Cubase SX 3 Routing question

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hurican
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Cubase SX 3 Routing question

Post by hurican » Mon Sep 07, 2009 6:33 pm

I have recently completed a studio (yes actually building it), and am going through the labrynth of setting up the easiest combination of both live and studio recording.I have Cubase SX 3 and a Delta 1010.Studio recording is easy, I just use the channels I need and run direct outs to the different input channels in the Delta. Then I assign each track to an input channel (via VST Connections) in Cubase.Very similar setup for Multitrack live recording.What I would like some help on (if it is even possible), is the following. I'm a big fan of AIR (always in record). I like to record while we practise in case we hit on a jam that might have potential. But having 8 tracks of audio going through this time is going to eat up some serious disk space. As anything we might practise is just for reference, I'd like to somehow re-route all these inputs to a stereo track and just use that, saving the multitrack option to flesh out something we want to start detailing.So I'd like to know if in Cubase SX 3, if there is a way to re-route all inputs to a single stereo input, and use that track to record. It would still give me the option of isolating the instruments and setting a general level for each instrument , and the recordings would come out much better than just throwing a good condenser in the middle of the room.The problem is in Cubase, you can group any amount of output busses to a mono / stereo channel, but these channel groups don't have input busses, nor can you use them to record (no record button).After a number of days in research trying to find this out I haven't come up with any options. I was hoping someone here is a Cubase guru and has a trick up their sleeve.Thanks!

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Re: Cubase SX 3 Routing question

Post by lindpop » Mon Sep 07, 2009 10:20 pm

If you route your mono tracks to a group channel and then make a stereo track and choose the group channel as input on the stereo track. It works in Cubase5.
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Re: Cubase SX 3 Routing question

Post by hurican » Tue Sep 08, 2009 3:42 am

Sept 8, 2009, 1:20am, lindpop wrote:If you route your mono tracks to a group channel and then make a stereo track and choose the group channel as input on the stereo track. It works in Cubase5.Ahh... I may have not gone far enough. I know Cubase 5 has more "rewire" like options than SX3, but I'll give it a shot.Thanks!

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Re: Cubase SX 3 Routing question

Post by hurican » Wed Sep 09, 2009 4:21 am

Well, I set up a group channel and assigned the direct input channels to it, but when creating another stereo channel, SX 3 doesn't allow you to buss the output of the group channel to the input of the stereo channel.So it looks like the only other option I have is to hardwire it, which would mean patching main or control room outs to the delta. It still might be an option, as my control room outs are not currently being used... and the Delta 1010 has a routing option where I could assign Wav out channels 5/6 to H/W In 5/6. So the newest barrier I would have to get around, is assigning a VST connection to Wav Out 5/6... and in SX3, it only allows the input routing to go to the input channels...Of course there might be a device option that I'm missing... so I'll have to do more digging... But if you have any ideas I'd like to know.I'd rather set this up as an installation where routing changes are handled through the software (or mixer buttons) as opposed to manually re-patching cables all the time.

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Re: Cubase SX 3 Routing question

Post by matto » Wed Sep 09, 2009 6:20 am

Hurican, can't you just assign the "mix" or "mixer" output from the control panel (software application) of your Delta 1010 as an input source for the stereo track you're going to record on? As long as all ten input channels are turned up in the mixer they should all be present in the "mix/mixer" out.I know I used to do this with my Delta 66 on SX3, so it should work with the 1010 as well. The only caveat is that the *output* of that stereo track you are recording to cannot be routed to the Cubase mix bus while you are recording or you may get a feedback loop.

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Re: Cubase SX 3 Routing question

Post by hurican » Wed Sep 09, 2009 7:45 am

Hey Matto!I have a peculiar setup. This is optimized for live recording, scratching and arranging between the band members.I have a Mackie board.I have the Inserts used for direct outs (Channels 1-6) into the Delta. 1/4" TS plugs, all the way in. (Connection to Mains Interrupted).I have my keyboards going to Alt 3/4 in. This goes to Channels 7-8 into the Delta. These are NOT interrupted to mains.This gives me the ability to record all the main channels without it being routed back through the mains and my keyboard monitors.Since my keys go through ALT 3/4, I can assign them to mains and have only the keys go through the monitors.Voila, live practise AND recording with no feedback or doubling up on output, since all the guys have their own monitors or amps.Plus I can just hit the "Tape" button, and have our just recorded tracks go out for playback / review.It's a great setup... I'm still hoping for "perfection", as I'm kind of that way. lol

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Re: Cubase SX 3 Routing question

Post by matto » Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:00 am

Right but if I understand you correctly then when you say "mains" you are talking about the Mackie right?In other words you are not monitoring off of the Delta PCI card correct?What I was talking about does not involve your Mackie mixer or its mix bus, I'm talking about the software mixer that controls the Delta. The one that comes up when you click "Control Panel" in the SX3 "Device Setup". The output of that software mixer (which is usually used for no latency monitoring by people who do not have a monitor mixer) should be available as an input source for your SX audio tracks (it may have to be activated first though in Cubase). On my system now (Cubase 4) it's called Delta Monitor R/Delta Monitor R. But I know it was also available in SX3 cause I had used that feature when I was still on SX. Anyway this should allow you to combine all of the Delta's inputs to stereo in the Delta software mixer and then feed a stereo track in SX with that signal.None of it should affect you Mackie in any way.Or is there something I'm misunderstanding about your setup?

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Re: Cubase SX 3 Routing question

Post by hurican » Wed Sep 09, 2009 5:39 pm

Sept 9, 2009, 12:00pm, matto wrote:Right but if I understand you correctly then when you say "mains" you are talking about the Mackie right?In other words you are not monitoring off of the Delta PCI card correct?Correct. Currently I'm sending the Delta "Outs 1/2" to the Tape In on the Mackie. I don't have the "Monitor" option checked.Quote:What I was talking about does not involve your Mackie mixer or its mix bus, I'm talking about the software mixer that controls the Delta. The one that comes up when you click "Control Panel" in the SX3 "Device Setup". The output of that software mixer (which is usually used for no latency monitoring by people who do not have a monitor mixer) should be available as an input source for your SX audio tracks (it may have to be activated first though in Cubase). On my system now (Cubase 4) it's called Delta Monitor R/Delta Monitor R. But I know it was also available in SX3 cause I had used that feature when I was still on SX.Ok, I know the control panel. I do know some of the routing options and its ability to save them. Ok... this might be the thing that I'm looking for. The one that I'm missing. So I mentioned I don't have "Monitor Mixer" checked. But of course that's easily remedied. I think I know where you're going with this. The monitor mixer in the Delta Control panel is a choosable input source through the Cubase VST Connections panel, If I'm hearing you right?I was previously never sure of the monitor mixer verses the Wave Outs 1/2.... It was an option I didn't think about.Quote:Anyway this should allow you to combine all of the Delta's inputs to stereo in the Delta software mixer and then feed a stereo track in SX with that signal.None of it should affect you Mackie in any way.Or is there something I'm misunderstanding about your setup?Nope, I think you have a good idea of it. I think I have an idea of what you're talking about now as well. This should give me the option I need.Outline-Use Wav Out 1/2 as Monitor Mixer.Go to VST Connections (If needed) and add this buss there.Then just create a stereo track with the Input bus as this monitor mixer.I hope I heard you correctly.... I'm still not sure I'll have this option, but it is something I haven't tried yet.Thanks!

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Re: Cubase SX 3 Routing question

Post by devin » Thu Sep 10, 2009 12:49 am

Seeing as you're building a custom recording space, I'll go out on a limb and say upgrading your Cubase version is listed somewhere/sometime on your technology roadmap?If so, you may wish to jump to the current version of Cubase while you can still get there from SX3. I just found the SX3 --> 5 upgrade on line for $199, I'm sure it can be found cheaper. Lots of nice goodies inside 5, including the routing improvements.Personally, I waited too long to move off of Cubase LE, and the upgrade path disappeared (although Cubase 5 does bring in those old Cubase LE projects very smoothly).Just my $0.02 though...I usually try to stretch my gear $$ as far as possible...but the upgrade to 5 should last a while, and it's very stable for me so far on PC.
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Re: Cubase SX 3 Routing question

Post by hurican » Thu Sep 10, 2009 4:39 am

Sept 10, 2009, 3:49am, devin wrote:Seeing as you're building a custom recording space, I'll go out on a limb and say upgrading your Cubase version is listed somewhere/sometime on your technology roadmap?If so, you may wish to jump to the current version of Cubase while you can still get there from SX3. I just found the SX3 --> 5 upgrade on line for $199, I'm sure it can be found cheaper. Lots of nice goodies inside 5, including the routing improvements.Yep it sure is. But at the moment, I still fit into the category of "struggling musician", and I've spent the limit of what I can afford. (I still have to upgrade my mixer (the Presonus StudioLive is one of my goals), get decent studio monitors, add a number of mics to my growing collection, a nice mic / all around preamp, etc... etc...Even joining Taxi for a year will nearly send me into the red. But enough griping....I know Cubase 5 has these routing options and I sure could use them, but I've been very happy with SX 3 and can stick with it for a while without complaint. That's saying alot, since typically I fall into the "gearhead" category.My best option at the moment, is to Assign Wav Out 1/2 to the Monitor Mix in the control panel then see if SX 3 has the option to buss inputs to that.

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