Help Recording Classical Guitar? (acoustic nylon strings)

[Merryband1]

Hi TAXI Family!

I know a lot of you record acoustic guitar without any trouble, so I'm looking for a little help. And I can't change my interface right now, so please bear with me.

I set up the AKG 120 about 12 inches (30.48 cm) from the 12th fret, and the AKG 170 about 24 inches (60.96 cm) from the body, at an angle. The angle on both of them made a V shape with the guitar at the apex. I'm using an Alesis i04 legacy interface, plugged into the computer via USB.

It sounds okay if a little too heavy on the bottom end when I record, but when I play it back, it sounds as though it's overmodulated, although it isn't clipping. So far, I've only listened through the headset, but it's a good set, and I figure if it sounds buzzy in those, it'll sound buzzy through the monitors, too.

I tried recording monaural, stereo, to left track, to left and right track, and it still sounds off. I don't think it's the input device, because I've been using it for years without any issues, but I'm still adjusting to the new microphones. And before you ask, yes, I have the phantom power turned on.

Any suggestions? Many thanks in advance!

Merry

[lesmac]

Hey Merry,

It sounds like you are overloading the 120. Being cardioid it has a proximity effect [bass boost].
Most acoustic guitars have a resonant boomy sound around the 100Hz area.
Engage the hi pass filter [low cut] and put it a bit further away from the guitar. You could face the guitar and sound hole away from the mic, not 90 degrees.

I use 2 mics quite a lot blended to taste, usually panned to the same position. Rather than going for a stereo spread with the mics it is easier IMHO to add ambience later. [That is a whim though and possibly subject to change any time ]
The small diaphragm mic has a focussed pic up pattern. They can be good for honing in on a string sound. You could swap positions or sit the 170 on top of the 120 [nearly touching] and blend. Try spreading the mic in a line vertically around the 12th fret. Say the 170 10" above the strings pointing down and the 120 about the same distance below the strings pointing up.

Close mic-ing can be a double edged sword regarding unwanted sounds: squeaks, thumps, buzz, rattles, breaths, etc etc.
Generally if you have a room sound that you like you can push the mic away from the guitar. Even if the room sound isn't great it can be worthwhile backing away from the mic a bit.

Basically I think you need to roll off the low end at the mic, interface, DAW level. One, two or all of the above. Putting the mic further away will also help to reduce the bass build up. Try not to get hung up on this mic placement issue too. If you can get an easy fix, stick to it for a while and focus on your performance as that is the main ingredient here. With your engineer's hat on set some time aside to just get a sound you are happy with. Then have a break and put on your performers hat and don't let the engineer ruin a good performance.

[gitanosoy]

Hi Merry,
Try one mic, if you have 2 different make mics you might have phase issues, the double micing is usually done with the same kind of mics, that is for acoustic nylon, for electric guitar micing the amp is a different scenario.

Don't use the dynamic mic, place the other mic 16-18 inches at an angle from the left side pointing to your right hand(picking hand) and slightly on a downward angle.

..and of course the sound that comes out the guitar itself makes a difference, I mic my Cordoba GKPro differently than my Flamenco guitar.

I s your floor carpeted or are you on a hardwood floor?

Good luck

[Merryband1]

Thank you so much, Les! I will try that. I was already just playing some fun stuff to test out the levels after I saw how bad the other recordings were. I will swap out the two mics and moving farther away, for sure! I already figured I'd have to roll off some bottom end, but I wasn't expecting so MUCH of it! It had been years since I tried recording classical, and then I had a far different microphone, so it was an unpleasant surprise!

If moving the mics and switching them round doesn't help, I might try using one of the older mics and seeing if that helped.

Once I get a decent recording, I plan to post in Peer to Peer. I really appreciate your help!

Merry

[Merryband1]

Thanks, Andre!
For some weird reason, your post didn't show up until this morning, after I'd already replied to Les! Ah, Internet! Yes, I can see where recording a classical and a Flamenco guitar would have to be different. Nylon vs. metal strings, for one. (And, if it's possible, strings made of silver!)

The floor is carpeted, and I have a lot of fabric lying around in the room, too, which helps absorb a lot of reflections. And there's an old tapestry on the wall that my dad bought. Plus some bookcases.
I will try just using one mic and see what happens. I'm going to try all three mics, changing out the placement, moving farther away, etc.

I found an article this morning that also has some good suggestions, especially the part about being in good practice! I've been playing the two pieces I want to submit over and over and over ad infinitum. At one point, I was repeating just one phrase and Mom asked me what was wrong. So I explained I was just trying to get it right.

Here's a link to the article in case you're interested (or if anyone else is): How to Record Classical Guitar

Cheers,
Merry

[gitanosoy]

Hi Marry,
Funny in the article you click on the tab "Acoustic properties" and it is a steel string guitar...lol.

Yeah use a condenser mic. There also a lot of youtube videos for info.

Yeah I wrote something yesterday now I have to execute it, no place for punch ins unfortunately.

take care

[Merryband1]

Maybe they couldn't find the right photo for the article!

You can do the recording, Andre! I know what you mean about places where to punch in... too often in my stuff, I couldn't punch in to cover a mistake, either!
Looking forward to hearing what you wrote!

Merry

[gitanosoy]

Maybe they couldn't find the right photo for the article!

You can do the recording, Andre! I know what you mean about places where to punch in... too often in my stuff, I couldn't punch in to cover a mistake, either!
Looking forward to hearing what you wrote!

Merry

Merry I corrected my first comment, I meant to say don't use a "Dynamic mic".

Same her, I am doing a 3/4 like the first ref...too bad the 2nd ref is blocked, curious to know what track it was.

[Merryband1]

No worries, Andre. I'm not sure I even own a dynamic mic anymore unless it's packed away with the old cassette recorders... I seem to recall some small rectangular ones with weird plugs, sometimes 1/8" but often with a secondary input in the same plug to control the on & off switch on the mic.

That's weird about the secondary reference being blocked. Was that Ojos Brujos? Here's the link: Ojos Brujos . Maybe you can access it from here!

Merry

[gitanosoy]

No worries, Andre. I'm not sure I even own a dynamic mic anymore unless it's packed away with the old cassette recorders... I seem to recall some small rectangular ones with weird plugs, sometimes 1/8" but often with a secondary input in the same plug to control the on & off switch on the mic.

That's weird about the secondary reference being blocked. Was that Ojos Brujos? Here's the link: Ojos Brujos . Maybe you can access it from here!

Merry

No it is blocked, I am in Canada so sometimes some videos are blocked here, don't know the reason. Peter Rahil sent me a video to checkout as well and it said not available in Canada.

No worries