Need Feedback on Return

[BradleyHagen]

Hi Folks, and Happy New Year!

I have a few returns as of late that refer to my samples and VI's as sounding "dated".... I would really like some better insight into what that means exactly, since I am using NI, EW, Spitfire, Arturia, and all of the latest and greatest sample libraries. Am I not spending enough time using MIDI cc? Am I selecting bad sounds? Are using things like saturation and tape plugins making them sound "dated" Or do I just flat out suck at this??
A couple of examples are below, and as always thank you in advance for your time!

Return #1 "STOMP AND CHEER"
https://www.taxi.com/members/DVGQpc37Tk ... ywCWq8GQVg
https://www.taxi.com/members/DVGQpc37Tk ... heer-inst-

This second track is also puzzling because the initial brief specifically asked for ONE CENTRAL MOTIF, and not a bunch of different parts to the track...... Any feedback on that would be awesome too! Thanks!
Return #2 "SIZZERUP"
https://www.taxi.com/members/DVGQpc37Tk ... vT5BmLxJiQ
https://www.taxi.com/members/DVGQpc37Tk ... w-sizzerup

[Telefunkin]

Hi,
As a suggestion that might get you more response, always copy the listing and the ref track links so we can see/hear what was being asked for.

'Dated sounds' has been discussed many, many times before and perhaps a search on the Forums would reveal those.

My general comments include....
- even the latest sample libraries include vintage sounds.
- the way we use sounds can make them sound fresh or tired.
- simply using static sounds (without articulation or automation of some sort) can make them sound uninteresting and perhaps prompt some form of criticism like 'not authentic' or 'midi driven' or perhaps even 'dated' (because more interest is expected from modern sounds).
- did you use similar sounds to the ref tracks? If you did then they should be acceptable, but if your sounds are nothing like the refs then you might ask were they a good choice?
- do you hear sounds like the ones you've used in current pop music or in current TV shows? If not, then it might be worth reconsidering your choices.
- listening to current pop music helps get our ears 'tuned' to what sounds fresh (even if its based on vintage sounds), but a lot of folk who want to sound current will say things like they don't like current music and only listen to their favorite artists from the 1970's (or whatever era). That doesn't help! .

Your first feedback mentions 'developmental arc' and vsts that 'sound off and virtual' (rather than dated). However, to me, the synth sounds that come in around 40s do sound dated.

Your second feedback again mentions development, so that seems to be an area to work on. This time it does say 'dated sounds', and my guess here is that the high synthy brass is the offender. To me that sounds dated and not really a good fit for the track (but then again without the listing I don't know what was requested, other than 'one central motif').

'One central motif' appears quite a lot in listings. My interpretation is that there should only be one motif that the track revolves around, but that doesn't mean it should be repeated throughout the whole track. It can be introduced, varied, layered, harmonised, answered, accompanied by a counter melody, dropped out, etc. Similarly, the track as a whole should still develop as it progresses, not to become some musical masterpiece, but to provide editors with options to choose from to suit development of on-screen action. A quick look at your track's display gives away that its more or less the same all the way through and with no edit points to help an editor get in/out of any varying sections.

In summary then, there's a wealth of useful info in the feedback on these two tracks that you can use to tailor your future submissions. Armed with that, have another listen to those ref tracks and take as much as you can from the comparison. Also, have a listen to the tracks that were forwarded (in the Forwards Blog) and see where you think they met the listing requirements versus your tracks. You might even rework your tracks to address the issues. It might be quite some time before suitable listings come around again for those particular tracks but its a worthwhile exercise to build in the developmental arc, edit points, and also update the vintage sounds.

I hope that helps. Good luck!

[BradleyHagen]

Thank You Telefunkin - Your feedback is always quite useful, and thank you again for your time....
On a side note......I thought that the original listing would link to the return, but I guess that 3 links are needed for each then??

[BradleyHagen]

Original Brief for #1 https://www.taxi.com/listings/D231220CP
Original Brief for #2 https://www.taxi.com/listings/S231228MZ

Thanks!

[Paulie]

Links didn't work, they just take you to the main Taxi listing page. Go to the specific brief and copy/paste all of the text here.

[BradleyHagen]

Sure thing!
Brief #1
HARD-HITTING, STOMP-CLAP ROCK INSTRUMENTALS are needed by a great Publisher with an awesome track record of really big placements in TV Commercials!

This Publisher is on the lookout for Mid-to-Up-Tempo Instrumentals that could be found on a playlist with the examples below:

"Invincible" by The Phantoms

"Glory Days" by The Federal Empire

"The Drum" by The Seige

Although the references have vocals, please submit Instrumentals only for this pitch. Some non-lyrical vocals like "ahs," "woahs," etc., are okay to include – just don't overdo them!

Please send in top-tier Stomp-Clap Rock Instrumentals bursting with hard-hitting, epic energy all the way through! Your submissions should have unforgettable hooks, engaging stomp-clap-style rhythms, and dynamic arrangements with lots of forward motion and interest. Instrumentation that's in the general stylistic wheelhouse of the references will work best (think heavy, rockin' guitars, hard-hitting drums, bass, etc.). Please be sure your production is polished, and any virtual instruments or samples you use are high-quality and not dated-sounding.

Submissions should be about 2 minutes long, give or take. Non-faded, buttoned/stinger endings will work best for this pitch. Do NOT copy the referenced material in any way, shape, or form. Use it only as a guide for tempo, tone, and overall vibe. Do NOT submit any material with unauthorized samples of any other artists’ music, sounds, or any other form of media. Broadcast Quality is needed.

The specific deal points will be handled on a case-by-case basis. You must own or control your Masters and Compositions to submit to this opportunity. Please submit as many Instrumentals as you’d like, online or per CD. All submissions will be screened and critiqued by TAXI. Submissions must be received no later than 11:59 PM (PST) on Wednesday, December 20th, 2023. TAXI Dispatch # D231220CP

TAXI # D231220CP

Brief #2
CATCHY, PERCUSSIVE POP INSTRUMENTALS are needed by a very successful boutique Music Library that's distributed by Universal for placements in Promotions, Advertising, and other TV Programming.

NOTE: We previously ran this request as TAXI Listing # S231023BC, but the Company didn't find what they were looking for, so they asked us to try again. If you submitted to listing # S231023BC, please send different material this time around.

This is a catalog you want to be in! Please listen to the following references to get yourself in the general wheelhouse of what they need:

Target Commercial

Google Play Commercial

Apple iPhone 15 Commercial

Although some of the references have vocals, please submit Instrumentals only for this request.

IMPORTANT NOTE FROM THE LIBRARY: "Many composers throw in way too many ideas and are not focused on ONE CENTRAL MOTIF - they try to keep things interesting by adding new harmonic lines and elements (melodies, even improvisations, etc.), instead of focusing on the productions and textures." Put simply, keep it SIMPLE! We know that other Libraries like to receive music with complementary A and B sections, but this Library is NOT one of them – stick with ONE CENTRAL MOTIF per submission please!

Please send in top-notch, percussion-driven Pop Instrumentals with lots of emotionally upbeat energy! Your submissions should have super catchy motifs, engaging rhythms/beats, and simple arrangements with one central motif per piece. Pop instrumentation with lots of rhythmic percussion that's in the general wheelhouse of the reference tracks will work best for this pitch. Please make sure your productions are polished, and any virtual instruments or samples you use are high quality.

All submissions should be about 2 minutes long, give or take. Good edit points and non-faded, buttoned/stinger endings are required. Do NOT copy the references in any way, shape, or form. Use them only as a general guide for tempo, tone, texture, and overall vibe. Do NOT submit any material with unauthorized samples of any other artists’ music, sounds, or any other form of media. Broadcast Quality is needed.

This Music Library offers an EXCLUSIVE deal with a cool twist. You’ll keep 50% of all gross income generated by your music, plus you’ll get 100% of the Writer’s share income generated by your PRO. In other words, if the company licenses your music under a blanket deal, you’ll get income. If they license it for a YouTube video, you’ll get income. Not all music libraries pay you for things like that! The Publisher will get 100% of the Publisher’s share.

Because this is an Exclusive deal, the music you submit for this pitch cannot already be signed with other Libraries or Publishers. You must own or control 100% of your Masters and Composition rights. Please send as many Instrumentals as you’d like, online or per CD. All submissions will be screened and critiqued by TAXI. Submissions must be received no later than 11:59 PM (PST) on Thursday, December 28th, 2023. TAXI # S231228MZ

TAXI # S231228MZ

[Telefunkin]

IMHO the style for your first submission is fine, the mix is good (although some more aggressive grit wouldn't hurt), and the sounds are great too (apart from the keys (so drop those, or find something better that doesn't sound dated).

That leaves developmental arc as the main issue, so take that first ref track "Invincible" as a great example of development - every time it there's a section you think you've heard before there's something different going on, and its over 2m before you hear an exact repeat of any earlier section. If you can do that you'll be good to go.

[BradleyHagen]

Thank You for taking the time Telefunkin-
1.) Yeah, for whatever reason, I seem to be the only one who loves Clavinet..... To most ears it does indeed sound "dated" - It will be gone for the next submission for sure.
2.) This track had a cool 3rd part, but I left it out, and I also repeated sections on purpose, thinking that it would satisfy the screener.... I am still struggling with "developmental arc" vs "too many parts" concepts for a library cue. I am from a background of writing complete SONGS, so I am still trying to figure all of that out

All said, great feedback and thanks~!