If you were in the market for an Orchestra VI right now

[GBall]

EastWest's Play engine and Spitfire's new engine do not support the sample purge feature. Besides, Play libraries load very slowly in my opinion. Kontakt supports the workflow that benefits me in my template-based VEPro remote setup.

Thanks Steve for sharing. You have me thinking.

Truth is I'm currently fighting EWQL to get a particular sound, and not at all happy with it at the moment. But I feel obligated for accuracy to say that Play 6 DOES support sample purging. (Its in a little drop down menu) It does load soooo slow to me - Its around 2 TB of disk space so I have samples loading from a Buffalo which doesn't help. It may do a lot of things but so far I haven't really gotten "epic" out of it. I don't touch the symphonic orchestra patches much generally - I've been using the Hollywood Diamond packages from it.

Greg

[stevebarden]

EastWest's Play engine and Spitfire's new engine do not support the sample purge feature. Besides, Play libraries load very slowly in my opinion. Kontakt supports the workflow that benefits me in my template-based VEPro remote setup.

Thanks Steve for sharing. You have me thinking.

Truth is I'm currently fighting EWQL to get a particular sound, and not at all happy with it at the moment. But I feel obligated for accuracy to say that Play 6 DOES support sample purging. (Its in a little drop down menu) It does load soooo slow to me - Its around 2 TB of disk space so I have samples loading from a Buffalo which doesn't help. It may do a lot of things but so far I haven't really gotten "epic" out of it. I don't touch the symphonic orchestra patches much generally - I've been using the Hollywood Diamond packages from it.

Greg

Greg, let me qualify that statement about purging samples. I do understand that Play allows you to purge all of the samples, but I don't know of a way for it to load back the samples as Kontakt does when you play each note. That's the beauty of Kontakt - it will only load the samples you use, thereby keeping the memory footprint very small. If Play can accomplish that as well then I am unaware of it.

[GBall]

EastWest's Play engine and Spitfire's new engine do not support the sample purge feature. Besides, Play libraries load very slowly in my opinion. Kontakt supports the workflow that benefits me in my template-based VEPro remote setup.

Thanks Steve for sharing. You have me thinking.

Truth is I'm currently fighting EWQL to get a particular sound, and not at all happy with it at the moment. But I feel obligated for accuracy to say that Play 6 DOES support sample purging. (Its in a little drop down menu) It does load soooo slow to me - Its around 2 TB of disk space so I have samples loading from a Buffalo which doesn't help. It may do a lot of things but so far I haven't really gotten "epic" out of it. I don't touch the symphonic orchestra patches much generally - I've been using the Hollywood Diamond packages from it.

Greg

Greg, let me qualify that statement about purging samples. I do understand that Play allows you to purge all of the samples, but I don't know of a way for it to load back the samples as Kontakt does when you play each note. That's the beauty of Kontakt - it will only load the samples you use, thereby keeping the memory footprint very small. If Play can accomplish that as well then I am unaware of it.

Hey Steve,

EWQL can do that - at least partially: When you click the purge option in the Play6 menu, you get a dialog that lets you choose not just what to purge (all or certain ones) but ALSO lets you reload or reset them. I think putting it there is not exactly the most intuitive UI design that they could have made. But at least when I have "stream from disk" enabled, Play6 will reload automatically if I play something that needs them. I don't know exactly when it decides to load keyswitched articulations... I think that may partially be a host thing as for example with Sibelius I had to run through the piece at least once to get the ones I was using loaded so that it wouldn't stutter, and with Dorico it always seems pretty immediate.

Really not wanting to go out on a limb to defend EWQL right now though. I'm putting EWQL on probation. I've been listening to your advice closely as I've been spending more than half my time dealing with samples/production instead of the actual writing. One reason I switched to Dorico 3 was because of its templating system which I hope will drastically cut that down. We'll see I guess. Its kinda seeming like something Halion or Kontact bases is simpler and faster. I guess according to the title of this thread, I AM in the market for (at least one) Orchestra VI right now.

Keep sharing man,
Greg

[stevebarden]

Thanks Steve for sharing. You have me thinking.

Truth is I'm currently fighting EWQL to get a particular sound, and not at all happy with it at the moment. But I feel obligated for accuracy to say that Play 6 DOES support sample purging. (Its in a little drop down menu) It does load soooo slow to me - Its around 2 TB of disk space so I have samples loading from a Buffalo which doesn't help. It may do a lot of things but so far I haven't really gotten "epic" out of it. I don't touch the symphonic orchestra patches much generally - I've been using the Hollywood Diamond packages from it.

Greg

Greg, let me qualify that statement about purging samples. I do understand that Play allows you to purge all of the samples, but I don't know of a way for it to load back the samples as Kontakt does when you play each note. That's the beauty of Kontakt - it will only load the samples you use, thereby keeping the memory footprint very small. If Play can accomplish that as well then I am unaware of it.

Hey Steve,

EWQL can do that - at least partially: When you click the purge option in the Play6 menu, you get a dialog that lets you choose not just what to purge (all or certain ones) but ALSO lets you reload or reset them. I think putting it there is not exactly the most intuitive UI design that they could have made. But at least when I have "stream from disk" enabled, Play6 will reload automatically if I play something that needs them. I don't know exactly when it decides to load keyswitched articulations... I think that may partially be a host thing as for example with Sibelius I had to run through the piece at least once to get the ones I was using loaded so that it wouldn't stutter, and with Dorico it always seems pretty immediate.

Really not wanting to go out on a limb to defend EWQL right now though. I'm putting EWQL on probation. I've been listening to your advice closely as I've been spending more than half my time dealing with samples/production instead of the actual writing. One reason I switched to Dorico 3 was because of its templating system which I hope will drastically cut that down. We'll see I guess. Its kinda seeming like something Halion or Kontact bases is simpler and faster. I guess according to the title of this thread, I AM in the market for (at least one) Orchestra VI right now.

Keep sharing man,
Greg

Anytime I have to stop composing to twiddle with virtual instrument settings is time I can't afford. This is a deal breaker for me. I may investigate Play's purging strategy a bit more when I have a little time, but I'm not expecting the same kind of results as I get with Kontakt.

[NaeDae]

Albion/Spitfire Symphony Orchestra have more of a delicate playing style that's less in-your-face. The overall sound is pretty damn realistic, though.

Orchestral Tools have a more in-your-face sound and weren't noise-reduced as precisely as spitfire's libraries.

The Orchestra from sonuscoore is pretty nice for instant gratification but the room sound is a bit flat imo.

A library I recommend for delicate long strings is Spitfire Chamber Strings Evolutions. It's like $300 and is very easy to use without a ton of overwhelming options.

But overall keep in mind that if you want to have a workflow like on those Spitfire videos where they have 20 versions of kontakt open, you basically need a $5000-$10,000 computer or you're gonna experience a lot of overheating and crashing.

[MBantle]

Matt,

There is not one single library out there that "does it all". Every library has its strengths and weaknesses. You are correct that I use a lot of the Cinesamples libraries, but I supplement each section with various libraries depending on my needs.

For example, loud and aggressive cues like trailer pieces I will use Metropolis Ark I. When I need more lush strings I will turn to Berlin Strings. If I want really soft strings it will be Spitfire Albion IV. For special effect articulations I might use Metropolis Ark III.

Define what style of music you plan on using the library for. You may find that you need to mix and match different sections - strings, woodwinds, brass, percussion - each from different libraries. If you are just starting out with learning orchestral writing it makes sense to pick something that fits the general needs. Years ago I started with Garritan Personal Orchestra. Later I moved up to EastWest Symphonic Orchestra. Eventually I pieced together all of the Cinesample libraries one section at a time. Now I add instruments as the need arises.

Also, for me it is important to utilize Kontakt's memory-saving features such as sample purging and Vienna Ensemble Pro's disable/enable feature. EastWest's Play engine and Spitfire's new engine do not support the sample purge feature. Besides, Play libraries load very slowly in my opinion. Kontakt supports the workflow that benefits me in my template-based VEPro remote setup.

Obviously, cost is a factor, but you get what you pay for. For the best sounds and features you need to invest not only $$$ but time to learn how to use the instruments.

Best of luck!

Hi Steve,
I hope you are well. I have got a follow up question. Is there any string library that is in your opinion particularly good when it comes to 'bow release samples' (as used at the ending of a phrase - I am not sure I am using the right terminology here). I am currently working with Spitfire Studio Strings on a piece and according to the manual there is a CC for making the release more 'lush' but it still sounds too fake to me and I am a bit frustrated as I am now spending too much time on workarounds (manually fading, re-arranging to make it less audible etc.) but it does not really make me happy as you can imagine. So, is there any library you would recommend that perhaps has a keyswitch (or similar) triggering a more realistic 'release' sound?
Cheers,
Matt

[stevebarden]

Hi Steve,
I hope you are well. I have got a follow up question. Is there any string library that is in your opinion particularly good when it comes to 'bow release samples' (as used at the ending of a phrase - I am not sure I am using the right terminology here). I am currently working with Spitfire Studio Strings on a piece and according to the manual there is a CC for making the release more 'lush' but it still sounds too fake to me and I am a bit frustrated as I am now spending too much time on workarounds (manually fading, re-arranging to make it less audible etc.) but it does not really make me happy as you can imagine. So, is there any library you would recommend that perhaps has a keyswitch (or similar) triggering a more realistic 'release' sound?
Cheers,
Matt

Matt, is it possible for you to post the audio just for the string part so I can hear what you're referring to? Also, a screenshot of the midi notes (in piano roll format) along with the controllers CC1 and CC11. It may have to do with how you're editing the notes and applying the controllers.

[MBantle]

Hi Steve,
I hope you are well. I have got a follow up question. Is there any string library that is in your opinion particularly good when it comes to 'bow release samples' (as used at the ending of a phrase - I am not sure I am using the right terminology here). I am currently working with Spitfire Studio Strings on a piece and according to the manual there is a CC for making the release more 'lush' but it still sounds too fake to me and I am a bit frustrated as I am now spending too much time on workarounds (manually fading, re-arranging to make it less audible etc.) but it does not really make me happy as you can imagine. So, is there any library you would recommend that perhaps has a keyswitch (or similar) triggering a more realistic 'release' sound?
Cheers,
Matt

Matt, is it possible for you to post the audio just for the string part so I can hear what you're referring to? Also, a screenshot of the midi notes (in piano roll format) along with the controllers CC1 and CC11. It may have to do with how you're editing the notes and applying the controllers.

Hi Steve!
Thanks so much. Problem solved! It was me neglecting the power of CC11. It is all good now. Thanks so much for pointing me in the right direction!! Much appreciated.
Cheers,
Matt