Making significant $ with film/TV music

[Casey H]

, there maybe a disconnect between the editors and consumers on what is cool to them

There's usually way more of a disconnect between struggling Taxi members and what the consumer thinks is cool.

Agree. Keep in mind that TV show producers, music sups, editors, etc. are VERY in-tune (no pun) with ratings, demographics of their show, etc. Their livelihoods depend on it.

[SubRivers]

I like the idea of "fine art" music being used to underscore reality tv shows - it would be fun

[boinkeee2000]

, there maybe a disconnect between the editors and consumers on what is cool to them

There's usually way more of a disconnect between struggling Taxi members and what the consumer thinks is cool.

Well, I could barely hear my music on most reality TV placements (drowns out my amazing modal runs lol), and the viewers could care less. wearing the "artist" hat for KUWTK or pawn stars is imho a waste of time & effort, save those gems for spotify. or the big excl PMA libs ..

[Casey H]

, there maybe a disconnect between the editors and consumers on what is cool to them

There's usually way more of a disconnect between struggling Taxi members and what the consumer thinks is cool.

Well, I could barely hear my music on most reality TV placements (drowns out my amazing modal runs lol), and the viewers could care less. wearing the "artist" hat for KUWTK or pawn stars is imho a waste of time & effort, save those gems for spotify. or the big excl PMA libs ..

I think the point is that to get your track to the point where a sup will even consider burying it way below dialogue in a scene, it has to get the interest of that sup and in many cases has to feel like what the demographic would want. That doesn't mean it's a work of art, just that is sounds cool and contemporary to their ears. There are exceptions, some mood setting tracks are fairly ageless.

What I've learned over the years is the fact that my track will end up barely audible is meaningless as far as getting to the point where it will even be considered. A lot of times, the editor isn't sure how they'll use it until final editing. I have many songs in that very selective, Taxi friendly "critical" library. Getting it into the library requires a lot of work-- song, production, lyrics, etc. Any of those things being problematic, it won't be accepted. But on a number of my actual placements, I had to watch the show twice at high volume to even find my song in there. That's the way it is. Meet the bar to be in the game or sit on the sidelines.

[boinkeee2000]

There's usually way more of a disconnect between struggling Taxi members and what the consumer thinks is cool.

Well, I could barely hear my music on most reality TV placements (drowns out my amazing modal runs lol), and the viewers could care less. wearing the "artist" hat for KUWTK or pawn stars is imho a waste of time & effort, save those gems for spotify. or the big excl PMA libs ..

I think the point is that to get your track to the point where a sup will even consider burying it way below dialogue in a scene, it has to get the interest of that sup and in many cases has to feel like what the demographic would want. That doesn't mean it's a work of art, just that is sounds cool and contemporary to their ears. There are exceptions, some mood setting tracks are fairly ageless.

What I've learned over the years is the fact that my track will end up barely audible is meaningless as far as getting to the point where it will even be considered. A lot of times, the editor isn't sure how they'll use it until final editing. I have many songs in that very selective, Taxi friendly "critical" library. Getting it into the library requires a lot of work-- song, production, lyrics, etc. Any of those things being problematic, it won't be accepted. But on a number of my actual placements, I had to watch the show twice at high volume to even find my song in there. That's the way it is. Meet the bar to be in the game or sit on the sidelines.

You're preaching to the choir Casey. I was addressing suprblondes "disconnect" comment and not related to the topic. if i remove my sarcasm this was my point . . . if you're not happy with taxi screeners, then go straight to the libs and see how you fare, and if you think you can serve the consumers better music than current editors, then take their job and see how you fare. . . and im not being facetious to anyone that truly believes the screeners are hampering their progress. I will not pass judgement on folks who feel this way nor assume they are all beginners or misinformed, cause not all are. I've met a few folks who's done really well on their own, albeit the majority just end up rage quitting

[cosmicdolphin]

if you're not happy with taxi screeners, then go straight to the libs and see how you fare

Precisely ! ...They may not be quite so prescriptive as the Screeners but the bar is just as high..or higher sometimes.

and if you think you can serve the consumers better music than current editors, then take their job and see how you fare. .

That would be funny to see how the viewing figures fared

I've met a few folks who's done really well on their own,

Yeah I know a few too but they're over the bar from the get go usually and they have a service mindset as opposed to an artist ego

albeit the majority just end up rage quitting

True fact, my first Production Music album for a Taxi friendly Library was called Rage Quit

[ToddB]

I often see questions on the forum like: How much did you make for that placement? Can a person make significant (5 figures) money in film/TV? Can a person make a full time living with film/TV music? ...and so on...These questions have been answered on many threads and a video by Matto, but it would be great to have some of the following in one place. Members like Matto, Hummingbird, Dave, Mazz and others have given info like the following elsewhere. I welcome their suggested edits to what follows- maybe a 'sticky' can come out of this First, this doesn't include custom composing. For this, I am speaking only of tracks forwarded to music libraries. Second, I am simply repeating what I've learned from others such as the names I mentioned above. Those folks are either earning good money or on a targeted 5 year plan toward that. I am not in that category- not prolific enough. Here goes...It takes as much as 5 years (can be more) to start bringing in significant money- by significant I mean the kind that could lead you to a true career path. There is no instant lottery ticket here. You shouldn't start comparing the money spent with taxi, or any other lead source for that matter, against short term financial gain.It's a volume game. You have to be very prolific, cranking out dozens of broadcast quality tracks. Instrumentals do much better- there is a large demand for background music. Words get in the way sometimes. Not that 'songs' don't get placed, but instrumentals outnumber vocals by a huge margin. You need to work toward having a VERY large number of tracks in music libraries, working for you (e.g. being pitched). By large, I mean 100, 150 or more within those first 5 years. Every track in a library increases the odds that there will be a placement. You have to keep feeding the pipeline, by submitting as much on-target material as possible. It's a continual process. If you learn to nail what is "on-target" you can get efficient at it.With a large volume in libraries, actual placements can start- but from the time a track gets into a library until it might be placed could be anywhere from (ballpark) 6 months to 5 years. Placements bring in some license fee revenue but the "back-end" performance royalties (from PRO's such as ASCAP, BMI, etc. - TV placements) can add up to much more. However, PRO payments lag behind broadcasts by 6-9 months domestically and 1-2 years internationally. And since you get paid each time a show is broadcast, as shows are re-run over the years that follow the initial broadcast, more comes in. That's a slow process. Your PRO earnings from a single TV placement might peak years from initial placement. So if you create and maintain a large pipeline of tracks going into libraries, a steady flow of revenue can be significant a few years later. NOT to any time scale but on the over-simplified time line below, the L's represent tracks put in libraries, the P's actual placements, and the $'s some revenue from P's. Picture a repeat of this over and over- more L's, P's, $'s...LLLLLLLLLLLL--------------------P1---------------- P2------------------P3-------------------------------------------------$p1-------------------$p1$p2----------------$p1$p2$p3...Although I left out custom composing, often when you are successful with a library, there is an opportunity with them for custom work which brings in more revenue.I hope this provides some answers regarding making "real" money with film/TV tracks. Once again, I welcome comments and corrections- I am not the foremost expert here. My goal would be to create a decent 'sticky' in this Music Biz section. Casey

This is great info. Thanks Casey!

[cosmicdolphin]

We should start a new thread...... " Making Insignificant £ with film/TV Music "

[Casey H]

We should start a new thread...... " Making Insignificant £ with film/TV Music "

Hey! I lose money on every song but I make it up in volume!

[smelterbox]

I appreciate the frankness of all who are on here. I'm very much new to writing and composing and still hoping for my first forward.

That said, the encouragement I see here and the response from just the few posts I've made have been very helpful. So, thank you to all.