Chorus Differentiation - tips & tricks

[Casey H]

I hope we can get more examples here. I just thought of "Breathe" by Faith Hill. The chorus uses short notes & different meter in contrast to the verse. Casey

[devin]

A couple of points that I've heard and I try to incorporate as well:- get to the chorus in less than 60 seconds. "don't bore us...get to the chorus!" is what my good friend Mark always says- sometimes it's useful to create a question or situation in the verse story, that gets resolved in the chorusOther than that, you've laid it out really well there Casey! (from what I've read and experimented with, at any rate).I'm drawing a blank in repeating anything commercial for an example, except a song I wrote a couple years ago. I'll throw it up here, just in case it starts a discussion about the "question and answer" approach I mentioned. (actually...it's in the verse = "wrong answer" chorus = "right question" format....hehehe...I just made that up ).Just Be - copyright Devin Melanson 2006verse1I should.... buy that new carThat would.... make me happy at lastI could.... if they gave me more creditBut I'm at the maxverse2I should.... have the house on the cornerThat would.... show how successful I amI could.... prove I'm importantIsn't that the plan?Lift I have to keep moving up That's what they say If happiness is so black and white Why do I feel grey?Chorus Why can't I just be? Happy now, here in the moment? Is it what I buy or what I throw aside That sets me free? Why can't I just be?P.S. I hope Squids and Hummingbird get a knowing chuckle out of it...(Zen master in the garden reads post, nods knowingly, then whacks me upside the head for not paying attention to my surroundings enough to hear him coming...why do they all do that )

[silvercord]

ahh Devin! buts its a whack of LOVE! (i have been having my fair share of them too....)hope all is well!

[linziellen]

These are all great points, thank you. I'm going to throw a spanner in the works Casey! A friend just reminded me of "Everybody's Free (To Wear Sunscreen)" - Baz Luhrmann. Very powerful song, but where's the chorus!? I don't think there was any need for one. He just wraps the song up at the end.Linz

[Casey H]

Yup, lyrical construction is a big part of it. I was thinking mainly about the musical part because for many of us that's the more challenging part (not that lyrics are a piece of cake)...It's interesting that it's hard to think of commercial examples off the tops of our heads. I think that's because there is a lot of stuff that's not easily definable, especially when it's just a hooky melody line with lyrics that meld perfectly with it. It feels like magic.Thinking about the differentiation techniques is very useful when you are struggling to write the chorus, trying to improve a work in progress, or doing a re-write. When I first started writing songs, I didn't think about anything since I didn't know anything other than what other songs (Beatles, etc) sounded like. I just strummed, sang, and messed around until I liked it. Sometimes I got lucky, sometimes not. Now, I give a lot of thought to these things (don't always succeed)... For example, I'm usually not happy if the chorus isn't in another key with higher notes compared to the verse. Feel free out there to post links to your own songs for open discussion about what makes the chorus stand out or not. Casey

[Casey H]

Hey LindzI think the Sunscreen song is too much of an oddball for us to learn much from (other than that ya never know)... Kelly Clarkson's Breakaway and Since You've Been Gone are good examples where the chorus is quite a bit higher than the verse.I always liked the construction in Melissa Etheridge's Come To My Window. There is a good pre-chorus lead-in and the chorus uses an ascending up-the-scale line that peaks on "window". The up-the-scale pattern works well with the tension build on the hook line. The bridge also has a nice change-up. Casey

[Casey H]

May 17, 2008, 7:02am, milfus wrote:well as far as im concerened (this said to avoid a huge debate) all a chorus is is basicly "and thats why I say......*insert chorus here*" as far as contenthasn't led me wrong yetVery true, on the lyrics side. I don't see any debate (but around here anything is possible )But, I would venture that more songs get rejected for musical hooks not differentiated enough. Casey

[edteja]

May 17, 2008, 4:33pm, tedsingingfox wrote:This is something I really could stand to work on.TedIt's hard to find much on these board that we all couldn't stand to work on!!! The chorus does seem to be the musical challenge IN TERMS OF GETTING IT PAST THE GATEKEEPERS. I emphasize that because from an artistic point of view, there are plenty enough challenges.

[Casey H]

May 18, 2008, 9:34am, cameron wrote:And what about a song that starts with a chorus? That seems to be considered bad form but I can think of 1/2 dozen of the top of my head that do this, including Hound Dog, Mrs. Robinson, Hey Jude, On the Road Again, etc. It seems to me that none of that matters if the song is good, which has more to do with the lyrics and melody, but no doubt it is important that any song needs to have tension and release in the right places. Since the chorus is usually the peak, then yes, you want your verses at the front if you want the song to build slowly. But I see nothing wrong with jumping right in with the hook at the start of the song either.CameronIt just means the chorus better be DAMN good... Then it can be very effective.... "Can't Buy Me Love", "Build Me Up Buttercup", and many others. "Hey Jude" really doesn't have a chorus. Many Beatles songs have no chorus but use ABAB or AABA format. They wrote such great hooks in those sections that it worked great. Unfortunately, today's pop music is not very accepting of non-chorus format songs.I have one song in which I opened with the chorus. Some think it worked well, others not. I wanted to try it to see if my chorus was bold enough to be the opener. Casey

[Casey H]

May 18, 2008, 5:18pm, cameron wrote:I guess you're right about Hey Jude really having no chorus at all, but I gotta think that adhering to these rules is one of the reasons that a lot of the songs on the country charts sound alike. Unfortunately, you're 100% correct that if you want to sell your song these days you have no choice, especially as an unknown, but that doesn't make it right. Could you imagine Paul McCartney as an unknown songwriter trying to hawk Hey Jude in today's market. He wouldn't stand a chance. It broke all the rules (7+ minutes long too) yet it stayed at #1 for 9 weeks. Sticking to the rules might be a good idea to help a beginning songwriter improve his writing, but a song is either good or it isn't and to hell with the rules. Besides, I like my job at the car wash, lol!But remember than chorus differentiation and sectional contrast are the same thing. So songs with no choruses still needed to make sure their sections are differentiated. So, even if you are not concerned with commercial acceptance and want to write catchy songs, these techniques often apply. Billy Joel's "I Love You Just The Way You Are" was a monster hit years ago in AABA format. The B section clearly stands out as different from the verses. There is something to be learned by studying these things. Casey