. I’m a realistic guy thoufh. 37 year olds with a ten year old and a brain disease- signing with a label and being a touring act just isn’t in the cards for me. BUT...I write catchy tunes and melodies. Commercial ready, TV cue ready, poppy stuff.
So here’s my conundrum. I have one album. There are catchy tunes on there. I have the second one coming out later this year. The second one was 90% written for the sole purpose to shop for placements or other artists to record. I would still like to release the upcoming album but I’m shopping them like crazy. Is it still a good idea to release those new songs on an album if I’m shopping them around?
Making money is obviously the goal. For me, the disease has me on a disability from what I was once able to do- but I’m a proud guy and don’t want to rely on disability. I want to do something with how my brain works now and be independent. While the old analytical side of my brain is bye bye, the creative side is flourishing. So, it’s kind of a unique situation. I’m fortunate to have the disability as I learn and get my feet wet, but that’s not what I want.
What would you all say is the best route to take in your opinions? Is a publisher the best route? Or should I look further into music libraries around the world?
Forgive my cluelessness. I’m still learning all of this but have learned a lot reading all of the posts here and I would really appreciate any sort of guidance. Thanks so much.
My 2015 album, Ferdinand, is on Spotify and wherever else you listen to music.

https://soundcloud.com/brianzilmmusic
http://www.taxi.com/brianzilm

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Re: I apologize for this newb question

Post by ttully » Sun Jul 14, 2019 7:34 am

Hi Brian,

I'm not going to sugar coat it....

To be 'successful' writing music for TV and or Movies via music libraries... you need to be EXTREMELY prolific... and write GREAT music.... good music is not good enough now a days.
AND
Unless you are under 20 years old with a great writing team.... it is also going to be almost impossible to get any 'BIG TIME' publishing deal..... as an artist.

BUT....since you would like to become a songwriter....
I would suggest submitting some of your music to some Taxi listings where artists or labels are looking for the type of songs you write.
The feedback you get will be invaluable!!!!

Then you will find out if you have 'the right stuff'.....and what you will need to do to 'get the right stuff'.
And don't get discouraged (easier said than done)..... many of the successful writers here WERE NOT SUCCESSFUL for a long time....but they didn't give up!

One more thing.... (this applies not just to you)…. Please remove the 's' from https for your taxi page …. many browsers will not work if you leave it as https.... make it http … instead!
Notice how mine...below... is http.....

My 2 cents worth,
Tim

brianzilm
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Re: I apologize for this newb question

Post by brianzilm » Sun Jul 14, 2019 7:48 am

Thanks very much, Tim. Sugar coating things doesn’t do me any so I appreciate your honesty. In the short time I’ve been with Taxi, it’s already opened up my mind to create new music outside of my comfort zone. I’m sure my returns will outweigh my forwards, but that’s okay. I really don’t expect much at the beginning. But the input that I get from you guys, Taxi TV, and the postings is immeasurable. Thanks very much, man
I’ll go change that URL right now. Thanks for pointing that out.
My 2015 album, Ferdinand, is on Spotify and wherever else you listen to music.

https://soundcloud.com/brianzilmmusic
http://www.taxi.com/brianzilm

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Re: I apologize for this newb question

Post by cosmicdolphin » Sun Jul 14, 2019 8:58 am

Hi Brian

I just had a listen to your SoundCloud ...Around The Sun..pretty basic song idea with pitchy vocals

Baby I Do - better but not the best mix and it's not reallly an engaging song for licensing IMHO..vocals are sub par

Day Drinknig - Very below par for licensing..songwriting..performance..mix..sounds worse than a demo I made on a 4 track 30 yrs ago

If It's You - Better production..still dated sounding but the vocals are sub-par and killing it

Mark

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Re: I apologize for this newb question

Post by Kolstad » Sun Jul 14, 2019 9:13 am

Anything is possible in this world, so stick with it. Success is not a rule based activity, so it impossible to suggest a best route, though. The money is in licensing to film/tv and commercials, in sold out shows as an indie, in publishing companies and in the deals the major labels make with the streaming companies. Thats the markets right now.

The best way to make money with music is to learn everything you can about how the business side of it works, and of course be great at writing, performing and producing the works. Everyone has an opinion about music, so buy a solid armor and team up with some serious dudes and dudettes to keep it fun.
Ceo of my own life

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Re: I apologize for this newb question

Post by Ted » Sun Jul 14, 2019 10:19 am

Brian,

I had a listen to your tunes. I agree somewhat with cosmicdolphin's assessment, but I do also hear some potential if you put the work in and listen to/implement Taxi feedback critiques. Some of your stuff could benefit from some editing here and there with how certain lyrics flow. Also, I'm a person who's had to struggle a lot to make my vocals sound good on a demo. I used to have really bad pitch issues, but a lot of persistence in recording in going back and listening has helped me a lot.

I think with vocals-- perhaps a vocal coach could help-- I've used one before. It sounds like maybe you're not 100% comfortable while you're recording. Could be microphone technique, something in your monitor mix, red-light syndrome,etc. The frustrating thing is that I could sing ideas into my phone or a tape recorder-- or sing in public or do karaoke and my voice sounded great-- but some aspect of my demo recording process was changing the way I sang-- for the worse. I've been working on building vocal channel strip templates in Logic for myself-- making sure that I have some kind of mic preamp to give myself a little gain and it seems to help.

Also, it sounds like maybe your songs aren't always in the best key for your voice. Just guessing. I used to write a lot with guitar in an apartment and never wanted to disturb the neighbors-- so I'd write songs in low keys. But when I'd go to record them, I could never get the right power and resonance in my voice. Consider doing a lot of trial and error with transposition to find the optimal marriage between your song and your voice.

No matter how good you are in some areas, the audience will always hone in on any potential weaknesses until you suss each one out and fix it. That's something I remind myself every day. You will go back and listen to the stuff you recorded you will feel good about the things you did right; but the audience will only focus first on what you did wrong.

Last year I made a lot of good demos-- mostly instrumental-- and I decided to join Taxi a few months ago. I'll be honest-- I thought it was gonna be nothing but forwards, but that's not been the case so far. At first it was because I was trying to shoehorn my existing ideas into listings in which they were maybe 70% on target. It's a common thing that noobs do when they join, I think. When the returns started coming, I had to take a look at why and change my approach.

Then I stopped getting returns for being "stylistically off target", but would get dinged for things like "too much reverb" on a track, etc. So I've had to go back and look at how my EQ compares to tracks that get forwards.

When I get frustrated, I have to remind myself that so far I've only really submitted to "high-bar" listings-- if I'd have been aiming more at musical libraries I'd undoubtedly be getting some forwards-- so that's something I'm going to start working on. Still, the high-bar stuff is really making me work on improving every weakness I have. I need money like anyone so I won't lie-- it's the high-bar listings that are the ones that peel my ass off the couch and make me push myself. But probably submitting to library listings is what I need to do.

There are times where you work really hard and smart on a listing and you're CERTAIN it's gonna be a forward and you get a return... this is what it means when people tell you that you have to learn to deal with constant rejection and "grow a thick skin."

I look at the Forwards blog and listen to the tracks that got forwarded when mine got a return-- it's helpful to see where the bar really is. Sometimes I agree and sometimes I fume a little over tracks that I don't feel should have gotten a forward, but I try to keep my cool and keep aiming at the next one. It helps that I have one of my brothers acting as a second set of ears for me and giving me feedback on my progress.

Good luck! Don't get discouraged-- constructive feedback is a gift. Seek it out and use it. And by this time next year, you might be making music at a level you never thought possible.

I'll finish with something I probably shouldn't share... A while back I heard a song from a Taxi member that was just terrible. The lyrics were bad-- the production, the performance--everything. It was so bad that I played it for some coworkers and we all had a big laugh over it. But I couldn't get that song out of my head. Sometimes the biggest turdburgers make for the most indelible earworms. But then recently I happened to stumble upon a more recent demo of a new song from the same Taxi member--and it was such a good song that I stopped and said "wow". It actually made me genuinely envious of this member's talent and I felt humbled.

Cheers!

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Re: I apologize for this newb question

Post by brianzilm » Sun Jul 14, 2019 11:56 am

cosmicdolphin wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 8:58 am
Hi Brian

I just had a listen to your SoundCloud ...Around The Sun..pretty basic song idea with pitchy vocals

Baby I Do - better but not the best mix and it's not reallly an engaging song for licensing IMHO..vocals are sub par

Day Drinknig - Very below par for licensing..songwriting..performance..mix..sounds worse than a demo I made on a 4 track 30 yrs ago

If It's You - Better production..still dated sounding but the vocals are sub-par and killing it

Mark
Around the Sun is a 15 minute thing I did for a friend. Baby I Do isn’t a final mix. Day Drinking is marked as a rough mix. Basically it’s the rough template I was given just for doing vocals over.

Thanks for listening.
My 2015 album, Ferdinand, is on Spotify and wherever else you listen to music.

https://soundcloud.com/brianzilmmusic
http://www.taxi.com/brianzilm

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Re: I apologize for this newb question

Post by brianzilm » Sun Jul 14, 2019 12:15 pm

Ted wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 10:19 am
Brian,

I had a listen to your tunes. I agree somewhat with cosmicdolphin's assessment, but I do also hear some potential if you put the work in and listen to/implement Taxi feedback critiques. Some of your stuff could benefit from some editing here and there with how certain lyrics flow. Also, I'm a person who's had to struggle a lot to make my vocals sound good on a demo. I used to have really bad pitch issues, but a lot of persistence in recording in going back and listening has helped me a lot.

I think with vocals-- perhaps a vocal coach could help-- I've used one before. It sounds like maybe you're not 100% comfortable while you're recording. Could be microphone technique, something in your monitor mix, red-light syndrome,etc. The frustrating thing is that I could sing ideas into my phone or a tape recorder-- or sing in public or do karaoke and my voice sounded great-- but some aspect of my demo recording process was changing the way I sang-- for the worse. I've been working on building vocal channel strip templates in Logic for myself-- making sure that I have some kind of mic preamp to give myself a little gain and it seems to help.

Also, it sounds like maybe your songs aren't always in the best key for your voice. Just guessing. I used to write a lot with guitar in an apartment and never wanted to disturb the neighbors-- so I'd write songs in low keys. But when I'd go to record them, I could never get the right power and resonance in my voice. Consider doing a lot of trial and error with transposition to find the optimal marriage between your song and your voice.

No matter how good you are in some areas, the audience will always hone in on any potential weaknesses until you suss each one out and fix it. That's something I remind myself every day. You will go back and listen to the stuff you recorded you will feel good about the things you did right; but the audience will only focus first on what you did wrong.

Last year I made a lot of good demos-- mostly instrumental-- and I decided to join Taxi a few months ago. I'll be honest-- I thought it was gonna be nothing but forwards, but that's not been the case so far. At first it was because I was trying to shoehorn my existing ideas into listings in which they were maybe 70% on target. It's a common thing that noobs do when they join, I think. When the returns started coming, I had to take a look at why and change my approach.

Then I stopped getting returns for being "stylistically off target", but would get dinged for things like "too much reverb" on a track, etc. So I've had to go back and look at how my EQ compares to tracks that get forwards.

When I get frustrated, I have to remind myself that so far I've only really submitted to "high-bar" listings-- if I'd have been aiming more at musical libraries I'd undoubtedly be getting some forwards-- so that's something I'm going to start working on. Still, the high-bar stuff is really making me work on improving every weakness I have. I need money like anyone so I won't lie-- it's the high-bar listings that are the ones that peel my ass off the couch and make me push myself. But probably submitting to library listings is what I need to do.

There are times where you work really hard and smart on a listing and you're CERTAIN it's gonna be a forward and you get a return... this is what it means when people tell you that you have to learn to deal with constant rejection and "grow a thick skin."

I look at the Forwards blog and listen to the tracks that got forwarded when mine got a return-- it's helpful to see where the bar really is. Sometimes I agree and sometimes I fume a little over tracks that I don't feel should have gotten a forward, but I try to keep my cool and keep aiming at the next one. It helps that I have one of my brothers acting as a second set of ears for me and giving me feedback on my progress.

Good luck! Don't get discouraged-- constructive feedback is a gift. Seek it out and use it. And by this time next year, you might be making music at a level you never thought possible.

I'll finish with something I probably shouldn't share... A while back I heard a song from a Taxi member that was just terrible. The lyrics were bad-- the production, the performance--everything. It was so bad that I played it for some coworkers and we all had a big laugh over it. But I couldn't get that song out of my head. Sometimes the biggest turdburgers make for the most indelible earworms. But then recently I happened to stumble upon a more recent demo of a new song from the same Taxi member--and it was such a good song that I stopped and said "wow". It actually made me genuinely envious of this member's talent and I felt humbled.

Cheers!
Thank you to you as well for the constructive criticism. I really need to get around to uploading some instrumentals. I’m still in the early stages of learning home recordings.
My 2015 album, Ferdinand, is on Spotify and wherever else you listen to music.

https://soundcloud.com/brianzilmmusic
http://www.taxi.com/brianzilm

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Re: I apologize for this newb question

Post by andygabrys » Mon Jul 15, 2019 10:32 am

Interesting situation. I would say:


..........I’m trying to decide if pursuing a publisher deal is where I should start for my end goal or if I should aim towards libraries. Or both!

Getting a publisher deal - You mean where you are a songwriter with songs that are shopped to major artists to record?

1. Live in a major center like Nashville, New York or LA and keep pounding pavement or,
2. Have a track record and a back catalog of songs that could be cut by artists, and other productions of your own that the publisher could pitch to film / tv / commercials etc.

Based on the experiences of a good friend who has long been in the business and is signed to BMG under such a deal.



.....My ultimate goal is to be a professional songwriter. Writing and working with talented people every day on music for other performing artists is my dream. .......

1. Move to Nashville and start co-writing, or,
2. Meet people via TAXI (especially at the Rally) and embark on a more do-it-yourself course.


......I write catchy tunes and melodies. Commercial ready, TV cue ready, poppy stuff.......

If you can have somebody produce or help you produce this stuff to a broadcast quality level then you have a good chance of making $.

Where you put your music will depend on its ultimate marketability.

Music Libraries are in general a slow dependable burn.
Writing for commercials is very competitive but can lead to good $.
Having a hit song is a one in a million shot but could set you up for a long time.

None of these situations will happen without a lot of work and possibly a lot of lean years in the start.


.....The second one was 90% written for the sole purpose to shop for placements or other artists to record. I would still like to release the upcoming album but I’m shopping them like crazy. Is it still a good idea to release those new songs on an album if I’m shopping them around?.......

Depends on where they land. Some music libraries want some exclusivity on music that they sign. That means copyright and sound recording.

You have to write more and cover all possible situations or find out more about music libraries and how they work.

NOTE: its up to you what you put on your websites and soundcloud pages - and if you tag it as what it is "rough demo" "rough mix" etc then people know what you are posting. Otherwise they might infer that the writing / performance / production isn't very good.

Save the finished stuff for your promotional web presence. Keep the rough stuff quiet.



......Making money is obviously the goal........

And the goal of many here as well. You need to do more research into how money is made. Kolstad mentioned a few things.

......While the old analytical side of my brain is bye bye, the creative side is flourishing.......

Another good reason to find collaborators. You need people who can fill in the parts you cannot do. If part of the analytical side is production / mix / mastering you need that to compete

Good luck on wherever your road leads.

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Re: I apologize for this newb question

Post by brianzilm » Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:33 pm

andygabrys wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 10:32 am
Interesting situation. I would say:


..........I’m trying to decide if pursuing a publisher deal is where I should start for my end goal or if I should aim towards libraries. Or both!

Getting a publisher deal - You mean where you are a songwriter with songs that are shopped to major artists to record?

1. Live in a major center like Nashville, New York or LA and keep pounding pavement or,
2. Have a track record and a back catalog of songs that could be cut by artists, and other productions of your own that the publisher could pitch to film / tv / commercials etc.

Based on the experiences of a good friend who has long been in the business and is signed to BMG under such a deal.



.....My ultimate goal is to be a professional songwriter. Writing and working with talented people every day on music for other performing artists is my dream. .......

1. Move to Nashville and start co-writing, or,
2. Meet people via TAXI (especially at the Rally) and embark on a more do-it-yourself course.


......I write catchy tunes and melodies. Commercial ready, TV cue ready, poppy stuff.......

If you can have somebody produce or help you produce this stuff to a broadcast quality level then you have a good chance of making $.

Where you put your music will depend on its ultimate marketability.

Music Libraries are in general a slow dependable burn.
Writing for commercials is very competitive but can lead to good $.
Having a hit song is a one in a million shot but could set you up for a long time.

None of these situations will happen without a lot of work and possibly a lot of lean years in the start.


.....The second one was 90% written for the sole purpose to shop for placements or other artists to record. I would still like to release the upcoming album but I’m shopping them like crazy. Is it still a good idea to release those new songs on an album if I’m shopping them around?.......

Depends on where they land. Some music libraries want some exclusivity on music that they sign. That means copyright and sound recording.

You have to write more and cover all possible situations or find out more about music libraries and how they work.

NOTE: its up to you what you put on your websites and soundcloud pages - and if you tag it as what it is "rough demo" "rough mix" etc then people know what you are posting. Otherwise they might infer that the writing / performance / production isn't very good.

Save the finished stuff for your promotional web presence. Keep the rough stuff quiet.



......Making money is obviously the goal........

And the goal of many here as well. You need to do more research into how money is made. Kolstad mentioned a few things.

......While the old analytical side of my brain is bye bye, the creative side is flourishing.......

Another good reason to find collaborators. You need people who can fill in the parts you cannot do. If part of the analytical side is production / mix / mastering you need that to compete

Good luck on wherever your road leads.

Thanks so much for all of this. Sincerely. I really appreciate all of the feedback.
My 2015 album, Ferdinand, is on Spotify and wherever else you listen to music.

https://soundcloud.com/brianzilmmusic
http://www.taxi.com/brianzilm

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