FM Radio EQ

[ernstinen]

It's common knowledge that FM radio compresses the sh!t out of the music it broadcasts, but how about EQ?The reason I ask is that I've noticed a big difference listening to my car stereo between playing CDs and the same song on FM radio. It seems the broadcasts really hype the low end a lot, and possibly the high highs as well. Ironically, when I master my recordings I do something similar, except very subtly. FM EQ is NOT subtle, possibly in deference to how many people love big, booming bass to show off their sound systems at stop lights. Any ideas?Thanks in advance,Ern

[Mark Kaufman]

There is a classic rock station in Minneapolis that seems to even have a certain reverb setting on 24/7.

[waltzmastering]

A lot of stations broadcast with multi-band compression (Dynamic EQ). In addition modern day car stereos hype or have a bump around 120 hz.If your listening to a commercial cd in your car your master should exhibit the same tendencies that your favorite sounding cd's exhibit. I always listen flat.If your shooting to match a fm broadcast eq I think your shooting for a quite the moving target. I think one thing to keep in mind is that radios compresses the hell out of everything, so the more dynamic range and transients you keep in your master the better it will sound on the radio.Translation is key in any master, so it should sound good on everything across the board: boom box, ipod, car, home theater, computer speakers, conventional stereo etc.One thing that helps to make sure the final eq decisions are on the accurate side is to make them in a well tuned room with full range speakers otherwise your playing a guessing game trying to figure out the discrepancies in your listening environment.

[ernstinen]

Nov 1, 2009, 10:45am, waltzmastering wrote:A lot of stations broadcast with multi-band compression (Dynamic EQ). In addition modern day car stereos hype or have a bump around 120 hz.If your listening to a commercial cd in your car your master should exhibit the same tendencies that your favorite sounding cd's exhibit. I always listen flat.If your shooting to match a fm broadcast eq I think your shooting for a quite the moving target. I think one thing to keep in mind is that radios compresses the hell out of everything, so the more dynamic range and transients you keep in your master the better it will sound on the radio.Translation is key in any master, so it should sound good on everything across the board: boom box, ipod, car, home theater, computer speakers, conventional stereo etc.One thing that helps to make sure the final eq decisions are on the accurate side is to make them in a well tuned room with full range speakers otherwise your playing a guessing game trying to figure out the discrepancies in your listening environment.Thanks, Waltz. I'm aware of all of your points. Been in this biz since the Truman administration. Multi-band compression may explain it, but a 120 hz bump in a car stereo doesn't. I set mine flat, too, and am not comparing my mixes to FM radio. Just wonderin' what stations use technically.Best,Ern

[mazz]

Ern,I'm sure you know that just because you set your car stereo to "flat" doesn't actually make it "flat". Most consumer equipment is meant to accentuate the "smile" curve you're hearing, and whatever "magic" the FM station is doing probably serves to make that even more apparent, particularly compared to CDs.We want speakers that give us all the midrange, warts and all, so we can tell what's going on in our mixes. Most consumers want a low end buzz and a sugary high end tickle with a flattering midrange that makes voices sound good, so most consumer systems are designed that way. And radio stations must know that too and, well, they live to serve the listener, right Cheers!Mazz

[mojobone]

Hardly. They live to serve their advertisers. In my neck o' the woods nearly all the stations (except NPR and a few others) use multiband limiters to boost their signal beyond the point of overmodulation, then EQ it to try to hide the resulting distortion. This achieves the desired result of increasing their broadcast coverage, at the expense of sound quality. If you don't maintain a crest factor of 4-6dB in your mixes, the limiters can get confused and push your entire signal downwards, rather than just the peaks; a disaster for your music. caveat compresor

[waltzmastering]

One thing I notice when I listen to a good commercial or well mastered cd in my wife's car (I blew all the speakers in my truck) is that, when compared to the radio, it's fuller sounding. There's a lot more fidelity going on. If I listen to the same song/cd on the radio, the low frequencies diminish slightly because of the hyped compression, overall it seems a bit flatter in frequency response coming off the radio transmission. Any dynamics (if there were any to begin with) on the cd are diminished even further, because the radio is processing something that's all ready been processed.Before the levels on modern cd's got out of hand, the radio used to sound much better.Now a days it's sometimes hard to hear the back beat in a song coming off the radio because of the over compression.I'd assume that all station broadcast through compression and at least a 1/3 band graphic equalizer or parametric eq.

[hurican]

I've thought much the same thing when listening to the radio. I'm driving my roomates old beater which only has a radio cause my car is at the shop, so radio is all I got for the moment.But yeah, I've heard this from numerous sources. They will further compress and limit songs that have already been mastered to limit to the peak (and sometimes a little beyond) of sonic fidelity. And on older radios, like the one I've been listening to, many of the modern songs not only sound thin in the bass, but crushed. Sometimes the distortion is evident.This link is a good article, though it is dated as well. http://www.prorec.com/Articles/tabid/10 ... it.aspxThe latest .wav image will almost look like a solid black line. It takes all the musicality out of the song and (the dynamics) have to be replaced by technology.

[ernstinen]

Nov 1, 2009, 6:29pm, mazz wrote:Ern,I'm sure you know that just because you set your car stereo to "flat" doesn't actually make it "flat". Most consumer equipment is meant to accentuate the "smile" curve you're hearing, and whatever "magic" the FM station is doing probably serves to make that even more apparent, particularly compared to CDs.Yea, Mazz, that's pretty much the case. But my "stock" CD player and stereo system in my 2010 Mazda3 Sport is pretty flat (surprisingly!) when playing CDs. I may roll off about 2 db of bass if I listen when parked, but that changes when driving.Quote:We want speakers that give us all the midrange, warts and all, so we can tell what's going on in our mixes. Yup, that's why my "go to" monitors in my studio are still the classic Yamaha NS-10Ms. They translate well to almost any other system I play my mixes on, even in the Mazda.The midrange "scoop" that FM stations use is similar to the old "loudness" button on receivers. I've got a vintage Marantz preamp, and I set the EQ on it for the Yamahas at +1 bass, -1 midrange, and -1 treble. That works for me. But sometimes, when I want to hear what the mix will sound like on a "scooped" commercial system, I'll set the Marantz to flat and push the loudness button. Scoop City! It DOES sound more flattering, but is not necessarily accurate.Best Regards,Ern