Mastering ears? (for FUNK)

[JonathanE]

I think your biggest issue is a lack of low end in the track - I can barely hear the kick for example ( which might be a mix issue rather than mastering )

Best advice is to A/B it with a good reference track using a proper plugin like Metric A/B ..then listen carefully to each element as you go between your track and the reference...you should very quickly spot any major differences

Do you think the low end issue is better now? Thanks a lot for your help https://s.disco.ac/lmiyqnerrfnp

Yes low end is coming across much better now. Other things are still jumping out of the mix though as Paulie mentions horns etc. Try listening to the mix in Mono on crappy speaker if you can..they will jump out even more and you can adjust

Ah ok, great idea Mark, I've never heard of that... will do Thanks!

[Telefunkin]

Yes low end is coming across much better now. Other things are still jumping out of the mix though as Paulie mentions horns etc. Try listening to the mix in Mono on crappy speaker if you can..they will jump out even more and you can adjust

Ah ok, great idea Mark, I've never heard of that... will do Thanks!

Its a common thing to have some 'grot' monitors for comparison. Popular ones are Auratones or Avantone clones of them. If you don't want to buy any more speakers you could try listening on headphones or earbuds (surprisingly revealing), or use a plugin like Mixchecker...
https://www.pluginboutique.com/product/ ... hecker-Pro
Its a bit of a compromise because you're still hearing things through your own speakers, but it can help you adjust your mix to translate well across a range of listening situations.
I also like the visual feedback from Izotope's Tonal Balance....
https://www.izotope.com/en/products/ton ... rol-2.html

[Paulie]

I agree with Dolphin, mix is better but could still use some tweaking. Like that you fixed the intro as well Might want to add a touch of reverb to the flute and the alto sax fall riff... they are dry, which isnt bad, it's really a taste thing and I'd prefer to hear just a little more room reverb. Also, the funky guitar riff is pretty aggressive and might need to come down in some sections For every phrase, every four bars, figure out which instrument is the main focus, then lower other busy instruments so they get out of the way of that focus point.

Good work!

[JonathanE]

Yes low end is coming across much better now. Other things are still jumping out of the mix though as Paulie mentions horns etc. Try listening to the mix in Mono on crappy speaker if you can..they will jump out even more and you can adjust

Ah ok, great idea Mark, I've never heard of that... will do Thanks!

Its a common thing to have some 'grot' monitors for comparison. Popular ones are Auratones or Avantone clones of them. If you don't want to buy any more speakers you could try listening on headphones or earbuds (surprisingly revealing), or use a plugin like Mixchecker...
https://www.pluginboutique.com/product/ ... hecker-Pro
Its a bit of a compromise because you're still hearing things through your own speakers, but it can help you adjust your mix to translate well across a range of listening situations.
I also like the visual feedback from Izotope's Tonal Balance....
https://www.izotope.com/en/products/ton ... rol-2.html

Cool! I will check these out, sorry for the late reply, I appreciate your input.

[JonathanE]

I agree with Dolphin, mix is better but could still use some tweaking. Like that you fixed the intro as well Might want to add a touch of reverb to the flute and the alto sax fall riff... they are dry, which isnt bad, it's really a taste thing and I'd prefer to hear just a little more room reverb. Also, the funky guitar riff is pretty aggressive and might need to come down in some sections For every phrase, every four bars, figure out which instrument is the main focus, then lower other busy instruments so they get out of the way of that focus point.

Good work!

Yo Paulie! Thank you man, some great advice there, I feel you on that reverb thing, that makes a lot of sense, and good principle on which is the main focus in each section. thanks!

[JonathanE]

I think your biggest issue is a lack of low end in the track - I can barely hear the kick for example ( which might be a mix issue rather than mastering )

Best advice is to A/B it with a good reference track using a proper plugin like Metric A/B ..then listen carefully to each element as you go between your track and the reference...you should very quickly spot any major differences

Do you think the low end issue is better now? Thanks a lot for your help https://s.disco.ac/lmiyqnerrfnp

Yes low end is coming across much better now. Other things are still jumping out of the mix though as Paulie mentions horns etc. Try listening to the mix in Mono on crappy speaker if you can..they will jump out even more and you can adjust

Yo Mark!

Hey man, if you had some free time, would you mind letting me know your opinion of this new mix and master? I'd be happy to throw a coffee again your way if you have time for any thoughts. https://s.disco.ac/msxvalhggmny

-Jonathan

[cosmicdolphin]

Do you think the low end issue is better now? Thanks a lot for your help https://s.disco.ac/lmiyqnerrfnp

Yes low end is coming across much better now. Other things are still jumping out of the mix though as Paulie mentions horns etc. Try listening to the mix in Mono on crappy speaker if you can..they will jump out even more and you can adjust

Yo Mark!

Hey man, if you had some free time, would you mind letting me know your opinion of this new mix and master? I'd be happy to throw a coffee again your way if you have time for any thoughts. https://s.disco.ac/msxvalhggmny

-Jonathan

Sure, can you sen me a link to a Wav quality version ? PM me if you need to

[JonathanE]

Yes low end is coming across much better now. Other things are still jumping out of the mix though as Paulie mentions horns etc. Try listening to the mix in Mono on crappy speaker if you can..they will jump out even more and you can adjust

Yo Mark!

Hey man, if you had some free time, would you mind letting me know your opinion of this new mix and master? I'd be happy to throw a coffee again your way if you have time for any thoughts. https://s.disco.ac/msxvalhggmny

-Jonathan

Sure, can you sen me a link to a Wav quality version ? PM me if you need to

Thanks a lot Mark, it should be WAV file now: https://s.disco.ac/msxvalhggmny

[cosmicdolphin]

Thanks a lot Mark, it should be WAV file now: https://s.disco.ac/msxvalhggmny

Cheers that's better fidelity

Overall I'm hearing quite a lot in the area that we try and keep a little clearer in sync as a lot these tracks end up under dialogue ..so that's the 2-5k range, theres' quite a bit of stuff piling up there and the track is coming across kinda harsh and fatiguing. Also it's not really translating that well to a smaller speaker as it feels like it has very little bass which is more of a low mid thing.

If I look at it using Izotope's Tonal Balance Control plugin ( I used the R&B average curve as there is no Funk option but they are all fairly similar ) you can see that what I hear is confirmed by the EQ curve of the overall track. A peak in the 2-4k region right where you don't want it and a recessed low / low mid range which is why the bass doesn't translate that well on smaller speakers.



img images

The 2- 4k peak is partly an arrangemnt issue as a lot of stuff plays all at once and at times it's like being in a room with five people who are all trying to talk at once instead of taking it in turns. Sometimes you do a good job of keeping the focus on the main thing but then other times there is just too much all going on in the same frequency range so think about maybe culling it some more and having more of a call / response vibe so each thing takes it's turn to step into the spotlight.

The brass comes over too loud, so reigning in a bit should help..try dropping it a couple of DB and gently eq-ing some of the piercing top end off it might help as well if you try a low pass filter and bring the cutoff down until the brass sits in a bit more. Same with the lead guitar part, it's kinda jumping out at me. instead of being nestled comfortably into the track.

The low mid, you can probably get away with some master EQ to pull it back up so we get some better translation and lose some of the scooped kinda sound which makes it lack solidity.

Drums actually have too much bass in places, the Toms are very boomy - I would try a surgical cut on them with a fairly narrow Q to see if you can notch the worst of it out..try around 100hz. It would probably be worth trying to cut some of the muddiness out of the drum buss as well in that 400-500hz range and it might make more room for us to hear the bass more easily.

I'm also getting an overall sense of too much compression - the whole thing sounds kinda smooshed together , so I would take a look to see how much compression / limiting is being applied on the master buss. Or perhaps it's just an accumulation from many sources but either way see if you can let the whole thing breathe a bit more. Some of that overcompressed vibe comes from the hi hats , it sounds like they may be running through whatever compression you've applied to the drums and they are suffereing because of this. If possible I would try to route the hats so they receive as little compression as possible and also high pass filter some of the lower end off them so we only get the nice shiny high stuff.

If I was just mastering and appying a corrective EQ it might look a little like this...try experimenting with this first so you can A/B before and after but a lot of it is better tackled at source once you know what you are listening for.


img images

Hope that helps

Mark

[JonathanE]

Thanks a lot Mark, it should be WAV file now: https://s.disco.ac/msxvalhggmny

Cheers that's better fidelity

Overall I'm hearing quite a lot in the area that we try and keep a little clearer in sync as a lot these tracks end up under dialogue ..so that's the 2-5k range, theres' quite a bit of stuff piling up there and the track is coming across kinda harsh and fatiguing. Also it's not really translating that well to a smaller speaker as it feels like it has very little bass which is more of a low mid thing.

If I look at it using Izotope's Tonal Balance Control plugin ( I used the R&B average curve as there is no Funk option but they are all fairly similar ) you can see that what I hear is confirmed by the EQ curve of the overall track. A peak in the 2-4k region right where you don't want it and a recessed low / low mid range which is why the bass doesn't translate that well on smaller speakers.



img images

The 2- 4k peak is partly an arrangemnt issue as a lot of stuff plays all at once and at times it's like being in a room with five people who are all trying to talk at once instead of taking it in turns. Sometimes you do a good job of keeping the focus on the main thing but then other times there is just too much all going on in the same frequency range so think about maybe culling it some more and having more of a call / response vibe so each thing takes it's turn to step into the spotlight.

The brass comes over too loud, so reigning in a bit should help..try dropping it a couple of DB and gently eq-ing some of the piercing top end off it might help as well if you try a low pass filter and bring the cutoff down until the brass sits in a bit more. Same with the lead guitar part, it's kinda jumping out at me. instead of being nestled comfortably into the track.

The low mid, you can probably get away with some master EQ to pull it back up so we get some better translation and lose some of the scooped kinda sound which makes it lack solidity.

Drums actually have too much bass in places, the Toms are very boomy - I would try a surgical cut on them with a fairly narrow Q to see if you can notch the worst of it out..try around 100hz. It would probably be worth trying to cut some of the muddiness out of the drum buss as well in that 400-500hz range and it might make more room for us to hear the bass more easily.

I'm also getting an overall sense of too much compression - the whole thing sounds kinda smooshed together , so I would take a look to see how much compression / limiting is being applied on the master buss. Or perhaps it's just an accumulation from many sources but either way see if you can let the whole thing breathe a bit more. Some of that overcompressed vibe comes from the hi hats , it sounds like they may be running through whatever compression you've applied to the drums and they are suffereing because of this. If possible I would try to route the hats so they receive as little compression as possible and also high pass filter some of the lower end off them so we only get the nice shiny high stuff.

If I was just mastering and appying a corrective EQ it might look a little like this...try experimenting with this first so you can A/B before and after but a lot of it is better tackled at source once you know what you are listening for.


img images

Hope that helps

Mark

Wow, thanks for the in depth critique Mark, really appreciate it. I had actually left this track for quite a while cuz I've had more difficulty with this one than any other tracks I've been working on. All of what you're saying makes sense. I think I'll get back into this one more slowly. I didn't have the extra cash at the time to purchase the software you guys had mentioned and I didn't really understand the tonal balance thing although I think I do better now.

I will slowly give what you say here a try, i think I understand most of it. Cheers Mark, these tracks with large amounts of instruments are a lot more challenging for newbs