Bad lyrics in great songs.

Songwriting, songwriters, etc

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Casey H
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Re: Bad lyrics in great songs.

Post by Casey H » Fri Apr 06, 2007 3:04 am

Quote: As far as lyrics being that important, you have a point. Lyrics may have been really important in the past, but America seems to have a short attention now. Maybe everyone is just so busy. No one wants to take the time to 'think' about anything anymore, so a catchy melody and a good hook seem to be what draw listeners in. Most of my friends can remember the chorus words, hook and melody, but most all of them flub the verse lines. Ah! A great example of the double standard that makes new writers have to be so good. If an established writer writes a song with a great chorus/hook but the verse lyrics have issues, they probably can still present it to artists that know them and those verse details can still be worked out with re-write or or co-write. Or some non-optimal lyric might even be left in. A killer hook forgives a lot of sins. We all hear things on the radio and say, "huh"? As a new writer, like it or not, gaffes of almost any kind will often mean your song will never make it to an artist.Chit- I think you are right when you point out these are different times. This is not the 60's or 70's when people sat around smoking weed, staring at the bizarre covers of their vinyl albums, and conjecturing over the deep mysteries of the lyrics. (Damn! I was born way too late ) Casey

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Re: Bad lyrics in great songs.

Post by allends » Fri Apr 06, 2007 3:09 am

Quote:...Lyrics may have been really important in the past, but America seems to have a short attention now. Maybe everyone is just so busy. No one wants to take the time to 'think' about anything anymore...It's interesting that you should mention how short our attention spans are getting for music because I just read something on this subject in the newspaper. Ever hear of a thing called Radio SASS (stands for Short Attention Span System)? http://www.radiosass.com/sassprotocol.html A veteran DJ and author named George Gimarc has developed a radio-play protocol that calls for popular songs to be cut down to an average of 2 minutes. He and his team have edited and added about 1,500 tune to the Radio SASS library.I would be great if some members could surf over their promo materials and give us a commentary on our downward spiraling culture

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Re: Bad lyrics in great songs.

Post by jeffe » Fri Apr 06, 2007 5:39 am

Have we unwittingly unravelled the way for witers to go?
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Re: Bad lyrics in great songs.

Post by jchitty » Fri Apr 06, 2007 6:30 am

Quote:Quote: As far as lyrics being that important, you have a point. Lyrics may have been really important in the past, but America seems to have a short attention now. Maybe everyone is just so busy. No one wants to take the time to 'think' about anything anymore, so a catchy melody and a good hook seem to be what draw listeners in. Most of my friends can remember the chorus words, hook and melody, but most all of them flub the verse lines. Ah! A great example of the double standard that makes new writers have to be so good. If an established writer writes a song with a great chorus/hook but the verse lyrics have issues, they probably can still present it to artists that know them and those verse details can still be worked out with re-write or or co-write. Or some non-optimal lyric might even be left in. A killer hook forgives a lot of sins. We all hear things on the radio and say, "huh"? As a new writer, like it or not, gaffes of almost any kind will often mean your song will never make it to an artist.Chit- I think you are right when you point out these are different times. This is not the 60's or 70's when people sat around smoking weed, staring at the bizarre covers of their vinyl albums, and conjecturing over the deep mysteries of the lyrics. (Damn! I was born way too late ) CaseySome of us may remember those times, Casey. We remember those wonderful album covers....we'd crack those covers open and use them to sift through the seeds and the stems. What was so wonderful about them was all the lyrics contained within....some of the words beautifully typed out in caligraphic (is that a word, hehe) forms.....you'd hit a bong, and then you'd spend hours trying to figure out what those lyrics meant.....many of them making no sense at all, just an inkblot test which said more about the person interpreting them than the lyrics themselves. I think companies are cheap too...for all the talk about lyrics being so important, do you ever see many lyrics printed in the jackets of CDs anymore? Twenty or so years have passed by since albums became tapes and tapes became CDS, and now we don't even take an aspirin without worrying about the side effects. Yep, I agree with you about a new writer being put to a double standard.....mainly because industry execs are so fearful to put money behind a new songwriter. It's this way in other industries too...if you write novels, then someone like Stephen King is a known money producer, so he can get away with more. New novelists aren't developed the way they used to be....it's purely economics. That's why some of the stuff coming out of Nashville can sound sterile sometimes....as long as a money making artist sings, he can sing out of the phonebook and get away with it. I see it when I submit too....I constantly get comments like, "great hook", we just need you to develop the lyrics in the verse more, so I think you hit the nail on the head here.

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Re: Bad lyrics in great songs.

Post by jchitty » Fri Apr 06, 2007 6:40 am

Quote:Quote:...Lyrics may have been really important in the past, but America seems to have a short attention now. Maybe everyone is just so busy. No one wants to take the time to 'think' about anything anymore...It's interesting that you should mention how short our attention spans are getting for music because I just read something on this subject in the newspaper. Ever hear of a thing called Radio SASS (stands for Short Attention Span System)? http://www.radiosass.com/sassprotocol.html A veteran DJ and author named George Gimarc has developed a radio-play protocol that calls for popular songs to be cut down to an average of 2 minutes. He and his team have edited and added about 1,500 tune to the Radio SASS library.I would be great if some members could surf over their promo materials and give us a commentary on our downward spiraling culture Hmmm, Allends, interesting. No, I've never heard of SASS until you posted this website about it. I just read what it had to say. 2 minutes for song....it surely does follow a cultural trend....kind of like junk food, it's fast, cheap and filling, but there is no taste and you didn't have a fulfilling eating experience.

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Re: Bad lyrics in great songs.

Post by jeffe » Fri Apr 06, 2007 6:47 am

Stephen King reminds me of a great song (in my opinion ) That was played in one of his excellent stories called 'The Stand".The song was "Don't dream it's over" by "Crowded house".The story started with a song called "The reaper" by "Blue oyster cult".Don't mind me. I'm just reminiscing
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Re: Bad lyrics in great songs.

Post by jchitty » Fri Apr 06, 2007 6:58 am

I remember seeing "The Stand" years ago, but I've forgotten most of it now....I'm trying to remember Crowded House's song. Jeffe, since you are so good coming up with topics, I think you should start a thread on 'great 80's' songs.Yeah, I remember the Reaper by BOC. They say the first sign of old age is reminiscing. BTW, I've never cared for Stephen King that much, but I did love his novella, "Rita Hayworth and the Shawshank Redemption" which went on to become a great movie too.

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