To B2 or Not To B2 .....

[TimWalter]

Ok, Im a guitar player. But I have taught myself how to play keyboard, and do al right with piano... I have even gigged on piano...

I love the B3 organ sound, and have tried to add some of that flavor to my recordings... but have ended up sounding like a guitar player trying to play B3.. I guess.. lol. But I think I can get better... one of the suggestions by the more advanced guys here was that I should have access to actual sliders to adjust in real time.. one way would be the XK series from Hammond ( I think that's what Crawdaddy uses, if I remember correctly, for his recordings, and they sound AWESOME!!!!!). I dont remember the models precisely, but seems that the XK1c can be had for about $1500 new from Sweetwater, (one keyboard) and a two keyboard model can be had for around $2500 (XK3???) new.. Might be some used ones, but I havent found any listings for either...

Now, a guy in South Dakota that works on guitars and amps has a C2 model with Leslie (1952 version) that he has completely restored (supposedly). Based on my understanding, the C series was just the more fancy "dress", often for churches, and a C2 is the same internally as a B2 and a C3 is the same internally as a B3. And the only real different between the B2 and B3 is the percussive part, which can be retrofitted from Trek for about $300. And some boards say that the percussion is not even used by all B3 players, some dont even use it, so not adding would not be missed by those players.

Then there is the matter of smooth or detented drawbars. smooth being preferred, supposedly, but some B2/C2 models actually came with the upgrade from the factory (or were retrofitted by hammond after the fact).

So, looking at getting serious about being a B3 type player.

I can get this fully restored C2 with the original Leslie for $1000. If I come and pick it up. Its about 2.5 hours away.

Here's my dilemna: I could spend roughly the same magnitude of money and get the XK1. It would not have mechanical issues of maintenance, and would be portable if I ever get into a gigging situation... Some say the digital just cant get to the warm sound of the original.. On B3 boards many members have both the digital and at least 1 maybe multiple versions of the B2 and or B3 (these are some serious organ players!!!).. Some of them like the sound of the B2 over the B3, as it seems that the earlier ones have a slightly different sound. Some say "ive compared my XK3 to my vintage b3, and the vintage still sounds much better, but if I send my XK3 through the vintage leslie, it pretty much equals the sound" (NOTE: maybe this is a DUH!, as the leslies certainly were key for the true sound.)

Then there's the space issue .. getting it into my basement, and having enough space... But the coolness factor of having people come into my studio and seeing a vintage C2 and Leslie sitting there!!!! yowza....lol

Also theres the maintenance factor. This thing was made in 1952, and it is mechanical , and will need service at some point, even if it has been completely overhauled.


I dont know yet if it has smooth or detented drawbars, and the model of the leslie and the serial number of the organ, etc. I can ask him all these things before I drive 2.5 hours.. but I kind of want to find out if it is really something I should pursue.

I haven't gone to see it yet, I want to do more research. Apparently he is kind of desperate to sell it, has had it for a while and not many B3 players in these parts... He wanted $2000, and I told him well I could do $1000, and he said without missing a beat "if you come and pick it up!!!"... so we'll see...

Or maybe I do neither and stick with my midi b3 without drawbars for the time being....

What do you fellow taxi guys think? is this the steal of the century, or something to stay away from

[Cwadroon]

I love organs, but personally , unless I had a well paying gig that called for me to have my own organ,( don't get wrong, I'd love to have one!) But I would invest the money (and space) differently. You can get a lot of midi controllers in this day and age, and program them to do pretty much whatever you want. In the box vsts etc also never require maintenance and if they do, it's usually just an update... I think you know where I'm going with this lol.

Sounds like you really want it though

[MJRivard]

Hi,
I don't have a B3, but I have a Leslie speaker. I have used organ presets on my U220 sound module and through the Leslie it sounds close. I also saw that Roland has a B3 module with draw bars that works with keyboard controllers. This could be a cheaper option, and also a space saver. Some years ago I had rented a KORG C3 organ/keyboard and played it through the Leslie and it sounded good. I would suggest that you get a Leslie to play it though. I found that the Leslie colours the sound in a way the Leslie simulators don't.

There is not much maintenance to keep a Leslie working. Some oil for the rotating speakers, and keeping the amp clean of dust. If you do not move it much you won't hurt the tubes in the amp. I have had mine since the early 1980's and have not had to change any of the tubes.

I hope my 2 cents may help.

- Myran
If you would like to hear how my Leslie and keyboard organ sounds here is my sound cloud site; www.soundcloud.com/myran-j-rivard. You could also play your guitar through the Leslie.

[Len911]

I'll play devil's advocate.

The market in used organs is for small to medium churches and valued as much or more as a piece of furniture??

How much will you have to pay someone to remove it from your basement??

Vintage, antique or junk??

Fire hazard. Once the mice chew the wires in the vintage megawatt tube power supply, the furniture polish from the last half a century acts as an accelerant to the small forest of kindling that was carved by craftsman into the furniture.

Make excellent hamster houses, the Leslie makes a fine exercise wheel for the overweight hamster, it gets them started.

[mojobone]

I'm a former B2 owner; the B2 doesn't have percussion and therefore will not make some of the most famous Hammond B3 sounds. It made one helluva sound with a 100-watt Hammond cab, but you're not gonna get the cool jazz sounds. The click-stop drawbars are probably not a dealbreaker, and yeah, there's aftermarket percussion, if you're handy, that way. Korg's digital CX-3 is a pretty good option, (they don't make it anymore, but you can find 'em) paired with a Motion Sound or Leslie rotating speaker, there was an older, analog version that's highly prized, but I've had no luck finding one. The great thing about the Korgs is that everything (knobs, switches, drawbars) is in the same place as on a real Hammond B3. You can't say that for the newer Hammonds.

If you don't have access to a competent technician, you should probably avoid going the vintage route, though it might be worthwhile in the Leslie's case, because generally any tube amp guy can work on those. In your shoes, I'd probably buy both and send the B2 on to someone with the chops and wherewithal to maintain it, which is what I did with mine-it's in Nashville, now. For me, the main issue was space; I still have a smaller, self-contained Hammond that sleeps in the garage. If I'd had a matching Leslie, I'd have kept that; in fact I have a deco Leslie from another source that's in pieces. If yours is a commercial studio, there's something to be said for having a great shaggy beast of an instrument available to inspire musicians passing through.

[TimWalter]

I'
Make excellent hamster houses, the Leslie makes a fine exercise wheel for the overweight hamster, it gets them started.

Crackin me up Len! If all else fails could get a hamster! !!!

TIM

[TimWalter]

Thanks for all the comments, guys

The "Vintage Hammond Fever" has abated and I am feeling better, thank you for all your get well wishes... (lol).

As it stands now, I am not even thinking about going further on this... dropped the subject. When he calls me up and offers me money to take it off his hands, well, then we might have a dilemna. Until then, on to other things.
Tim