Cinematic Return

[datadataproductions]

Hey guys! Here's the basic listing, I think a few people have posted about this one...

A-LIST MUSIC SUPERVISOR needs CINEMATIC INSTRUMENTALS for a HOLLYWOOD FILM TRAILER. The Music Supervisor needs INSTRUMENTAL pieces that have an EMOTIONAL BUILD and GROW into something INTENSE and POWERFUL.

Below are a couple of examples that do this effectively. But note, your endings should be even BIGGER:

"All the Spark" by Steve Jablonsky - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJhFXUfj6HA

"Time" by Hans Zimmer - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0kGAz6HYM8


QUOTING THE SOURCE: "This should NOT feel overly sweet or heroic or triumphant. Ideally, the melody should evoke a sense of LOSS, SADNESS or REMORSE at the beginning and then GROW into a BIG, expansive cinematic feeling that 'ANYTHING CAN HAPPEN.'" Your piece should be at least 1:30 long. Instruments MUST sound real and authentic. Production must be top notch!

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my song is called A Time for Change. Here's the link to the Sound Cloud:

https://soundcloud.com/datadataproducti ... for-change


The return critique says: "doesn't swell into a climactic, emotional, cinematic ending" and I also got a check on the 'recording' box. This goes into my other question - what plug in do you guys use for strings? I used Waves' Kontakt which is pretty good but maybe not the best for this kind of stuff..

ANYWAY I'm pretty confused by critique, because if it's the quality of the instruments I totally understand, but if the songwriting doesn't follow the listing then I want to know! I personally think the ending is extremely climactic but that's just me

Feedback - go!


-Dara

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P.S. this is my first time posting to the forum! I've been a member for a year and a half now but have started to get really serious about TAXI in the past few months (the first song I ever submitted was forwarded!). I love reading all of your threads and listening to your tracks and learning from each of you - what a great community!
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datadataproductions.com

[Russell Landwehr]

Heya Dara! Welcome to the forums.

I saw your post this morning but I wanted to wait until I got home and listened to your cue before replying.

I'll talk about your song in a moment.

First, please introduce yourself in the "General Hangout." That place tends to get the most action. And you will receive a most warm welcome there. (The TAXI forums is a wonderful community of VERY supportive folk.)

A good place to ask a question about tech stuff like "what do you use for orchestral sounds" is the Technology, Recording and Production part of the Forum.

You posted your "why did I get this review" question in the right place. When you introduce yourself in the General Hangout let the folks know you have a question that you posted here, and you can do that by posting a link like this: http://forums.taxi.com/topic93192.html

I think you will find honest people here that will tell you straight up how it is. But there is something I've learned here in the forums. When people give you feedback, they do it because they CARE. People here LOVE to help. The TAXI Forum members are very supportive and want to see you (and everyone else) succeed. THAT is the heart of TAXI.

Now, about your cue. First I must say that it shows what the screeners call solid skills in composition. You are on the right track and you obviously know your way around music.

As far as this particular listing, the "bar" is extremely high. The clues to this you will find in the listing text: "A-LIST, Instruments MUST sound real and authentic. Production must be top notch!" But also I've seen that "orchestral" and SPECIALLY trailer listings tend to be EXTREMELY hard to hit the target on. (this is not from experience, only by observing the conversations about them here in the forums)

Your track does build. But if I were to assign scores from 1 to 10 on impact and build, I would say that your track went from 1 in the beginning to about 4 or 5 by the end. (I really don't want to seem too harsh by saying this, but I can hear the potential in what you are doing and I would really like to see you reach that "bar") And when I listen to industry trailers, I would score those builds to about a 12 or 15 on that 1-10 scale... get it?

Now, working with orchestra samples is one of the hardest and most time-consuming things that you can do. I don't have a clue yet how to do it myself. So I can't give you any advice there, but there are plenty of folk who can steer you in the right direction... both what sample libraries are the best and how to use them.

Now a really big thing you could work on here is really opening up the space by using some reverb. Also, trailer cues that build really get a TON of tracks building and making this GIGANTIC sound. All that hugeness of the effects and in-your-face parts saying "bam-bam-bam here we are!" is what does it. Picture a whole symphonic orchestra really shredding their bows and moving around in their chairs so much that their prim little hair buns start unraveling.

Yeeehaaa! now I've gotta get THAT picture out of my head.

So... I took a break while typing this rather long reply to check out datadataproductions.com hmmm interesting. Just my first impression: The best stuff there is not orchestral.

I am looking forward to your participation in the forums. Welcome!

Russell

[hanspeter]

I listened to your song and I think the problem was the quality of the samples. For me the don't sound realistic and since that listing was going for a feature movie ( I guess ) they wanted it as realistic as possible. Best would be recordings with a real orchestra I guess.

I was thinking about cinematic strings myself, but currently my budget for new sounds is a bit tight - http://www.cinematicstrings.com/

I submited a song to this listing as well http://soundcloud.com/music-pictures/freedom

I found the critic a bit harsh, even that I knew that this song I submitted was not exactly what they were asking for. I just thought I give a shot since this was my very first string based song I ever produced I wanted to see what happens and what critic I would get. I guess the listener needed to be extra picky and had a lot of songs to listen.

[mikeymike2000]

Hi Dara,

welcome to the forum!

Yes, I agree with the other two comments it is your samples and to some extent the mixing. But mostly the samples. Not the composition.

For film trailer it will be the highest bar imaginable and if you want to play in that genre you will want to get a minimum of east/west and LASS but even those alone may not be enough. You will be "competing" with other people who have that and much much more. Some may even use real instruments.

Don't want to discourage you from trailer music but that is like the Olympics of music.

Film trailers don't pay in the hundreds, they pay in the thousands or tens of thousands so your production must sound like 10,000 or more.

I think your strings could be tweaked a little bit with velocity changes, articulations and EQ but it will still not be enough, IMO, to go for this genre. The brass sounded really un-realistic. - I am only talking about your samples here, not you and not your abilities.

hope that helps.

[Salty]

Hey Dara-

A lot of what was already said is right on- I had to buy some better samples myself- and I def reccomend LASS and EastWest.

Well, I do have to agree with you that there is clearly a big swell at the end, so I dont know where that is coming from- a lot of times I think the short answer ones can be a little misleading- I think many have occasionally had something said that doesnt make much sense to us- usually I blow a gasket for a few minutes and then calm down(that or post on here)- you might want to get a gasket blowing space, because it will happen again

The good news is that there is tons of great people on this forum, and many who are incredibly helpful when you need to try and figure stuff out.

[datadataproductions]

Man oh man - thank for the replies guys.

Yeah I think I'm going to buy a pack from eastwest this week I just can't decide which one would be best? I was looking at quantum leap symphonic orchestra gold. (..$igh..) @Hanspeter those cinematic strings look promising - thanks for that! Is that where the samples for your track on SoundCloud came from? I must say, those drums sound pretty awesome...
@mikeymike2000 thanks for the feedback! Extremely helpful.

Happy new year guys

[hanspeter]

I think the cinematic strings are great also from the usage. I checked the tutorials - looks all so easy. I think I will get those as soon as I have more budget but fortunately I just got a request for a costumized song and that will bring that money.

On my track I took the drums from Spectrazonics RMX and also the strings from Omnisphere. There are only few samples but for some stuff it works. Thats why I still hold back with cinematic strings...