anyone have experience with this library?

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jwtaxi
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Re: anyone have experience with this library?

Post by jwtaxi » Sat Jul 13, 2019 7:05 am

cosmicdolphin wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:03 am
jwtaxi wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:33 pm
It would be extremely easy for someone with bad intentions to steal all this music and if I haven't registered it, we would have no recourse. of course
It would still be every bit as easy for someone to steal it even if it was registered..makes no difference.

Even if your work was so top notch someone had to steal it , It would be difficult to pass someone else's work off as your own to a Library. . ".Dear Comnposer...we love the new track you submitted but can you just change the synth in the middle 8 to a Marimba we think it would work much better and can you half the length of the intro whilst making the ending more dynamic ".....not really going to happen is it.
Thank you, good points!

I should have been more clear in my post-in this case. i was defining the stealing not by another composer, but by the library (for instance) making $$$ from it, and then not paying.

I work with a couple of different libraries in LA, and the first thing they do once they've listened to the music and decided that they would like to add the track is to check rights holders, ostensibly to make sure that I didn't steal it myself. they go to ASCAP Ace in my case, and confirm that I have registered it there, and have something to show ownership on my part.
what would be another way I could prove that I own the intellectual property in that case?

are they the exceptions, rather than the rule?

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Re: anyone have experience with this library?

Post by ttully » Sat Jul 13, 2019 7:13 am

I would say that is the exception.... not the rule.

I have tracks in about 25 libraries and only 1 of them wants to see if the tracks are already registered with a PRO (many people probably know who I am talking about)....but then they go and rename the track and register it themselves under their name.

But having any library check anything is definitely the exception.
At least in my experience,

My 3 cents worth,
Tim

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Re: anyone have experience with this library?

Post by jwtaxi » Sat Jul 13, 2019 7:20 am

ttully wrote:
Fri Jul 12, 2019 6:52 am
Well.... for what it's worth,
I have literally hundreds of tracks in dozens of libraries that have never been registered.
That's just part of the business....


My 3 cents worth,
Tim
This is also good to hear, thank you!

so you are confident that you are treated fairly/equitably in the business?
it almost sounds like one of those honor systems for the snacks where someone takes the snack and you hope they will drop some money (and the right amount) in the box.

in those cases, you would check the box against the inventory, and if you find that they don't match, you stop leaving the snacks there.

what I am trying to learn how to ascertain is how you know which places are paying for the snacks, so to speak. is that even possible in this end of the business?
I'm sure there are some libraries that would do everything that they can to be sure everything is documented and fair, and there are some that are looser with their business practices, and I am not sure how to see the difference at this point. all the contracts I have signed look pretty much the same and the results have been similar, but I don't have as wide an experience as many others on this forum do.

thanks for the input!

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Re: anyone have experience with this library?

Post by jwtaxi » Sat Jul 13, 2019 7:28 am

ttully wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 7:13 am
I would say that is the exception.... not the rule.

I have tracks in about 25 libraries and only 1 of them wants to see if the tracks are already registered with a PRO (many people probably know who I am talking about)....but then they go and rename the track and register it themselves under their name.

But having any library check anything is definitely the exception.
At least in my experience,

My 3 cents worth,
Tim
Thank you for that! I just checked, I work with 3 libraries that check rights holders and then retitle. however, 2 of them retitle by keeping my title and adding their prefix or suffix to the title. to distinguish their "version" of it. so perhaps one of them is the library you refer to above. the 3rd one actually changes the title completely, to something that might sound kind of like my title. they might change the name from Fiery Red to Amber Flame or something like that.
the first seems to make more sense, especially if not exclusive placements, otherwise you could potentially have the same song in different places with a different name.

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Re: anyone have experience with this library?

Post by jwtaxi » Sat Jul 13, 2019 7:31 am

CTWF wrote:
Fri Jul 12, 2019 2:41 pm
VanderBoegh wrote:
Fri Jul 12, 2019 2:11 pm
... a disposable commodity. ...
Despite of being a commercially failing musical amateur, this is something I immediately got when I started this adventure: music is a disposable good.
I am still a little shocked by this, especially given the skill and artistry that goes into some tracks, not to mention equipment.
On the other hand, I almost entirely lost fear of someone copying things from me (from me, of all ... :lol: ), so I post pretty much all my work-in-progress here.
The pay for placements (I read about - not having any) seems like a bad joke given the amount of work that goes into some those tracks.
It seems much easier to me to earn much more money elsewhere in the same time, but what is going on is of course, as often, that people are being taken advantage of because they are passionate about what they are doing and would possibly even do it for free. Ask yourself, what required more work and skill? That 5 minutes of reality TV, or the music that was put underneath it?

Tom
Thanks for that insight!
I'd like to distinguish that I am not worried about someone stealing the music and claiming it as their own, but of the library using it and not paying my percentage of the $$$ they made from it. how I would even know, and what to reasonably do to avoid that outcome as often as possible.

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Re: anyone have experience with this library?

Post by ttully » Sat Jul 13, 2019 7:54 am

Well.... ALL I know for sure is....
I have literally hundreds and hundreds of unregistered tracks in different libraries..... and I have
zero idea what happened to them after that.

It seems to be the 80/20 rule .... you will get placements from 20% of the libraries you are in.
That's just part of the business....

Your mileage may vary!

Tim

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Re: anyone have experience with this library?

Post by cosmicdolphin » Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:13 pm

jwtaxi wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 7:31 am

Thanks for that insight!
I'd like to distinguish that I am not worried about someone stealing the music and claiming it as their own, but of the library using it and not paying my percentage of the $$$ they made from it. how I would even know, and what to reasonably do to avoid that outcome as often as possible.
I don't think any Library would keep their best composers by stealing their music or even be in business very long.

At some stage they will need register the cue, whether that's right after signing it from the writer or a few months later in their next registration batch, or sometimes only when it gets used way further down the road.

When it's registered by them they will assign you the agreed writers share and (typically) themselves the publishers share. If they don't register it then the production company can't fill out the cue sheet, and your PRO won't have any notification that they should pay everyone.

You can check the registration in your PRO repository ( or 'Works' as it's called here in PRS ) and this will show the ownership share of any interested parties. Some label it differently and say the overall pie is 200% ..ie You get 100% writers and they get 100% publishing. Others say the overall pie is 100% split 50-50... same thing.

Sure.. Things do fall through the cracks , usually because the production companies cue sheet is wrong which isn't the Library's fault. If you get missed off the cue sheet , the Library won't get their publishers split either. Sometimes it happens the other way, I've been paid for a cue that's on the cue sheet for a reality show and it's not actually in episode ! Maybe they swapped out the track late on and didn't update the cue sheet. Who knows.

But I don't think there are Libraries out there trying to scam you.

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Re: anyone have experience with this library?

Post by jwtaxi » Sun Jul 14, 2019 9:45 am

ttully wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 7:54 am
Well.... ALL I know for sure is....
I have literally hundreds and hundreds of unregistered tracks in different libraries..... and I have
zero idea what happened to them after that.

It seems to be the 80/20 rule .... you will get placements from 20% of the libraries you are in.
That's just part of the business....

Your mileage may vary!

Tim
ok, thank you! so instead of saying, "they haven't done anything with that track, I want it back for something else" you just write another one and move on. thanks also for the insight on the realistic expectations for placements and libraries, very helpful!

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Re: anyone have experience with this library?

Post by jwtaxi » Sun Jul 14, 2019 9:52 am

cosmicdolphin wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:13 pm
jwtaxi wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 7:31 am

Thanks for that insight!
I'd like to distinguish that I am not worried about someone stealing the music and claiming it as their own, but of the library using it and not paying my percentage of the $$$ they made from it. how I would even know, and what to reasonably do to avoid that outcome as often as possible.
I don't think any Library would keep their best composers by stealing their music or even be in business very long.

At some stage they will need register the cue, whether that's right after signing it from the writer or a few months later in their next registration batch, or sometimes only when it gets used way further down the road.

When it's registered by them they will assign you the agreed writers share and (typically) themselves the publishers share. If they don't register it then the production company can't fill out the cue sheet, and your PRO won't have any notification that they should pay everyone.

You can check the registration in your PRO repository ( or 'Works' as it's called here in PRS ) and this will show the ownership share of any interested parties. Some label it differently and say the overall pie is 200% ..ie You get 100% writers and they get 100% publishing. Others say the overall pie is 100% split 50-50... same thing.

Sure.. Things do fall through the cracks , usually because the production companies cue sheet is wrong which isn't the Library's fault. If you get missed off the cue sheet , the Library won't get their publishers split either. Sometimes it happens the other way, I've been paid for a cue that's on the cue sheet for a reality show and it's not actually in episode ! Maybe they swapped out the track late on and didn't update the cue sheet. Who knows.

But I don't think there are Libraries out there trying to scam you.
wonderful, thank you! it seems the common thread here is that I am approaching it the wrong way, and am not seeing the bigger picture. I really appreciate the help with seeing that bigger picture and having a little better understanding of it. this has been a very enlightening and useful discussion for me, and I really appreciate ALL of the comments and insights!

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Re: anyone have experience with this library?

Post by kyliecouper » Thu Jul 25, 2019 7:43 pm

jwtaxi wrote:
Sun Jul 14, 2019 9:45 am
ttully wrote:
Sat Jul 13, 2019 7:54 am
Well.... ALL I know for sure is....
I have literally hundreds and hundreds of unregistered tracks in different libraries..... and I have
zero idea what happened to them after that.

It seems to be the 80/20 rule .... you will get placements from 20% of the libraries you are in.
That's just part of the business....

Your mileage may vary!

Tim
ok, thank you! so instead of saying, "they haven't done anything with that track, I want it back for something else" you just write another one and move on. thanks also for the insight on the realistic expectations for placements and libraries, very helpful!

"Just write another one and move on"

This is it! You have hit the nail on the head!
Once you get your head around this and take all the emotion out, everything becomes much much easier!

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