Making significant $ with film/TV music

[Casey H]

Dec 5, 2008, 8:05am, anne wrote:TV/FILM music in easy bullet point form:it is a long term game, you need a 5 year planThe point that the successful film/TV music writers will tell you is it's a numbers game. If one compares the cost of something like taxi, to the income from just a few placements, they aren't seeing the real picture.Perfect bullet summary!

[zircon]

In the last 4 years I'd estimate I've made $20,000 from music licensing. If you add in CD sales and custom music jobs as well as tangential areas (sound design, mastering) the number goes up to around $32k. I started producing music when I was 16 - I'm currently 21. Barely any of that money is from royalties. I have around 30-40 tracks actually floating around in libraries (including sites like *8COMPANY NAME WITHHELDx) but have not yet received any money from ASCAP, so most of that is buyout, WFH, custom licenses, etc. Keep in mind that this has all been done while I've been a full time student... and a chunk of my musical output is for purely "fun"/volunteer projects that aren't monetized.2008 is when I started seeing some actual sync fees through libraries that weren't buyout, which was nice. But I think it's a bit of a crapshoot to rely on that kind of thing, at least without a very large catalog as has been stated earlier, so I'm focusing more on things I can get money for up front.

[daveleopard]

My problem seems to be in writing enough quality songs in a short time period. I don't think I could ever write 100 or even 50 songs in a year. I obsess too much on a song and wind up spending weeks tweaking it.

[flyingtadpole]

Dec 23, 2008, 2:03pm, daveleopard wrote:I don't think I could ever write 100 or even 50 songs in a year. Try going with one of the very supportive "target" groups (non-commercial, socail, free, no transfer of rights). 14 songs in 28 days at February Album Writing Month (fawm.org). Just Plain Folks. 50 songs in 90 days. So what if half of what you do in those semi-public pressure cookers is a dog? it'll pick your productivity up dramatically. And they're a lot of fun. And you'll find some very good songwriters on them.

[davewalton]

Dec 23, 2008, 2:03pm, daveleopard wrote:My problem seems to be in writing enough quality songs in a short time period. I don't think I could ever write 100 or even 50 songs in a year. I obsess too much on a song and wind up spending weeks tweaking it.Better to write a small quantity of quality songs than a large quantity of average songs. As for tweaking a song to death... probably a common ailement... it's something I struggle with too.Passing a track along to the forum or to other music friends (who's opinions you trust) can help in that process. If they give it the thumbs up... then move on to the next track. There's always time to apply that cool idea tweak to the next track.

[bassman]

Well said Dave. Much better to write 2 great tracks than 20 average.5 years ago I wrote 2 library tracks. They're still beingused all over the world. Because of those 2 tracks I can sit backand do nothing for a year if I wanted to.

[Mark Kaufman]

Hmmm....I agree with the point, but...There is also a lot to be said for volume, especially if a "good" track takes weeks and weeks... In some cases it's probably a better idea to focus on output than on perfecting only a few tunes. The more you write, the better you write...and chances are your songs will improve as you continue to generate music. Sometimes the dissatisfied editor inside of us can cause us to lose a whole lotta potential for productivity. Sometimes it comes down to that "all your eggs in one basket" thing.Obviously one great piece is better than ten mediocre pieces. But maybe the more prolific you become, the better your chances of having ten great pieces.

[jaredjones]

I'm Jared Jones, soon to be new member of Taxi, and owner of my own music publishing and licensing label. Oh yeah, songwriter obviously. My producer/co-owner and I focus primarily on the R&B/Pop genre. In the last few years, it has been, and remains a goal to get major cuts with major artists. I've written for a Uk artist who's release should be out this year, and will continue writing for other UK artists. But as far as money goes...music licensing is where it's at. A lot of my peers in the R&B realm are only focused on major album cuts, and don't realize how lucrative music licensing can be.So my producer and I's main focus now, is music licensing. We are blessed to both own personal studios where we can write, record, mix, and master within a day. Currently, we license through a third party music licensor, *COMPANY NAME WITHHELD*, in New York. I've received two placements from them and have received ASCAP royalties. After running a few numbers based on the number of songs I had placed, compared with the number of songs I had available within that time, 2 out of every 7 songs I submit will be placed. Based on this math, and the money I make from that agreement (25% writers share, no upfront money unless it's a commercial or non-national broadcast), we will need to place 250 songs in order to make six-figures. Doable, absolutely, but over time. So we continue to expand our outlets, because remember, that is just for *COMPANY NAME WITHHELD*. We also license through *COMPANY NAME WITHHELD*, and direct licensing (which takes the most work). With the addition of Taxi, we could definitely see six figures every year, within the next three or four years. But it takes writing everyday, and turning everything into a song.I am not the type of person to write, and not try and get it placed. I won't even take the time to write it if I know it won't be good. So you have to find a formula that works for you. The first song I had placed on CBS's "The Young and The Restless". That song was recorded in my college dorm when I was 19. (I'm turning 23 this Feb 14). My main formula is have my producer compose a hot track, and write the lyrics and melody. Every now and again, like yesterday, I will come up with a lyric idea, melody, and leave it on his voice mail, and he will compose the track before I get out of work. So like I said, I'm blessed. I understand that most people don't have the quick turnaround ability as I do, but like Mark Kaufman says above this post...build a volume of songs. Don't sit and critique it..let others do that. Eventually, you will realize just how many songs you can create, pitch, and get placed.Remember how many times the Beatles were passed by record labels...same deal with songs. Every song has a home, even if you think it sucks. And yeah, it may take some more work to make it a great song. But don't try to write a great song...just let it happen. How? Just write what you love to write about. Don't make this seem like work. Just write, record, get it mixed, mastered (find someone to do a collection of songs for cheap, or learn how to do it yourself), and place. That's the formula. And do it until you can leave your day job.I said I'm 23 this coming Saturday...I will be making six-figures by 28. Not because I'm good, but because I won't stop until it happens. God Bless You. I hope to talk to many of you soon, and be a regular poster.- Jared Jones

[jude3]

I guess I can't keep silent any longer.I am temped to look up my very first posts on this forum. I asked very similar questions. And I drilled people like Matto pretty hard. Sometimes to the point where they did not like me. (He still ignores me at the road ralley) But I too wanted to make sure there was money before I put my time in. I'm too old to waste my time.This July will be the start of my third year with Taxi of my 10 year goal. The goal is to make at least a part time living off music, in particular royalties. I was in the music business years ago but just recently got back in.Well, after two years, I signed my 5th or 6th (forget which) contract with a music library today. Three of them are huge. One has my music placed and I should see good money from it. Like about $6000. I think the biggest and most important advice came from Matto. It takes time and you better have a long range plan and you better work at it every day or at least every week no excuses.I accused Matto of being lucky. Well, after two years of doing it myself I will say I MIGHT be wrong. hahaha yeah, might be, because I still think there is some involved. But, you darn sure aint gonna get anywhere if you dont do it on a daily basis. It has to be your job in order to get paid. If it aint your job then you aint gonna get paid. Simple as that!As for money, I made some. Not very much but more is coming. Royalties take forever to come in. Once you make contact with the bigger libraries you know it's coming. And once you make contact you get to keep filling those libraries with your music. So I am sure it is a matter of time. And yes, some luck.Enough of my rambling. Hope I helped someone. People here helped me so I want to pass it on if I can.Thanks Mazz, Matto and Dave.

[Casey H]

Jun 29, 2009, 1:15pm, jude3 wrote:I guess I can't keep silent any longer.I am temped to look up my very first posts on this forum. I asked very similar questions. And I drilled people like Matto pretty hard. Sometimes to the point where they did not like me. (He still ignores me at the road ralley) But I too wanted to make sure there was money before I put my time in. I'm too old to waste my time.This July will be the start of my third year with Taxi of my 10 year goal. The goal is to make at least a part time living off music, in particular royalties. I was in the music business years ago but just recently got back in.Well, after two years, I signed my 5th or 6th (forget which) contract with a music library today. Three of them are huge. One has my music placed and I should see good money from it. Like about $6000. I think the biggest and most important advice came from Matto. It takes time and you better have a long range plan and you better work at it every day or at least every week no excuses.I accused Matto of being lucky. Well, after two years of doing it myself I will say I MIGHT be wrong. hahaha yeah, might be, because I still think there is some involved. But, you darn sure aint gonna get anywhere if you dont do it on a daily basis. It has to be your job in order to get paid. If it aint your job then you aint gonna get paid. Simple as that!As for money, I made some. Not very much but more is coming. Royalties take forever to come in. Once you make contact with the bigger libraries you know it's coming. And once you make contact you get to keep filling those libraries with your music. So I am sure it is a matter of time. And yes, some luck.Enough of my rambling. Hope I helped someone. People here helped me so I want to pass it on if I can.Thanks Mazz, Matto and Dave.Hey Jude This is awesome to read! I hope you'll let taxi know about your placements too. We are very lucky to have people like matto, dave , mazz, vikki, and others who offer so much help and advice. That's one of the reasons I think this is the best music forum out there. Congrats on the placements!! I hope to see you at the rally in November! Casey