ProTools/Logic vs Cubase etc -

[georginasaint]

Hi all, I had an "interesting" email today from a hit songwriter but I won't say his name. He lives in my town so I asked him some recording advise. He said that Protools is the industry standard and anything else (other than perhaps Logic) is for hobbyists. Is this right? Anyone know of any websites that compare DAWs performance etc? I do know that most recording studios have ProTools. I have Cubase - does that make me a rank amateur?? I have nothing to compare it with. I spoke to a recording engineer who said I could take my Cubase tracks in as WAV files and he could put them into Protools - is this right? Will they line up and all be in time???This songwriter is not a nice person, I have to say, sadly. SO full of himself. He disturbed me. I'm glad he's not a Taxi member. I've had a strange day, what with his email and my next door neighbor being arrested (hurrah!) that's a whole other story. Georgie

[Mark Kaufman]

If you want good advice on a recording system, don't ask a hit songwriter, ask an engineer.If you want good advice on writing hit songs, now you can ask the engineer to leave the room for a moment. Of course, that engineer might still have great advice on that as well...Industry standard does not mean better, it means more prevalent. ProTools is like Microsoft Windows or Coca-Cola...it commands the market, but that doesn't mean the other brands are worse. All the DAWs have their strengths and weaknesses, and there are many that do some things in easier ways than in ProTools. But whatever you use, you can always convert your tracks for use in a ProTools studio. With every passing year, all the DAWs get better and better. In a few more years, converting all your tracks to WAV files will probably be a quick as burning a CD. Find a DAW you like and learn it well.Oh, by the way, I read a post from a veteran producer the other day on Gearslutz who said in passing that even though "most studios use either ProTools or Cubase", the other DAWs are also great too... (I like Cubase too.)

[hummingbird]

Sept 18, 2008, 1:30pm, georginasaint wrote:Hi all, I had an "interesting" email today from a hit songwriter but I won't say his name. He lives in my town so I asked him some recording advise. He said that Protools is the industry standard and anything else (other than perhaps Logic) is for hobbyists. Is this right? Anyone know of any websites that compare DAWs performance etc? I do know that most recording studios have ProTools. I have Cubase - does that make me a rank amateur?? I have nothing to compare it with. I spoke to a recording engineer who said I could take my Cubase tracks in as WAV files and he could put them into Protools - is this right? Will they line up and all be in time???This songwriter is not a nice person, I have to say, sadly. SO full of himself. He disturbed me. I'm glad he's not a Taxi member. I've had a strange day, what with his email and my next door neighbor being arrested (hurrah!) that's a whole other story. GeorgieI think you already answered your own question. Your instincts tell you this guy's a jerk. So why would you listen to anything he says? I know professional composers who use Logic, Sonar, CuBase, ProTools, Digital Performer... and I myself use MacKie's Tracktion. We all get forwards and have signed deals with publishers & libraries. It's not the tool, it's having the skill & knowledge to use it. And let's just add this - whether you have ProTools or not, it all starts with the composition - the craft of songwriting. Having ProTools will not make a so-so-song great.This kinda reminds me of when I first started thinking about moving to the Island. I went to the largest music school here and had an interview with the person in charge of the voice department. She was not interested in hiring me, and she also told me that competition was fierce and the only way I'd get any students was to go out into the suburbs. More fool me, I believed her & resigned myself to the idea that I couldn't make a go of it here. But later I had the chance to share a space for awhile, so I put an ad in the local weekly for one month to see if I could get a couple students. Well... I had to pull it after 2 or 3 weeks because I had so many replies! I haven't run an ad in any paper here for years - and my studio is chock full and I have a waiting list. In other words, don't buy the hype.

[matto]

Sept 18, 2008, 1:30pm, georginasaint wrote:I have Cubase - does that make me a rank amateur?? Haha...it puts you in the same boat as that "rank amateur" Hans Zimmer, among many others. I write music for a living and happen to use Cubase. I'm sure I could also make a living using Logic, or Sonar or DP...or even ProTools (but who wants to suffer... ).ProTools IS the standard for *recording* in professional studios (largely for historical reasons btw), but there is no professional standard for composing, and most professional composers use something other than ProTools to *compose* on.Don't listen to this fool...go write some music! matto

[georginasaint]

Awh, very interesting stuff you guys can't wait to meet you all at the Rally!Yes you've given me good info there and confirmed my thoughts on what this guy said! I stick to my Cubase.Many thanks!Georgie

[crystallions]

The same happened to me a couple of weeks ago. I contacted a composer in LA who writes for some major TV shows and asked if he would have time to talk and give me some advice. He said yes. We talked for a while on the phone and then he asked what program I use when I compose. I said DP. He laughed and then told me that I will never get a job scoring films if I use DP - "the standard that everybody uses is Logic!!!" He said some other things that were kind of rude (such as I don't have the right to call myself a composer because he is a real composer.) I really don't think most producers will care if I use DP or Logic (or something else) as long as I get the job done... No producer has cared so far...I have heard great things about Cubase. Sorry the dude was a jerk. That is why I keep being amazed at this forum. The people here are great at what they do but also nice!!! What a great combination! I talked with Michael Plowman a couple of years ago (great composer - wrote the music for Splinter Cell among other things) and he said that what's needed in the entertainment industry today are people that are talented, honest and nice. There's a bunch of those here!

[slideboardouts]

Sept 19, 2008, 7:44am, kouly wrote:I saw a funny signature somewhere that said " Pro tools is the industry standard because it takes longer to do things and engineers get paid by the hour." A tounge in cheek joke but for some it may not be. LOL I about lost my drink reading that line! I'm definitely using that quote the next chance I get. Awesome.-Steve

[gunter]

Sept 18, 2008, 2:35pm, matto wrote:Sept 18, 2008, 1:30pm, georginasaint wrote:I have Cubase - does that make me a rank amateur?? Haha...it puts you in the same boat as that "rank amateur" Hans Zimmer, among many others. I write music for a living and happen to use Cubase. I'm sure I could also make a living using Logic, or Sonar or DP...or even ProTools (but who wants to suffer... ).ProTools IS the standard for *recording* in professional studios (largely for historical reasons btw), but there is no professional standard for composing, and most professional composers use something other than ProTools to *compose* on.Don't listen to this fool...go write some music! mattoThe order of priorities is: Talented Performers with good material first, competent engineering skills a distant second, expensive outboard gear third and the choice of DAW dead last. But if someone wants to spend every 2-3 years a fortune and also 40% more for every Plug-In - ProTools is the way to go! Why every 2 or 3 years to spend a fortune? Because the computer industry changes the format every couple of years, and it's just not worth it. Apple has had NuBus, PCI, PCI 3 & 5, PCI on G5s, PCI-X, and PCI express on MacPro. Every time your PT cards got left behind! No thank you Digidesign/Gates/Jobs! That's why I see Pro Tools LE as a pitfall! IMHO - The best thing to get is Cubase, Performer or Logic and a powerful PC or Mac.Although Performer is heading to south. Unfortunately...Those are the most used other DAW's and this is important if you stuck and need help.

[slideboardouts]

Sept 19, 2008, 10:45am, gunter wrote:Sept 18, 2008, 2:35pm, matto wrote:Haha...it puts you in the same boat as that "rank amateur" Hans Zimmer, among many others. I write music for a living and happen to use Cubase. I'm sure I could also make a living using Logic, or Sonar or DP...or even ProTools (but who wants to suffer... ).ProTools IS the standard for *recording* in professional studios (largely for historical reasons btw), but there is no professional standard for composing, and most professional composers use something other than ProTools to *compose* on.Don't listen to this fool...go write some music! mattoSo Matto that means you're an amateur! Chuckle, chuckle... Sorry but I had some Migro Ravioli today! The order of priorities is: Talented Performers with good material first, competent engineering skills a distant second, expensive outboard gear third and the choice of DAW dead last. But if someone wants to spend every 2-3 years a fortune and also 40% more for every Plug-In - ProTools is the way to go! Why every 2 or 3 years to spend a fortune? Because the computer industry changes the format every couple of years, and it's just not worth it. Apple has had NuBus, PCI, PCI 3 & 5, PCI on G5s, PCI-X, and PCI express on MacPro. Every time your PT cards got left behind! No thank you Digidesign/Gates/Jobs! That's why I see Pro Tools LE as a pitfall! IMHO - The best thing to get is Cubase, Performer or Logic and a powerful PC or Mac.Although Performer is heading to south. Unfortunately...Those are the most used other DAW's and this is important if you stuck and need help. Those are my thoughts exactly on the whole protools thing. PT just doesn't make much sense for the majority of composers. Its overpriced and its features (or lack there of) are just blah.I recently got Logic, and as a composer, for $500 I really can't see why anyone would get a different DAW (assuming you are mac based of course). PT just can't compete with it.-Steve

[slideboardouts]

Sept 19, 2008, 2:06pm, daniel481 wrote:"Those are my thoughts exactly on the whole protools thing. PT just doesn't make much sense for the majority of composers. Its overpriced and its features (or lack there of) are just blah."Stuff like that is silly to say, too. I use PT everyday to compose (on some pretty major projects!) and I love it. I know many other successful composers who do the same. It costs a bit more, but not really that much in the scheme of things. I also use Logic, and I love that, too. If I had to use Cubase or DP, I'd also figure that out. So, like other people have said, it just doesn't matter. Just make good music, and who cares!DanNot saying that PT can't be used for composing or that its not a good DAW. I think it is a fine DAW. All I was really saying is that compared to what other DAW's offer for the price, PT isn't all that attractive...especially for a composer on a budget. I haven't used the newest version of PT so maybe a lot has changed. But when I was first looking at DAWs to purchase, PT just didn't do enough and I wasn't a big fan of being locked into using their hardware. There is really only one thing about working in PT that always bothers me...whenever bouncing a track (say its 3:30), you have to sit there and listen to all 3:30 in real time while its exporting . Have they changed that? Or is there at least an option? -Steve