Virtual Piano Software Recs?

[Mixnow3]

I originally had several returns due to my piano sound not being authentic enough and then in a return I received, the screener gave me really good advice. They told me to add a second vst piano. I originally was using only Ivory II American Concert D but then I bought Garritan CFX Lite and then layered both together. I mix them together so I can hear both of them. I also changed the velocity mapping on Ivory II so that the dynamic range is diminished. I also now put minimal reverb on my piano sound and just a touch of room ambience. Since I have made these changes, I have not received any returns due to unnatural sounding piano. I use an old Roland Digital Piano with weighted keys as my controller. Hope this helps.

[mojobone]

Sometimes the complaints about the piano are not about the piano; if people are getting forwards and deals with the stock piano in Logic, it's probably not your instrument samples that aren't up to snuff. Sometimes, it's about the context; lots of sampled pianos work great in a busy pop mix, but might be missing some richness and detail in a solo setting. My Casio stage piano only has four velocity layers, but you wouldn't know it with drums, bass and guitars bashing away. Oddly enough, one of the big giveaways is a too loud sustain pedal release sample with no round robin.

Often you can find ways to build in more expression; there are 127 velocities in the MIDI spec, and that might seem like a lot but there's a ton of timbral variation between ppp and mezzo forte. What I like to do is reduce the dynamic range in Addictive Keys so my 127 velocity levels cover only the range between mezzo piano and double forte. Another useful feature is sample shift, which uses pitch-shifted octaves to change the formant of the samples in real time. Shifting up seldom sounds realistic, but downshifting can provide a certain sonority that's great for the dark, cinematic stuff.

Ambience is another critical factor; the mic distance/placement and room sound need to be appropriate to the genre. For instance, in Cuban jazz the standard mic placement is to drop a beat-to-death Unisphere down the top of an upright, hanging it fairly close to the player's left hand and closing the top. By itself, this technique sounds like a$$, but in the midst of horns, strings, congas, timbales, caxixi, tumbas, shakers and clave, a really pointy piano sound doesn't hurt. A dead giveaway is having a different reverb on the piano than any other instrument in the mix. Turn off the VSTi's reverb and use a bus reverb for all the instruments, and don't use your sampled instrument's room mics, unless you can closely match the room with the bus reverb. Room mics can best be taken advantage of on solo pieces or very small ensembles where the piano is front and center.

Lastly, EQ and compression can do some heavy lifting or be used subtly and sparingly. Piano has a very wide frequency response and a very tall dynamic range; in a busy mix, you might want to band limit the piano to shoehorn it in; for a solo piece, maybe you'll want to compress to bring out more stringiness, chesty-ness or spank. Just be aware that too little dynamic range can sound plastic-y and fake. You'll want to curb the transients, without eliminating them entirely.

[wendylanders]

Thanks Mojo,

I can't get my piano cues to sound realistic, so I'm scouring the forums.

Best,

Wendy Landers

[andygabrys]

Hi all.
I recently had a submission returned for a moody solo piano piece. The screener complimented the tune itself but took issue with the VI sounding inauthentic. I'm using Synthogy's 'Ivory' plugin which I think sounds pretty good but I guess not so much. Any suggestions for an authentic virtual piano plug? I hate that this factor cost me a forward and need to get it up to speed ASAP.
Thanks in advance.

What I would do:

paste the entire listing text including the links to reference tracks into your post and a link to where your submission can be heard as it was submitted.

Screener comments need to be taken in context. If not you can end up spending a bazillion dollars on Alicia's keys or Addictive Keys or the Grand or East West or whatever. Sometimes its programming, sometimes its mixing, sometimes its an ambience choice - and sometimes the piece didn't feel right to the screener and they think its the programming but maybe they guessed wrong - and something else was bugging them more.

Like Mazz always used to say on this forum: Its the ear not the gear.

[mrdtman]

I got Spectrasonics Keyscape not too long ago. Really nice Yamaha in there IMO.

DT

[ComposerLDG]

My go-to pianos are NI's The Maverick and The Giant. I use The Grandeur also, but not quite as much since it lends itself more to classical (bright and projecting). I get pretty good results with those VI's.

[keithl]

You are fine wit Ivory. I suspect it has something to do with what the other guys are saying, maybe your MIDI velocities are too consistent from note to note, making it sound artificial.

Maybe find an example of a piano MIDI file online and import it into your machine. Compare yours to theirs? See how the velocities differ.

[daftdog]

I think I agree with many of the previous comments above.... pretty much any of the more up-market piano VIs ought to be up to the task in sonic terms (and certainly including Ivory) but, even with a solo piano, you might want to be doing some fine-tuning of the sound character to suit the musical context.... and making good use of MIDI dynamics (and therefore the tonal dynamics within the samples) is going to help the performance feel more 'human'.... BTW, I've also had good results (well, forwards based on solo piano submissions) when blending a couple of different VI pianos together.... Perhaps one as the 'main' and another just mixed in at a low level an adding a little bit of extra harmonic content? Maybe I'm just imagining it but, to my ears, it gives a nice end result. Perhaps a bit like, in an electric guitar context, blending the sound of the same performance played through two different amps?

Good luck with the solo piano submissions.....

John

[ComposerLDG]

My go-to pianos are NI's The Grandeur, The Maverick (I use this one A LOT), and The Giant. Love all of them. The Giant can be a bit difficult to tame, as many of the presets are very thick and swimming in reverb, so I always spend time making adjustments to it. I'd say the most versatile one for me has been The Maverick, because it's pretty much ready to go and sounds like the real thing right out of the box. The Grandeur is great for use in classical or orchestral where the piano needs to cut through, but I find I adjust the EQ and velocity on it a lot if using it as solo piano because it can be pretty piercing in the treble if you start getting emotive with it.

Now, the controller is another thing. Right now I'm using a Korg digital and honestly I don't like it. The touch tends to be a bit uneven and not quite sensitive enough. I'm saving for NI's Komplete Kontrol S88. Heard great things about it.

Good luck!

[ComposerLDG]

Incidentally, I just picked up NI's newest piano, NOIRE. Man, this thing is great. Definitely worth checking out. Requires Kontakt 6 though, won’t work on earlier versions.