Id like some help with this mix.

[matthoggard]

This song was recorded by my co-writer and I 14 years ago on DAT (remember that?). This was our band Wayward Son. All I have is the old stereo master which has been converted to mp3. I have cleaned it up with some mixing software. It was a little muddy in some freq's and trebley with way too much reverb.But this was the days of the treble junkies and huge reverby vocals.I copied the master to 3 tracks. I used a L,C,R pan arrangement to try and seperate things. The center track Ive tried to use a Bass and high mid eq to boost vocals and kick/bass guitar. This track has the low and high end cut fairly severely. (20hz and 4khz) roughly.The left and right tracks are pretty much just midrange boost to bring out the guitars and accent the vocals a little more.The recording you will hear is 10 times better than what I had to start with as far as clarity and seperation.This is my first remix so I want a few opinions before i mix it again.Remember, this is from a master stereo track so I am stuck with what was on the original recording.Question 1: Can I use a reverb effect to cancel out some of the original reverb on the master? I.E. using the same freq's and rate and shape to cause a phase cancellation.Question 2: Is there any way to fatten the low end a smidge more without it getting muddy and boomy?#3: Will an exciter help boost the high mids (for more vocal presence) or will it just make it more trebely. Take a listen, Id like some suggestions. I think I can make this a presentable recording. Some of you more experienced Engies will probably have some good info.If we need to shelve it and re-record it thats fine too but the performance on this was really nice and wed like to use it if possible.The song is called "In the Garden"http://www.taxi.com/matthoggard

[mojobone]

I'll listen, but before I do that, know that we're not discussing a remix, what you're contemplating is a re-master. There is a surprising amount that can be done, but none of it is a substitute for a decent mix of the original multi-tracks; if you have access to them, it's generally better to re-mix.Q1: unless you have a way to copy the original non-reverbed file, invert it, and mix the two, before running the resulting signal through the original reverb, the answer is no.Q2: Yes.Q3: Maybe. And maybe you should let us in on which song your post refers to...

[stoney]

to add to Mojobone's comments Q1: As mentioned by Mojobone.Q2: Try waves' Ren Bass or Max Bass, or better still the hardware version Maxx Bass. Another method to try would be very, very, very subtle use of a bit crusher. It can fatten the sound slightly but don't overdo it. Gentle over drive might help. Not to mention subtle use of an EQ, try the EQ fisrt.Q3:Linear Phase EQ all the way I would say. Easier to pick out the vocal if that's what you want to enhance. Gentle push at 3k is always a winner.You might also want to look into an M/S mastering plugin so that you can master mono and stereo signals of your file which will help the fatness side of things. The bx-digital by brainworx is excellent. www.brainworx-music.de/index.php?nav=12&um=2&lang=en

[matthoggard]

Mojo the song is mentioned at the bottom of the original post. Right above the link."In the garden"

[ernstinen]

Sept 2, 2008, 3:27pm, matthoggard wrote:Mojo the song is mentioned at the bottom of the original post. Right above the link."In the garden"Hey Matt,I listened to this on headphones, and the first thing that struck me is there's no stereo spectrum. 1.) It sounds like a mono recording. 2.) The lead vocal needs to be compressed, but since this is already mixed, you might want to "slightly" compress the whole mix.But back to #1 --- There are some programs, or if you're using a hardware unit, to add a "stereo room" to the sound and spread the mix out, and I mean WIDE! It should be a VERY short room, or ambience, because you have already don't like that there's too much reverb. I don't know if there's much you can do about the reverb that's already on there!3.) EQ. I'm sure you can add some to the whole mix and make it sound ALOT better with some judicious EQing.The tracks sound pretty good, with a uniform sound. It just needs to be "spruced up" a bit!HTH,Ern

[mojobone]

The song is called "In the Garden"Woops, sorry, missed that. I would apply a narrow EQ dip in the low mids, centered around 400 hz or so, move it around to find the sweet spot where you can pull out some mud, then compress the low end, expand the high mids leaving the highs alone, except for a smidge of BBE or exciter- the Aphex with big bottom would be my compressor choice for this; it squishes the low end down nicely with opto/soft-knee characteristics, and the exciter can restore some snap and punch, used judiciously..You'd need something else to expand the high mids, though. You might also try a fairly broad shelving EQ lift from about 2khz up. Just a decibel or two of boost to balance.I'm not hearing a lot of stereo information in this, but you may be able to widen it some, as ernstinen noted.

[ernstinen]

Sept 2, 2008, 7:07pm, mojobone wrote: a smidge of BBE or exciter- .Yup, I still use a touch of BBE and Aphex Aural Exciter rackmount units on old mixes that sound muddy. But be careful with the low end on the BBE --- you can really crank up the bottom way too much if you're not careful! But the BBE can be very useful to bring clarity to older recordings.Ern

[matthoggard]

Awesime tips fellas!Exactly the input im needing. Thanks for taking the time to listen.Matt.