Is it ethical for a library to ask for writer's share?

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SteveBaruah
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Re: Is it ethical for a library to ask for writer's share?

Post by SteveBaruah » Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:53 am

I would never hand over the publishing to a music supervisor leaving me to split the writer's share with the library, - ever.


With this deal I'm fairly sure I will make as much money as with a 'normal' deal, so I think its worth doing. And if its not I just wont send them anymore cues. If things don't make money they usually die out pretty quickly.
I've also checked with BMI about this set up. They said there is nothing wrong with it from their point of view.

This might open a can of worms, and I don't know if I know the answer, but;
Is there really any difference between a music supervisor taking a 'kick back' or opening it's own music library, singing cues, using them and taking 100% of the publishing...?

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Re: Is it ethical for a library to ask for writer's share?

Post by DesireInspires » Thu Jul 20, 2017 10:01 am

stevebarden wrote:Guys, don't encourage this type of behavior! While it's true that production companies are getting wise to publisher royalties, I've spoken to several music library owners on this subject and they all agree that this is unethical behavior on the part of the production companies (possibly even illegal). This amounts to a "pay-to-play" kickback. If it smells like "payola", it is. If these production companies want to take publisher rights then they should register as publishers and hire on composers directly. Shame on these music libraries for allowing it.
It is definitely payola.

The production company is the big winner in the deal. They get to use the whole catalog for one set fee, sometimes even for free. Then they get paid money via the PRO each time the music is used.

If the client paid a blanket fee, they will probably eventually recoup that upfront expenditure via publisher's royalties. If they paid nothing, they are in the black as soon as they get their first PRO payout. The client is pretty much minting money at that point.

What does the library owner and the songwriter get? Scraps for their troubles. I just hope composers are not signing away their copyrights to these deals.

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Re: Is it ethical for a library to ask for writer's share?

Post by DesireInspires » Thu Jul 20, 2017 2:30 pm

A music library/licensing company should not ever touch the writer's share.

Also, a production company should never touch the publisher's share unless they are actually acting as a music publisher and own the rights to the music.

What is the point of giving away part of my writer's share because a music library gave up a part of its publisher's share? I may as well cut the library out and submit my songs directly to the production company.

The library isn't needed if they can't stay in business with their split of the publisher's share. These companies are going to go out of business because they are not run by people who know the business of music publishing. The production companies will eventually start acting as music libraries themselves and take control of the music. They will license the songs to other companies, collect all sync fees, and will not split them with the music library or the composer.

Why? Because they have access to the music. These production companies will find a way to take control of the music and will force the the music libraries of business. The composer will only then be able to make PRO royalties. But wait, what happens when the production company does a direct license with a client? They get all of the license fee. The composer gets none of the license fee and also gets no PRO royalties. Score 1 for the production company and ZERO for everyone else!

It's a dirty game out here. Play to win.

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Re: Is it ethical for a library to ask for writer's share?

Post by DesireInspires » Tue Mar 06, 2018 12:35 pm

New Listing:

CONTEMPORARY, TOP 40-Style POP INSTRUMENTAL CUES are needed by a quickly expanding NON-Exclusive Music Library that already has a very long track record of placements. They’re looking for slick, Mid-to-Up Tempo Instrumental Cues that would sound at home on a playlist with music like (but not limited to) these references they gave us:
NOTE: We recently ran this request as Listing (TAXI # Y180131IC), but the company didn’t get enough material and asked us to re-run this request again to see if we could find them more great material. If you submitted to TAXI # Y180131IC, please submit different material this time around!
................

This company offers a NON-EXCLUSIVE, 50/50 split of all income generated by your music. In other words, you’ll equally co-own the Writer’s share and the Publisher’s share of the new title and split all income. Due to the nature of this deal, all composers need to have or be willing to set up Publishing Company with your P.R.O. if accepted into this Music Library. (It’s not that hard. You’re basically giving the P.R.O. an entity to which they can send your money!) You must own or control your Master and Composition to submit to this pitch. You’ll maintain full ownership of the original Copyright and Master Recording. Please submit as many Instrumental Cues as you’d like online or per CD. All submissions will be screened on a Yes/No basis - No full critiques. Submissions must be received no later than 11:59PM (PDT) on Tuesday, March 20th, 2018. TAXI #Y180320CP


Why does the songwriter have to give up 50% of the songwriter’s share? Conversely, why does the songwriter get 50% of the publisher’s share?

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Re: Is it ethical for a library to ask for writer's share?

Post by cosmicdolphin » Tue Mar 06, 2018 12:56 pm

DesireInspires wrote:

Why does the songwriter have to give up 50% of the songwriter’s share? Conversely, why does the songwriter get 50% of the publisher’s share?


What's the point of splitting like that ?

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Re: Is it ethical for a library to ask for writer's share?

Post by DesireInspires » Tue Mar 06, 2018 2:38 pm

cosmicdolphin wrote:
DesireInspires wrote:

Why does the songwriter have to give up 50% of the songwriter’s share? Conversely, why does the songwriter get 50% of the publisher’s share?


What's the point of splitting like that ?


I have no idea.

But it does not sound legitimate to me without a solid rationale behind it. I don’t believe a deal like this is even possible for some people in PROs in Europe.

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Re: Is it ethical for a library to ask for writer's share?

Post by funsongs » Tue Mar 06, 2018 6:27 pm

Surprising that this thread is both 'current/contemporary'... and it's been going on for 5 years. :? :shock: :shock: 8-)
What the hey?!
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Re: Is it ethical for a library to ask for writer's share?

Post by admin » Wed Mar 07, 2018 12:51 am

Here's the deal:

This Library is a partnership between two VERY experienced and highly reputable industry veterans that have both been highly successful in placing tons of music. Most of the music in the catalog has come from a small group of composers. Big opportunities have come to them in the last year, and they needed a lot more music. Who did they call? Not Ghostbusters!

Both owners are composer/producers, so they are very sensitive to the trend of production companies taking publishing. Their way of dealing with it is to take the hit with the composers they sign. A FEW of the shows they service have asked for publishing, so this deal gives the composer and the library equal shares, so if a show's production company wants some of the publishing, the library and the composers take the hit together and equally. That's their way of showing respect for the composers.

Personally, I'm not a fan of ANY show or production company taking publishing, thereby forcing the libraries to hit composers up for writer's share, but it's becoming more and more common. And while it's easy to say, "we need to stand united against this and refuse to do business with these production companies," there will always be newer, hungrier composers who will take the deal, thus racing to the bottom.

And yes, I see it as a kickback to the shows' producers. This is nothing new in the land of music libraries. I know libraries that have had to give substantial cash kickbacks to music supes. None of this is surprising, and all of it is pretty disgusting.

Michael

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Re: Is it ethical for a library to ask for writer's share?

Post by DesireInspires » Wed Mar 07, 2018 5:43 am

ML,

Thanks for the update and reply. I am not sure if the listing company is the same company that offered me a deal a few months back. But in either case, I wouldn’t encourage this kind of deal to be signed.

I know many are saying “just sign another deal”, “the music library has to follow the trends of the market”, “well at least it’s a non-exclusive deal”, or “hungry composers are going to take the deal anyway”. All good thoughts. I’ll leave these deals for those people.

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Re: Is it ethical for a library to ask for writer's share?

Post by cassmcentee » Wed Mar 07, 2018 6:54 am

Just want to thank you for this thread!

After 30 years of working in "Hollywood" here is my take...
Network Producers tend to be Hungry Animals that will eat themselves to Death (not all, I have worked with some tremendous ones as well)
A separation from the source is the only way to humble them
The hungry animal will test every opportunity to find a way into the caged food
The best protection I had was my Union affiliation and our union/producer guidelines
Yet producers will work every angle they can to undercut the value of your work
I recently had a Producer laugh in my face re: how he and the Network were taking advantage of me
I gave them a 3 day notice and for 3 days you should have seen how they kept coming into my office crying for me to stay...
I quit and Retired

Point Being...
I'm doing my best to give back to this community
You will always hear me say, "Let's be the Best There Is"
Without having a union representing us our main strength is: "To be in Demand"
To be "In Demand" = Professional, Courteous, Timely, Talented and Thorough
To be "In Demand" = Gives you options
My dream: That our Taxi affiliation, the strength of our submissions and the help of the members, help keep ML and Taxi as "The Place To Go" for music
That's how we help ML/Taxi have strong legs
I understand that we all chase down every avenue with our music as we should, BUT...
If this downward spiral becomes a black hole (isn't it already?)
It might be smart for us to pull back a little tighter into the Taxi fold
Give ML some Popeye Biceps
Some semblance of a Union?
Just rambling now...
It's a dream with reality mixed in! :D
Robert "Cass" McEntee
"Making music on a spinning ball of Magma"
https://soundcloud.com/robert-cass-mcentee
https://www.taxi.com/members/DosPalmasRecordings

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