Classic Rock Cues (D210801CR)

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irthlingz
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Classic Rock Cues (D210801CR)

Post by irthlingz » Sun Jul 11, 2021 7:02 pm

Three classic rock cues.

Question on first two: Could both get forwarded for the same listing, or are they too much alike?

On the third one ("Rockmee"): Is it too "busy" in places (e.g. high guitar starting at 0:16), possibly interfering with dialogue? Or is it far enough back in the mix that it won't be a problem?

Any and all other feedback is very welcome!

Please click here to listen, thank you!

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Re: Classic Rock Cues (D210801CR)

Post by AlanHall » Mon Jul 12, 2021 9:44 am

Hi Irthlingz,
I like what you did here, and I'd hazard a guess that the first two cues are different enough that a library might want them both.
I agree that the third track has a problem with the lead lines; the listing specifically calls that out. A different kind of melody there is probably best.

I'm gonna call these tracks veering off from the listing requirements, though. I hear more 'Cars' than 'Kiss', so more of a New Wave / Alt Rock vibe to me. That's my opinion, but it's a strong one :lol:

And the production needs more work: the instruments don't come across as being in any kind of "real" space, room reverb (not a guitar spring reverb!) and some HF rolloff would go a ways to making the track gel and become believable as a band performance. If your DAW has some convo reverbs, experiment with them. Hope that helps!

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Re: Classic Rock Cues (D210801CR)

Post by irthlingz » Mon Jul 12, 2021 10:54 am

Really appreciate your input, Alan, thank you!

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Re: Classic Rock Cues (D210801CR)

Post by DBarnett » Mon Jul 12, 2021 11:51 am

AlanHall wrote:
Mon Jul 12, 2021 9:44 am
Hi Irthlingz,
I like what you did here, and I'd hazard a guess that the first two cues are different enough that a library might want them both.
I agree that the third track has a problem with the lead lines; the listing specifically calls that out. A different kind of melody there is probably best.

I'm gonna call these tracks veering off from the listing requirements, though. I hear more 'Cars' than 'Kiss', so more of a New Wave / Alt Rock vibe to me. That's my opinion, but it's a strong one :lol:

And the production needs more work: the instruments don't come across as being in any kind of "real" space, room reverb (not a guitar spring reverb!) and some HF rolloff would go a ways to making the track gel and become believable as a band performance. If your DAW has some convo reverbs, experiment with them. Hope that helps!
Hey Michael & Sharon,
I agree with Alan, these are good ideas but I don't think they're on target for this listing

If these are roughs, I think that's ok for collaborations but the recording and mixing (production) really needs to come up. Even before submitting here on the forums
Otherwise you might not get much feedback because people don't want to offend anyone, I certainly don't want to

I have gotten a lot of good advice here on the forum, some of it stung at first but it helped me get better. I hope I'm paying it forward as many have done for me

The main guitar is too loud and I can hardly hear the other instruments
Try getting a good balance, drums and bass down the middle, guitar 1 left, guitar 2 right and so on, nothing overpowering the other
Getting the drum sounds "right" is a big deal. It's one the main reasons for returns, in my experience

Watch out for clipping while recording, don't let it go in the red or even topping at 0 or just below
The DAW you are using should have some tips and tricks so I would check those out and there's a lot of tutorials on YouTube and the Taxi TV archives
I use Reaper and this is a video on recording levels I found helpful and would apply to all DAW's and interfaces https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJHm931 ... =64&t=246s
And this one for after recording https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2J9WIiJ ... =41&t=140s
You should be able to find similar tutorials for whatever DAW you are using

I hope this helps and starts you down the road to much success

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Re: Classic Rock Cues (D210801CR)

Post by irthlingz » Mon Jul 12, 2021 2:31 pm

I have gotten a lot of good advice here on the forum, some of it stung at first but it helped me get better. I hope I'm paying it forward as many have done for me
You are doing that for us, Dave, and we sincerely appreciate it!

A new version of Disturbtion attempting to implement your feedback is up at the same link as in the first post.

BTW, we tested for too hot recording levels by doing a test normalization on each item, and they could all normalize up between 13dB and 17dB, so it looks like they weren't recorded too hot.

BTW#2 We're also using Reaper, but only since last September, so still learning. Kenny's tutorials are great!

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And when you know better, do better"
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Re: Classic Rock Cues (D210801CR)

Post by DBarnett » Mon Jul 12, 2021 3:20 pm

Awesome! Yes Reaper is awesome! LOL Very customizable and yes Kenny is the man!

First: The bass and drums are still "non-existent" turn them way up
I usually work harder on the drums than anything else
What are you using for drums?

2nd: The guitar left channel is still blazing , turn it way down (I'm getting a Thin Lizzy vibe though)
I'd bring the picking clean guitar way up in the right channel, go out 100% L&R on the guitars

If you turn the guitars all the way down, get the drums (kick, snare center, toms and overheads wide) and bass (center) sounding strong and punchy and then start bringing the guitars equally L&R in until they sound balanced, like a live band in front of you

The loop splice is distracting, I'd fix that while you're in there

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Re: Classic Rock Cues (D210801CR)

Post by irthlingz » Mon Jul 12, 2021 9:37 pm

Thanks again, Dave!

Third version of Disturbtion is up, attempting to implement Dave's most recent feedback.
DBarnett wrote:
Mon Jul 12, 2021 3:20 pm
First: The bass and drums are still "non-existent" turn them way up
done
DBarnett wrote:
Mon Jul 12, 2021 3:20 pm
What are you using for drums?
RockHardLA RealDrums from Band-in-a-Box. Full disclosure - everything is RockHardLA from BIAB!
DBarnett wrote:
Mon Jul 12, 2021 3:20 pm
2nd: The guitar left channel is still blazing , turn it way down (I'm getting a Thin Lizzy vibe though)
I'd bring the picking clean guitar way up in the right channel, go out 100% L&R on the guitars
Doing what you suggested to balance by ear, we ended up with guitars more or less where they were before: clean guitar now up 8dB, left channel guitar down 10db. (Also sidechained from clean to left, so the clean guitar compresses the left channel guitar a bit more.) With bass and drums up from what they were before, maybe the balance works better now?
DBarnett wrote:
Mon Jul 12, 2021 3:20 pm
If you turn the guitars all the way down, get the drums (kick, snare center, toms and overheads wide) and bass (center) sounding strong and punchy and then start bringing the guitars equally L&R in until they sound balanced, like a live band in front of you
DBarnett wrote:
Mon Jul 12, 2021 3:20 pm
The loop splice is distracting, I'd fix that while you're in there
Assume you mean the held notes every 30 seconds or so? Those are our attempts at edit points. I guess we need to be more subtle?

Thanks again!

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And when you know better, do better"
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Re: Classic Rock Cues (D210801CR)

Post by DBarnett » Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:13 am

Way better! Good starting balance

I would bump the left guitar up 1 db :) whatever feels right to you, now

All the instruments are BIAB?

I would add a 4 beat intro, drum roll or guitar lick or bass. Something for an editor to work with

So now you need to layer in some other instruments, as is, it would be tagged as repetitive
Right now it's a "Bed Mix" which is good, that will be an alt version

Maybe a piano melody, light on the melody, just enough to give it some interest after the first 8 bars
Generally it needs to change up every 8 bars, add or subtract instrumentation
You might be able to subtract one the guitars at some point or alternate the subtraction (whatever makes musical sense)

The edit points are kind of abrupt but for the most part they work, the one at :30 sec doesn't sound "natural"

I don't think this tune is on target for the listing
IMO 70's Party Rock / Rebel Rock is what the references make me think of

Taxi TV's Quarantini Happy Hour is discussing instrumental cues and how to build them tonight at 4 PDT

Keep going and HAVE FUN!! ALL NIGHT LONNNNNNGGGGGGG!!

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Re: Classic Rock Cues (D210801CR)

Post by irthlingz » Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:39 am

All the instruments are BIAB?
Yup!

And again, many thanks, Dave!

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Re: Classic Rock Cues (D210801CR)

Post by irthlingz » Fri Jul 23, 2021 11:52 pm

New version trying to implement Dave's much appreciated input ---> Disturbtion
DBarnett wrote:
Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:13 am
I would add a 4 beat intro, drum roll or guitar lick or bass. Something for an editor to work with
Added 4 beats bass and drums together.
DBarnett wrote:
Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:13 am
Maybe a piano melody, light on the melody, just enough to give it some interest after the first 8 bars
Generally it needs to change up every 8 bars, add or subtract instrumentation
Added two pianos and a third guitar in the process of getting enough changes in.
DBarnett wrote:
Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:13 am
The edit points are kind of abrupt but for the most part they work, the one at :30 sec doesn't sound "natural"
Worked with that first edit point a bit, not sure how successfully.
DBarnett wrote:
Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:13 am
Keep going and HAVE FUN!! ALL NIGHT LONNNNNNGGGGGGG!!
YEEEEEAAAAAH!!!!!!!!!!:)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:)!!!!!!!!!!
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