Quandary about song submissions....

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chetnichols
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Quandary about song submissions....

Post by chetnichols » Mon Oct 26, 2020 1:06 pm

Hi Folks,

So, I am in a quandary about some of the Taxi song submission procedures. I have been a long-time, singer-songwriter (ASCAP) and publisher (ASCAP). I have been copyrighting songs since the very early 1960's. Rule-of-thumb has been to always copyright a song, then, at the time I produced my first album, I became an ASCAP writer and Publisher. Of course, most of us do this to protect our songs and our interest in the songs.

Then, along the way, the Internet appears and those of us who aggressively began to find ways to use the Internet to move our songs around and make them available to local, national and global audiences....so we looked for others who could assist us. This spawned places like CD Baby, Tunecore....etc....to appear and helped us with digital distribution. I joined with CD Baby and then switched to Tunecore and then LEFT them and went back to CD Baby to handle my 35+ albums' digital distribution. When the PRO CDBaby service appeared, I upped my songs to that service to help with the distribution of the songs and also with the collection of royalties and residuals. It is, after all, a BIG planet.

I was a very early member of Taxi when it first appeared, but I left for many years and only recently came back to Taxi.

My main quandary is that with MANY of the song submissions they come with this stipulation: "You’ll split any upfront sync fees 50/50. They’ll get 100% of the Publisher’s share, and you’ll get 100% of the Writer’s share. ["You must own or control your Master and Copyright. Since this is an EXCLUSIVE deal, please be sure the material you submit for this pitch is NOT already signed with other Libraries or Catalogs."

I was told that the fact that my songs were registered with CD Baby, makes them un-usable for Taxi submissions with the above disclaimer. So, it is making me wonder
what are my next moves? Quit Taxi? Go back to my previous practices to get songs "out there", If I write new songs and/or CUES or produce a new album, I want to get it into the market, so, I copyright everything and usually submit it to CD Baby for distribution. But, if I do this (which is the professional and safe thing to do), I am under the impression that those songs and ALL of the songs I have in my catalog are pretty much worthless and unavailable for submission for Taxi's opportunities. This is especially true of my deep catalog of VINTAGE songs that have been copyrighted and added to my publishing company.

So, what are my options? I only ask because I have gotten NUMEROUS opinions on this topic and it has been hard to find a definitive answer. I know I can contact CD Baby and request that they drop the song's distribution (PRO CD Baby) and just keep the song in the basic service level at CD Baby. Which is not a big deal for me, as I sell quite a few songs and albums daily to my European, Africa and Asian listeners. But, I am still very interested in finding as many opportunities in TV/Film/Media/Games as I can and Taxi offers quite a few of these. So, what do I do here....NOT copyright a song/composition and submit it to TAXI and wait for their reviews? Seems a bit irrational to the professional processes we are trained to do to protect our songs. That, on top of the quandary of how to submit older songs and then face an issue with my songs being rejected because they are being administered by my publishing company and thru CD Baby Pro services.

Sorry, this has been a bit of a long question, but it is a wee bit complicated and I don't want to jeopardize my songs, my self, Taxi or its clients by submitting a song that can't be used.....

Your thoughts?

Chet Nichols

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Re: Quandary about song submissions....

Post by cosmicdolphin » Tue Oct 27, 2020 2:14 pm

The answer is...it depends.

It depends what boxes you have ticked over at CD Baby etc. It depends what the deal is on offer with which library too.

You can probably forget about copyright, it's a separate subject. You don't have to formally copyright anything and in some countries you can't - If you're in the habit of registering your songs then carry on but a Library won't ask to see anything in my experience.

A Library usually want to know 2 things. 1. That you own the Master Rights ( i.e. they don't belong to a record company ) 2. That they can collect publishing on them because that's partly how they get paid.

CD Baby etc have a tick box which says something like " monetize my music " which assigns them the publishing rights. So if you've done that you may be struggling with No.2

It also depends if any of these things are exclusive or non-exclusive. If the CD Baby publishing deal is non-ex , and there is a Taxi opportunity that is also non-ex then you can re-title the song and the Library can collect the publishing share.

Scenario A : You have a song called " I'm The Ice Cream Man " non exclusively published by CD Baby..Taxi Library-A would like it on a non-exclusive basis so they re-name it " Mr Ice Cream " it gets given a new number with your PRO and the Library can collect their half.

Scenario B : You have a song that's perfect for an Exclusive Listing , but it's out on all the digital platforms and you ticked the box with CD Baby that gave them the publishing...then that would be a no go

Or..The CD Baby deal is Exclusive..then you can't use those songs until it expires...which may be in several years or may be in perpituity..Like I said it all depends.

Best bet is to do some research, then catalog everything so you know what's what with each song / album. Sometimes you can get out of these things, or some may have already expired.

If it's purely Exclusive Listings you are going for then it's probably best to just write new material for sync. Writing to the listings gives yo a better chance of success. Hope that helps.

Mark

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Re: Quandary about song submissions....

Post by andygabrys » Tue Oct 27, 2020 2:38 pm

chetnichols wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 1:06 pm
............main quandary is that with MANY of the song submissions they come with this stipulation: "You’ll split any upfront sync fees 50/50. They’ll get 100% of the Publisher’s share, and you’ll get 100% of the Writer’s share. ["You must own or control your Master and Copyright. Since this is an EXCLUSIVE deal, please be sure the material you submit for this pitch is NOT already signed with other Libraries or Catalogs." ............
Unfortunately - that ship sailed a while ago. The one where you keep almost all the income and everything is catered to you.

Non-exclusive libraries were an amazing thing for a time because you could multiply your earning potential by having multiple different publishers push your material. As long as the publishers serviced different market areas there wouldn't be cross over. That had some downsides - being more visible now when digital fingerprinting is used to detect placements. Which publisher should get the money if several have the same music?

There are still some amazing non-exclusive publishers who service specific areas of the market and are very selective. One in particular I can think of, and they work with TAXI.

There are also a huge number of exclusive publishers - some connected with MEGA media corporations and they have a large reach. This can lead to some decent $$$. And more recently a number of non-exclusive publishers have started offering exclusive segments of their catalogs. This opens up foreign sub publishing (which can be pretty lucrative) but it does limit your signing your song to them and only them. Exclusive publishers often request in perpetuity term in addition to your signing over the copyright.

so it really comes down to 1) what you have, and 2) how you want to position your music.

If you have 35 + albums, writing a lot of music isn't a problem for you. So now you have the opportunity to diversify your music earning portfolio (if that's an interest).

You could keep a bunch of stuff self-published and earn on CdBaby, and other digital sites.
You could sign some of the same music to non-exclusive publishers (which you would have to research if they aren't showing up in Taxi listings).
You could take some of your existing material and try to get a publishing administration deal and still retain most of the money (that will depend on your visibility and your clout as an artist).
You could write new material and pitch it to exclusive listings or to exclusive publishers.

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Re: Quandary about song submissions....

Post by chetnichols » Wed Oct 28, 2020 10:29 am

Thanks to all who responded. Always looking for good feedback. and these responses are thoughtful and useful and (dare I say) "witty, too. Yeah, I am hip to having write new stuff for listings, so that is not an issue, except, lately, as I am just rebounding after 22 months of not being able to sing because a virus attacked my vocal chords and paralyzed them. It has been a long and trying road back...filled with a very slow rebound. It has only been since the 1st of October of this year, that I had re-gained control of my voice, so, I have been composing a lot of instrumental tracks and CUES. I had two great doctors (they helped Adele, Robert Plant, Sir Elton and others) and a great vocal physical therapist helping me in the beginning, but most of the re-hab has been instigated by my daily vocal exercises. It was a long, tedious and trying journey of "stops and starts".....sounds like it is coming to an end. Oddly enough, I picked up 3 notes on the "up-side".

That said, one of my biggest questions has to do with Vintage songs from my 60's, 70's and 80's albums....which were recorded back then, copyrighted then and released back then....guess I will cross those bridges when I get to them and see how they pan out. I am knowledgeable about the "re-naming process"...which works in most cases. OF course, I have found that this "general topic" is one that is lively and people have a lot of interesting experiences and insight to share....which I appreciate.

Anyway, thanks for the feedback to all....and hope this note finds you all happy, healthy and safe.

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Re: Quandary about song submissions....

Post by andygabrys » Wed Oct 28, 2020 10:56 am

Got it.

So there is one company that specialized in signing songs that were truly vintage in nature and they ran a lot of TAXI listings.

I am sure if you pitch one of those older pieces and it is accepted they will have a system for dealing with all your issues.

So keep your eyes peeled!

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Re: Quandary about song submissions....

Post by VanderBoegh » Thu Oct 29, 2020 9:51 pm

Hey Chet, why do you say this?
If I write new songs and/or CUES or produce a new album, I want to get it into the market, so, I copyright everything and usually submit it to CD Baby for distribution. But, if I do this (which is the professional and safe thing to do),
Why are you thinking that copyrighting everything you write and sending it off to CD Baby is the most professional and safe thing to do? I never do either of those....

~~Matt

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Re: Quandary about song submissions....

Post by DesireInspires » Tue Nov 03, 2020 11:22 am

chetnichols wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 1:06 pm
So, it is making me wonder what are my next moves? Quit Taxi?
I think quitting may be a reasonable and honorable choice.

I don’t know anything about your music, but you seem to be more of a singer/songwriter. That is different than being a composer for TV and film.

Your approach for copyrighting and distribution sounds great for a singer/songwriter. So if you feel more comfortable doing that, you should continue. Doing music for TV and film is a different beast to tackle.

There is a difference between quitting and quitting while one is ahead.

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Re: Quandary about song submissions....

Post by chetnichols » Sat Sep 17, 2022 3:12 pm

Hey Andy,

Thanks for the reply.

One thing I have found is that submitting an intricate question can be hit or miss on forums, so I have curtailed using them as much. I miss having actual conversations especially when it comes to legal issues with music publishing, music libraries, song placements and songs. I appreciate people sending replies, but all too often.... they are lacking that "conversational" insight, clarification and quality. This is NOT To say that I don't appreciate them and find them useful, though.

I appreciate your comments about CD Baby. I have been with them from VERY early on in their business offerings. Derek was/is a great guy. I have used them as a digital distributor because I want to spend writing and composing and limit the time spent with the administrating assets. I have been an Executive Creative Director and Executive Producer for numerous global ad agencies and production companies over the years and always managed the asset organization, so I have a pretty good process I use and understanding on how to manage them and help my teams get quick access to assets. But, I digress.

Lately, though, CD Baby has been hard to deal with. They stopped offering their phone customer service awhile ago, which in my humble opinion, used to be one of the very best out there. Now you have to submit a question and wait. I have a new album which I wanted to release a couple months ago and ran into a technical bug on their end where the title to the album, "Death By Selfie", kept auto-correcting to "Death by Selfie". Simple thing, but it needs to be corrected. I have repeatedly try to get someone to reply to my request for help...but to NO avail. So, I have given up on them at this point and will move on to a different provider. Now, I have to deal with trying to get someone to help me remove my catalogue from CD Baby. That will be difficult because of my work load in the TV-Film composing arena. It has me working 7 days a week. I love doing it AND I love writing songs, too, so I am not complaining.

Anyway, I have some exciting options and when I have found good ones, I will share them with you all.

I am spoiled by APPLE, Sweetwater and numerous other companies I work with that have phone customer service .... like, say, TAXI does! Thank God.

Anyway, wishing you great success and continued inspiration.

Best,

Chet



andygabrys wrote:
Tue Oct 27, 2020 2:38 pm
chetnichols wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 1:06 pm
............main quandary is that with MANY of the song submissions they come with this stipulation: "You’ll split any upfront sync fees 50/50. They’ll get 100% of the Publisher’s share, and you’ll get 100% of the Writer’s share. ["You must own or control your Master and Copyright. Since this is an EXCLUSIVE deal, please be sure the material you submit for this pitch is NOT already signed with other Libraries or Catalogs." ............
Unfortunately - that ship sailed a while ago. The one where you keep almost all the income and everything is catered to you.

Non-exclusive libraries were an amazing thing for a time because you could multiply your earning potential by having multiple different publishers push your material. As long as the publishers serviced different market areas there wouldn't be cross over. That had some downsides - being more visible now when digital fingerprinting is used to detect placements. Which publisher should get the money if several have the same music?

There are still some amazing non-exclusive publishers who service specific areas of the market and are very selective. One in particular I can think of, and they work with TAXI.

There are also a huge number of exclusive publishers - some connected with MEGA media corporations and they have a large reach. This can lead to some decent $$$. And more recently a number of non-exclusive publishers have started offering exclusive segments of their catalogs. This opens up foreign sub publishing (which can be pretty lucrative) but it does limit your signing your song to them and only them. Exclusive publishers often request in perpetuity term in addition to your signing over the copyright.

so it really comes down to 1) what you have, and 2) how you want to position your music.

If you have 35 + albums, writing a lot of music isn't a problem for you. So now you have the opportunity to diversify your music earning portfolio (if that's an interest).

You could keep a bunch of stuff self-published and earn on CdBaby, and other digital sites.
You could sign some of the same music to non-exclusive publishers (which you would have to research if they aren't showing up in Taxi listings).
You could take some of your existing material and try to get a publishing administration deal and still retain most of the money (that will depend on your visibility and your clout as an artist).
You could write new material and pitch it to exclusive listings or to exclusive publishers.

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Re: Quandary about song submissions....

Post by Casey H » Sat Sep 17, 2022 5:47 pm

Keep in mind that success with Taxi depends mainly on writing new material that meets the specific requirements of a given listing. While at times, older material does work for a listing, percentage-wise that's on the low side. When you read listings, listen carefully to the reference tracks and see how well your material sounds in the ballpark of those tracks. It's easy to do wishful listening and shotgun your current songs hoping they will be forwarded. That doesn't happen.

So before you focus too much on the issues you presented, I suggest you pick some listings you are considering and post links to the tracks you are thinking of submitting for those listings. That will help us guide you more. You can post in the Peer To Peer section of this forum.

Are you planning on writing new material?

:D Casey

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Re: Quandary about song submissions....

Post by cosmicdolphin » Sun Sep 18, 2022 1:06 am

If you have a lot of historical material you could always look into employing the services of a Sync Agent for your back catalogue.

That way you could leave it where it is, as they're not taking a publishing share. They would take a cut of any sync fees they landed for you.

Then you could just write new stuff for Taxi purposes that you've not put up on CDbaby etc

Mark

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