Looking for some quick advice, RE: someone wanting credit

[PeteMurphy]

Hi guys,

Sorry if the title isn't descriptive enough, but I can only enter a certain amount of characters into the subject box...

I'm just looking for some advice on this -

A song I co-wrote during 50/90 (I wrote the music/melodies, my co-writer wrote the words) has been heard by someone who wants to submit it to a successful artist who is looking for songs for an album. The person who heard it has a very good relationship with the record company and says it has a chance of being used (although as we all know, these things are always a long shot).
He really likes the song, but he suggested a couple of changes that he felt were needed in order to totally 'sell' the song.

The changes he suggested involve doubling each chorus (with a slight arrangement tweak to make the choruses sound right when heard back to back, plus removing a few words from the end of the chorus), and then adding a little backing vocal hook in the pre-chorus.
He says that the way the points system works in Italy (where the song is being pitched), is that 12 points go to the song. 6 of those points go to the publisher, 3 points to the music writer, and 3 points to the lyricist.

For the changes he's suggested, he wants to take 1 point from the music writer, and one point from the lyricist (so I would get two points, the lyricist would get 2 points, and the guy who is pitching it would get two points).

Does this sound fair? It does sound a lot to give up a 1/3 share of the song for some minimal changes, but I'm not really business minded and don't know how these things work. It's a good opportunity, and I've been trying to weigh up whether it's worth moving forward and giving him what he wants.

Also, would anyone know where we would stand on retaining the rights to the original composition? And also, if the song were ever to be used elsewhere in its original form (without the changes that this guy suggested), would he still have a claim on the song.
He wants to move fairly quickly on this, as he's meeting with the record company this Monday or Tuesday.

I'm not sure if all of this makes sense. Like I said, I don't really know about business, I just write songs!
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks,
Pete.

[michael11]

Hi Pete,


Second point first,if the other version became known the original version would probably be construed as a derivative certainly as far as an audience is concerned and of course the original would owe it’s success to the new version.

As for sharing points,if the new person gets the song known then you’ve got something out of a song that was otherwise doing nothing.



To sum up,

Go for it.

That’s my off the cuff instinctive thought and in no way should be construed as legal advice,or indeed sound advice although the advice is about sounds!!!
Good luck.

Mick.

[PeteMurphy]

Thank you so much, Mick.

I really appreciate your advice, and what you are saying makes a lot of sense.

I had thought that it would be a good idea to go for it (although it's also dependent on what my co-writer thinks. I'm just waiting to hear back from her), but I guess I just wanted to hear the thoughts of someone who is outside of the situation.

Many thanks,
Pete.

[mikeymike2000]

Hey Pete,

I am not sure what 50/90 means so I am gonna leave that one alone. When you talk about having 12 points and the person is asking for 2, that is less than 1/3. (Assuming you are also the publisher or at least have a share in the publishing, you should but I don't know what deal you made with the co-writers). If you have no publishing then forget this last line. But really, who gets those 6 points? If you did a majority of the creating, you should be the publisher as well. (If you do not already have a publishing company set up, this is a great reason to do it)

Anyway: You have a song, maybe something happens with it, maybe not. If someone, anyone, comes along and does even 1% of something that transforms the song from pretty good to undeniably awesome then that one little tiny change is worth a 50/50 split.

Otherwise the song would have not gone on to ride the charts and make you millions. If that little speck of something means it goes from being #1 in your studio to #1 in the world...that seems fair that they get the same share you and the other person gets.

Now, for your original work, if it is already registered you might consider re-registering the new version with a new title. This way you all split the new version but if the original version ever gets somewhere, that is a completely different entity, albeit very similar. - However, doing this could make things really messy if both version actually go somewhere. (that would prob be unlikely though) As long as everyone agrees that "may the best arrangement prevail"... But also, if the original is already registered, you kinda have to do it this way anyway (re-register and re-title).

So, long story short, yes, it's fair. IMHO

Good luck!

[Silje]

100% of nothing or a smaller % of something... !

Go for it!

I would grab any opportunity for an artist cut with both hands, that again might lead to new possibilities for new cuts!

Good luck,

-Silje

[PeteMurphy]

Thank you, guys!

My co-writer and I have decided to move forward with it. It's still a long shot, but I really appreciate the advice.

@mikeymike2000 - 50/90 is the 50 songs in 90 days challenge that happens annually (from July to October). It's connected with the fawm (February Album Writing Month) challenge. They're a LOT of fun to do, and doing those challenges this year was a pretty life changing thing for me.

Thank you,
Pete.

[bassman]

It is actually quite common in the music biz that someone wants a cut of a song for pitching it.
That doesn't mean it's always a good idea to sign it.

If you're lucky he can make something happen, if not.........well then you've handed over a third
of your song. If he does add something musically that's worth it then great. Doubling a lead
vocal is not exactly what I would call songwriting but that's just me.

Personally I would have to have that instinctual gut feeling that this is a good situation to go with.

I've been offered this kind of deal myself once in my life but came to nothing in the end. On the other
hand I did a session for a singer some years back who signed an exclusive publishing deal with no
money upfront to a guy who had nothing but big talk and a cool suit. The big surprise was that he
did come through and landed her a cut on one of the big sellers that year.

One thing you should also get clear on is: will he get a cut of the track without his changes.

My advice: trust your instinct and ask lots of questions.