Art for a higher purpose

[jchitty]

I was thinking the other day about artists, composers and writers who had limited or no success in their lifetimes, but whose works now (such as Van Gogh) now fetch exhorbitant prices. But aside from the money, he left the art world a great contribution. Van Gogh toiled away for years, hindered by mental illness and poverty. But he was compelled to paint, and quite a few biographers have said that he painted because he believed it was his purpose to do so anyway, regardless of any monetary gain he might have achieved on earth. His brother, an art dealer only sold one of Van Gogh's paintings during his lifetime, and he didn't get that much money for it.Herman Melville had some early success with Billy Budd, but after that, his success dried up. He went onto write "Moby Dick" of course, but even though it's an American masterpiece, he died in obscurity. Edgar Allen Poe wrote countless short stories, and managed to eke a living, but his family still lived in poverty.John Kennedy Toole wrote, "A Confederacy of Dunces" (one of the best Southern novels ever), but never lived to see the success of it....he committed suicide before it was ever published.Mozart also struggled with tough reviews when he was alive...he wasn't given the breaks other composers were, but his music was so great, it lived on.Do any of you folks ever think you're writing for a higher purpose...that this is what you're supposed to do, regardless of any recognition you might get in your lifetime? Not that I could ever compare modern day songwriting with the art of the past, but do you some of you feel that you're driven for some purpose you don't know yet, but that you are compelled to do anyway?And do any of you have favorite examples of people who didn't get much recognition during their lifetimes, but after death, were recognized?Sometimes, people just write for art's sake. They feel they've been called to do it, no matter what the outcome.And of course, in my case, it's show me the money baby! But I also think that higher purpose thingy can come into play at times.

[coachdebra]

As a business coach, I have to weigh in on this issue. I believe that the many myths and beliefs around this issue are what perpetuate the "starving artist" mindset. Here's my take on it. First - if it's not your highest purpose to create art, go get a job! If you're in the business to get "famous", get on Survivor. In my experience people create art for two reasons - because they are inspired and even compelled to, and/or because they are inspired and compelled to use that art to make an impact in the world.If you are creating it because of the first reason and NOT the second, then you are an amateur (not meant as a pejorative, but the original meaning - doing it for love), and I would ask, what is your impact in the world - go do that for a living.If you are creating it for both reasons, then you're in the right place, here on TAXI - And you are a business owner. If you don't have commercial success, then you aren't making as big an impact in the world as you could. Therefore, you are not fulfilling your higher purpose to the greatest extent possible. Therefore - commercial success and art for a higher purpose are not diametrically opposed but are actually in true alignment. Your coach,Debra

[jchitty]

Wow, some really good posts here by Bill and Els. Bill, I hear you. Writing is probably my most favorite thing to do...when I was a little kid, people would say to me, "what do you want to be when you grow up?" I'd always say, "a poet." Then people would say, "What, you can't make a living out of that. You need to learn to type or do business work." People around me were nine to fivers, and that's what they thought would keep me safe...they were only trying to help. So I went to work eventually in a library and typed my life away as a cataloguer. But all along, I was writing poems and dreaming.Elser, what great thoughts by you.... it was a pleasure co-writing with you, and I think you're right....that writing in and of itself has intrinsic value. The world around us makes us forget sometimes that it's not only about money, but the creation itself.....just creating something makes it all worthwhile.Plus, in our instant gratification world, people expect instant success in two minutes time when it literally takes years of work....I certainly know I can be that way, we all can. I know that some people have felt they've let me down with our co-writes because we didn't get a foward sometimes.....but I never look at it that way. No demo is ever a waste because you never know what will happen in the years to come, and for all you know, that song which didn't get recognition today might prove to be a monster hit. But even it doesn't, you can be proud you created something.I enjoyed writing with you and Bill both (Bill and I wrote "Leaving Out Of Atmore," you and I wrote "Vodka and Smoke")....and here's to some more co-writes by us! We can be proud of what we did.

[jchitty]

Nov 14, 2008, 10:53am, coachdebra wrote:As a business coach, I have to weigh in on this issue. I believe that the many myths and beliefs around this issue are what perpetuate the "starving artist" mindset. Here's my take on it. First - if it's not your highest purpose to create art, go get a job! If you're in the business to get "famous", get on Survivor. In my experience people create art for two reasons - because they are inspired and even compelled to, and/or because they are inspired and compelled to use that art to make an impact in the world.If you are creating it because of the first reason and NOT the second, then you are an amateur (not meant as a pejorative, but the original meaning - doing it for love), and I would ask, what is your impact in the world - go do that for a living.If you are creating it for both reasons, then you're in the right place, here on TAXI - And you are a business owner. If you don't have commercial success, then you aren't making as big an impact in the world as you could. Therefore, you are not fulfilling your higher purpose to the greatest extent possible. Therefore - commercial success and art for a higher purpose are not diametrically opposed but are actually in true alignment. Your coach,DebraHey, Deb I'll agree that all of us are creating to earn money. But I think the primary reason many of us do it is because we just love it...they say 'do what you love, and the money will follow.'But music is so subjective, you're almost guaranteed to be a starving artist for a while. And it's that love of creating something that gets you through those long periods before you do earn any money. I'm glad for those folks who persevered despite earning no money....they still gave the world a great gift.

[allends]

Nov 14, 2008, 10:53am, coachdebra wrote:If you don't have commercial success, then you aren't making as big an impact in the world as you could. Therefore, you are not fulfilling your higher purpose to the greatest extent possible. Therefore - commercial success and art for a higher purpose are not diametrically opposed but are actually in true alignment. Debra,This is wonderful advice that I plan to read through again and again until it really sinks in. ON A SIDE NOTE:Some say that you can tell a lot about a person by their handshake. I passed your table at the rally and had the pleasure to shake your hand. Well, that was a week ago and I'm still impressed. Thank you for your positive influence!All The Best,Allen

[Casey H]

Nov 14, 2008, 11:08am, jchitty wrote: But I think the primary reason many of us do it is because we just love it...I was doing it for the groupies until I learned there are no groupies for non-performing songwriters!

[jchitty]

Nov 14, 2008, 1:49pm, hurowitz wrote:Nov 14, 2008, 11:08am, jchitty wrote: But I think the primary reason many of us do it is because we just love it...I was doing it for the groupies until I learned there are no groupies for non-performing songwriters!

[squids]

I dunno......like Bill, I've been doin' it so long I can't really say if it's about art as much as it's about breathin'. Maybe it's a bit of what Deb is sayin', that I'm compelled to write. That said, I went back to school to go into counseling because, like my parents told me, "you can't make a livin' at music, get a real job." Also, I'm good at counseling and while I love writin' and producin', I have big azz issues with my voice and I really dislike the entanglements and narcissism that comes with performing sometimes (that I've seen all too often with musicians)......not you guys, natch! LOLI do live fo those moments of the beautiful cowrite, the perfectly expressed line, the nicely sung lyric, hearing from someone (or getting it signed) that says, "hey, you accomplished the goal there!"It's been a joy to cowrite with ya, chits, as well. Elser, I'm with you on what you said too! And Matt, ditto your last line. Oh, p.s. Deb: Respectfully, I think your comment "if you're not in it to make art, go get a job!" was a bit narrow. Not all musicians, even successful ones (by your definition) consider their work art. The best songwriters I've known who've made comfortable livings at it see their job AS a job, one they do to the best of their ability. Art is something they do on the side when they're able. Otherwise, they're makin' deadlines, doin' what others need them to do to help make the project successful, etc. Sounds jes like a job ta me too. Success is defined differently fo us all. And yes, in this culture and in this country, the label "amateur" is considered perjorative. We don't hire plumbers because they're amateurs. We don't get the best 'amateur' athletes to compete for the Olympics (although plenty do!). We respect professionals, not only fo their work ethic but also for their expertise. That said, plenty of guys who work at music as a sideline are jes as talented and skilled as guys who make a livin' at music. They simply define success by entirely different terms. Not all of us are out to write a hit song and frankly, fo me, that's quite a success, given 33 years doin' okay at music.

[jchitty]

Nov 14, 2008, 4:18pm, squids wrote:I dunno......like Bill, I've been doin' it so long I can't really say if it's about art as much as it's about breathin'. Maybe it's a bit of what Deb is sayin', that I'm compelled to write. That said, I went back to school to go into counseling because, like my parents told me, "you can't make a livin' at music, get a real job." Also, I'm good at counseling and while I love writin' and producin', I have big azz issues with my voice and I really dislike the entanglements and narcissism that comes with performing sometimes (that I've seen all too often with musicians)......not you guys, natch! LOLI do live fo those moments of the beautiful cowrite, the perfectly expressed line, the nicely sung lyric, hearing from someone (or getting it signed) that says, "hey, you accomplished the goal there!"It's been a joy to cowrite with ya, chits, as well. Elser, I'm with you on what you said too! And Matt, ditto your last line. Sniffle, I love you too, girl! You're absolutely one of my best co-writing experiences ever, Squiddy, and I'm so proud of 'Burbs....so proud to have it on my TAXI page. You know how I feel about your talent, lyric writing skills, vocals and production....you're the best. Matt...I hope one day your music gets out there front and center as well...you're a talented writer, and you sound like you're dedicated, so I know it's gonna happen for you. Okay, I got a little sappy, so I better quit while I'm ahead.

[ernstinen]

Chits,Your post put my "art" into its timeframe (I aplolgize if I've told this story before ) ---I moved to L.A. in the early 80's to be a "Rock Star!" The only problem was that I was an "artist," and I just COULDN'T do what the other "hair bands" were doing at that time.So I formed my own band, which was a rock/jazz/fusion style. It employed 3-part harmony, and was very unique. We ALMOST got signed to Epic Records around the early 90's, but the main A&R guy (who was the son of the president of Epic) sat down with me for hours. He finally said "Hey, your music sounds like I'm listening through a pane of glass. Don't you listen to the radio?"He obviously didn't get it.SO --- in the mid-90's, I moved my whole studio to a mountain cabin north of LA. No phone, no TV, no nothing. I was burned out on the "pop" scene of LA. I sat in silence for a couple weeks, just listening to the trees and birds.After a few weeks, I started looking at books of impressionistic art, and listened to classical music. This took a while to "sink in."Finally, a month later, I developed a "concept album" and began to work on it. From May to October, I spent all my time on my pop/rock recording. It was a magical time for me. --- The result was a solo record entitled "Listen," which I believe still stands the test of time.Upon moving back to LA, I took film scoring classes at UCLA. But I soon realized that the film scoring "biz" wasn't for me, so I took my orchestration lessons to heart and wrote "Symphony No. 1"Good choice! I followed my muse, as I learned in the mountains.The result has been "art for a higher purpose." --- I've had premieres of my pieces from Washington, D.C., to Los Angeles, and have had them recorded by the Bulgarian Philharmonic and the Czech Philharmonic.Granted, I haven't made a lot of $$ doing this, but SOMEONE'S gotta make music for "a higher purpose." I completely believe in following one's muse.Love to all,Ern