(MORE) NEW LYRICS -- PLEASE HELP: "Say The Words"

[joshuaarmstrong]

Later this week, I'm going back into the studio to put final touches on "Say The Words." I have a variety of ideas to make the song all it can be, but I'd really like to get your feedback. Please take a listen and provide an honest critique on the production, vocals and songwriting. I really appreciate constructive criticism!Say The Words (formerly called "Just The Age")Copyright 2007. Joshua Armstrong.Verse1:As the days go bye I watch my life flash before my eyesSo young this is the perfect timeNot to old and not to young just the age to becomeThe one I’ll grow to beChorus:Say the words that I long to hearDon’t leave always stay nearTake it all away I let go of fearI will hold you close my dearVerse 2:One day I’ll look at this and maybe I’ll laughBut it’s all part of growing up and making the pastYou almost drowned on your wayCrossing the bridge you almost burntChorus:Say the words that I long to hearDon’t leave always stay nearTake it all away I let go of fearI will hold you close I’ll stay nearStream The Songhttp://www.taximusic.com/song.php?song_id=8429 ... ueDownload The Song (higher quality)http://www.taximusic.com/song.php?song_ ... ----UPDATE ON 12/18/07:After receiving feedback from you all on Dec. 17, I made the following revisions. I plan to re-record the song on Friday, so let me know what you think of the changes!Say The WordsCopyright 2007. By Joshua Armstrong.Verse 1:As the days go by, memories flash in my mindLike when we first met, you still comfort my soulYou inspire me ... to learn, grow, and findWe're still young, this is our timeChorus:Say the words I long to hearDon't leave, always stay nearYou're safe, let go of fearI will hold you close, my dearVerse 2:When we look back on these years, maybe we'll laughMistakes are part of growing up ... creating the pastHardships will come, but we’re worth the fightWe're still young, our future is brightChorus:Say the words I long to hearDon't leave, always stay nearYou're safe, let go of fearI will hold you close, my dearBridge:Someday, I’ll be yours and you’ll be mineWe can fly away, lead life our own wayLet's cross the bridge we almost burnedTry again with everything we learnedChorus:Say the words I long to hearDon't leave, always stay nearYou're safe, let go of fearI will hold you close, my dear--------------------------------------------------------------ANOTHER UPDATE12/19/07 at 9 p.m. Pacific: OK, another revision. I hope this is yet another improvement. Might be hard to completely understand the song structure without actually hearing an update version of the phrasing, but I'm confident I can pull it off when I sing it and make it believable. Please let me know what you think!--------------------------------------------------------------Say The WordsCopyright 2007. By Joshua Armstrong.Verse 1:As the days go by, memories flash in my mindWhen we first met, you comforted my soulYou inspired me ... to learn, grow, and findOccasionally dreams collide, but we still have timePre-Chorus:Despite what we've been through I remain devoted to youChorus:Let me hold you close, my dearTogether we will battle fearDon’t leave, always stay nearSay the words I long to hearVerse 2:When we look back on these years, maybe we'll laughMistakes are part of growing up ... creating the pastHardships will come, but we're worth the fightWe're still young, our future is brightPre-Chorus:Despite what we've been through I remain devoted to youChorus:Let me hold you close, my dearTogether we will battle fearDon’t leave, always stay nearSay the words I long to hearBridge:As lonely nights passed, I discovered what I lackedThen our separate paths finally circled backNow let's cross the bridge we almost burnedWe can try again with all that we learnedPre-Chorus:Despite what we've been through I remain devoted to youChorus:Let me hold you close, my dearTogether we will battle fearDon’t leave, always stay nearSay the words I long to hear

[hummingbird]

Hi Joshua, how are you? Nice to have a look at something you're working on! As the days go byI watch my life flash before my eyes (I could be wrong, but in a sense this phrase implies having a considerable amount of life to remember - in other words, being older. "Watch" is also passive while "flash" implies movement.)So young this is the perfect timeNot too old and not too young just the age to becomeThe one I’ll grow to be(now I'm expecting a payoff to a chorus that's going to talk about this young singer 'becoming' - what they long to be, or dream of being.)Say the words that I long to hearDon’t leave always stay near(I don't know who you are talking to - nothing was set up in the verse to let me know anyone was there.)Take it all away I let go of fear(take what away? in the verse you were talking about growing & about this being the perfect time - now you've introduced fear and I don't know why)I will hold you close my dear(who will you hold close?)One day I’ll look at this and maybe I’ll laughBut it’s all part of growing up and making the past (what?)(Here I don't know what "it" is. What is part of growing up? What is making the past... do ?)You almost drowned on your way Crossing the bridge you almost burnt(this is a nice image. I don't know if you can "almost" burn a bridge. In the chorus, you are begging them to stay, here you seem to be angry.)What I feel is that you have some good imagery & some great ideas -- but too many for one song. Either the song is about "becoming the one I'll grow to be" - which is a very neat premise for a song; or it's about "someone crossing the bridge they've burned" another good idea. Each verse has to stay true to the one idea for the song, and each verse has to pay off into a conclusion (chorus) that brings it all together. The intro to the song is a little long - try to keep it to 15 secs. For ballads, I often try to have just a 2 bar intro. The verse is very slow, there are too many pauses between words. The chorus is better. I think the song could be at least 10 or 20 bpms faster. I used to get the same feedback (I love sad & slow), so I would have to push myself to sing the song at a faster speed than felt comfortable a few times to see how far I could go. Especially since it's very hard to pitch slow ballads. Midtempo & up is better.Very nice vocals, and very nice harmonies suitable for pop. I think at a faster speed the whole thing would come together better. There's a synth or a guitar with a lot of reverb that kinda pulls the ear, in the chorus, I'd back that off. With production, go clean & simple and trust the vocals to carry the song, as they do here. IMO, other than speed & cleaning up production a little, the music works. Just need to figure out what story you are telling with the words.Hope all this isn't too overwhelming. This is just my uneducated opinion, feel free to keep or sweep. I have no doubt you are very talented. Don't be discouraged, and never give up!cheersHummin'bird

[jh]

Quote:there are too many pauses between words.I think pauses are a good thing, but the phrasing could be better.For example in the chorus you sing: Don´t leave always....stay nearmaybe it would sound more consistent if it was like: Don´t leave.....always stay near.You sing well, but the vocal sound could use a de-esser IMHO Then I would emphasize the piano a little more, add a few licks etc. Something along the lines of Norah Jones for example. - JH

[billg]

Hey Joshua, cool song! I can't really offer much in the way of feedback on the song itself, I tend to either like something a lot or not too much & have trouble with in depth critiques. I like this song alot! One thing I will mention though is on the production side and along the lines of what jh had to say. There are some "s" problems and also some harshness in the upper freq. ( reminds me of an SP C1 mic which sometimes has this effect on some vocals) I have been struggling with this myself. I don't want to get this thread off track so I'll post this in the "gear" section also, but; I've been seriously thinking that I needed to try some other microphones lately to smooth & round out my vocals. There are a couple of choices of well reviewed/received mics that may help. They are inexpensive and offer return if they don't work for you. Check the gear & tech section, I'll post there so this thread can stay focused on your song!-

[djdeweese]

Hey-- Got your PM and though I'd just respond in the thread. I like the vibe and I think the production value is pretty high. I have a couple typos to point out (you'll have to excuse my days in the writing lab): "Bye" means farewell, while "by" is a preposition meaning to pass a certain point or thing, so I think you mean "days go by," unless you're making a pun. Also, it should be not "too" old instead of "to" old. Otherwise, I'd agree with Hummingbird that the lyrics may a little more tightening up to really make a strong statement. I was a bit confused in the chorus by the switch from "Don’t leave" to "Take it all away" to "I will hold you close I’ll stay near," because the implication of the it in "take it all away" could apply to the person you're asking to stay as easily as it could the "fear." Lyrics are tough, but they can be the thing that really makes a song deliver a powerful statement.As always, these are merely my impressions. As I said the vibe and production are strong, and you may get forwards with what you have, so take what you need and leave the rest behind. Good luck--

[arkjack]

Hi JoshuaI had a listen through one time. I concur with pretty much all of what Vicki has pointed out. The lyric needs more focus and polish to really tell a story and make it clear who the characters are. As it is now, I can't really tell you in a sentence what the song is about,(the "nutshell test") who it is being sung to, and who is singing it, and what the singer is really feeling. There are some nice ideas in the peripherals, but no one theme dominates it and thus it feels very abstract. I also agree with Hummingbird on the points that since its a ballad, you have too long an intro, and the speed is very slow and could stand to be sped up both in terms of adding energy to the song, which may go hand in hand with the lyric re-write. The speed will also cut the time, which may then allow for a structural change of adding a bridge, or a short bridge pre chorus leading into the last chorus. Melodically and harmonically I like the tune and the feel and the chord changes. The low register of melodies in the verse should build a little more in the last line to get to your soaring notes in the chorus. Looking at the title, the hook line "say the words" at the opening works. I'm hearing in my mind's ear, Say the words as the last line of the chorus instead of stay near, and the melody rising to soaring notes instead of falling.Production wise it sounds great to my ears, but I'm weak in that area. I agree a more pronounced keyboard part with fills in the dead spots could benefit the production.Hope all that helps. As Bird said, its my uneducated opinion, and the disclaimer of Article VI, Paragraph B II (a) (3) applies in that I may not have a clue as to what I'm talking about. Sometimes wish the Taxi screener would chime in and critique the critiques to let us know that between us we are giving good or bad feedback.ArkJack

[joshuaarmstrong]

Thank you for all the feedback above. Based on the helpful advice and critiques, I went back and did some re-writing in an attempt to make the theme more cohesive.Please consider the lyrics below and let me know what you think! If you guys like it, I'll probably end up re-recording it on Friday.----------------Say The WordsCopyright 2007. By Joshua Armstrong.Verse 1:As the days go by, memories flash in my mindLike when we first met, you still comfort my soulYou inspire me ... to learn, grow, and findWe're still young, this is our timeChorus:Say the words I long to hearDon't leave, always stay nearYou're safe, let go of fearI will hold you close, my dearVerse 2:When we look back on these years, maybe we'll laughMistakes are part of growing up ... creating the pastHardships will come, but we’re worth the fightWe're still young, our future is brightChorus:Say the words I long to hearDon't leave, always stay nearYou're safe, let go of fearI will hold you close, my dearBridge:Someday, I’ll be yours and you’ll be mineWe can fly away, lead life our own wayLet's cross the bridge we almost burnedTry again with everything we learnedChorus:Say the words I long to hearDon't leave, always stay nearYou're safe, let go of fearI will hold you close, my dear

[hummingbird]

Hi Joshua -- now the lyrics are more cohesive, telling one story. Good job. And kudos to you for being willing to listen to feedback! That's a hallmark of success in my book.I'm not by any means God's gift to lyric writing, but I want to urge you to work on this more.There is a "timing" issue... verse one says you are together, she comforts you, inspires you; chorus says, tell me you love me, let me hold you, don't be afraid (what is it she shouldn't be afraid of); verse 3 says we're together & we'll make it through the hard times; the bridge says "someday I'll be yours and you'll be mine" which seems to contadict the rest of the story. If you are, for example, high school sweethearts, then perhaps it would make sense, but we don't know that... it's not in the lyric.I encourage you to go further, go deeper. Challenge yourself to get into the soul of what you are trying to say, get underneath the words. Who is it you are talking to? What does she look like? Why did you fall in love with her, why does she need comfort... use imagery to convey your emotion.I also think you should have a look at the lyrics for High School Musical. Your lyrics seem teen pop to me, and I think that you need to speak in the language of that age group (i.e. "comfort" is not something teens typically say). I don't want to rewrite your work, but here's sort of what I mean...(if I could tell you how I feel)(I'd say) you inspire me (with every step)(and I want to watch you) becomeThe one you'll grow to beSomeday, I’ll be yours and you’ll be mineSomeday, we'll fly away, lead life our own waySomeday, we'll da da daSomeday, just SAY THE WORD.JMHOwarmlyHummin'bird

[ciskokidd]

Hi Joshua,First of all your new lyric is so much better. I agree with Vikki that if you go in and rework a couple of lines to fix the "time" issues this will be a very solid lyric.Until the new lyrics are recorded I don't want to comment too much on the melody. The one thing that I think you might benefit from however is in the chorus. I would start singing your melody on beat one. The song's power is diluted I think by waiting for that guitar chord to ring out before you start singing. It would also let you hold out some notes for a longer duration which would give the song even more of a lift.That's my two cents for now.I'm anxious to hear the new lyric set to music.Best,Cisco

[arkjack]

I concur with Vicki and cisco on the time pov in the bridge, maybe try it from the past tense. Now I'm yours, you are mine we crossed a bridge we almost burned. I still think 'say the words' is the last line of the chorus, not 'my dear'. You are much more on target, if I do the nutshell test. I would say this is a song ....about a newly united young couple affirming their resolve to stay together and keep their love fresh and strong. Looking forward to hearing the next draft.ArkJack