Orchestral "Happy/Quirky" review needed

[ckbarlow]

Hi, all:A piece of mine just got rejected for the recent Happy/Fun listing:HAPPY/UPBEAT/FUN INSTRUMENTALS are needed by a successful Production Music Library/Publisher that has signed and placed tons of TAXI writers/songs over the years. This company will be looking for material that would be great for Feature Films and TV/Radio/Commercials. The tone can be quirky and comedic, light and airy, bouncy and silly, etc. Primarily, the focus will be on spare instrumentation that features clever dynamics and melodic "moments". The range is wide here stylistically, with the focus being on the overall tone. Nothing dark, dramatic or moody for this one - only happy and fun. There are no arrangement restrictions here, but be sure the instrumentation isn't too thick or lush. The performances/production must be excellent and the recordings need to be Broadcast Quality (great home recordings should be fine). Pieces should not exceed 4 min. in length and they need to have clear endings - no fades.I got two specific pieces of feedback but I'd love to get more so that I can make this one as good as I can.Please visit www.taxi.com/ckbarlow/ and listen to Quirky 1. Thank you very much -- and I will happily return the favor on your tunes; just direct me to them.CK

[brindabella]

CK, I am not a good judge. Cant be the sound, it sounds wonderful. Perhaps it is not enough upbeat and happy for what they want_? Too subdued?

[andreh]

Well-done piece; lots of character. 3 reasons it might not have gotten forwarded:a. Although it has fun and bouncy elements, it also has some dark melodic turns - especially in the first few lines.b. It doesn't sound very realistic. It would certainly benefit from a nice convolution reverb in some of the dryer spots, and perhaps more dynamics built into individual parts.c. The mix is a bit toppy/bright, mostly because your high-frequency instruments (glocks, bells, etc.) are too loud. This also hurts the realism of the overall sound since these instruments are usually relatively quiet in a real orchestral mix...they still cut through due to their high frequency content.HTH,André

[ibanez468]

Hey CK!This is a nice piece. Only thing is, everything sounds "in-your-face", which, IMO, is not necessarily a bad thing, but it doesn't have that big "orchestra hall" sound/feel. And I suppose that does have alot to do with everything sounding so dry. What library are you using? I think in the future, you're definitely gonna hafta' throw some 'verb on each section of the orchestra for a more realistic sound. Light verb in the front section, a bit more in the mid sections, and even more in the percussion section. Ya' know, it's front ta' back thing as far as reverb is concerned.Obviously, there's a certain way that the screeners are probably accustomed to hearing an orchestra. Any other way is probably not acceptable. I like your "dry" sound myself. But, unfortunately, I don't hand out the forwards. ibanez468

[ckbarlow]

OK, this is all really, really helpful. I own the MOTU Symphonic Library but in my experiments with it, it's a memory hog and a pain in the ass to use. So I used the instruments built into Logic. I know, I know. They aren't horrible but they aren't a dedicated orch lib.And this... I think it's the first orchestral thing I've attempted for TAXI, and I definitely was going for that spare, in-your-face sound because of what the listing said about "not too lush, spare," etc.Now maybe you see what I meant when I referenced "working really hard compositionally and missing the mark with production." So, my marching orders are:- volume and reverb more closely modeling the orchestral seating chart (rather than emphasizing the soloist of the moment)- reexamine the melody to make sure it's truly happy/quirky.The screener's comment was that the woodwind samples were subpar and there wasn't enough reverb. So I'd say this is a good consensus. Thanks very much, and I realized later that it may have looked like I hijacked your happy thread, Ibz, so I'm sorry about that. I just want to get better and I don't know how else except to ask the people who got thru. I really had a crappy last few days (unrelated to music) and I was struggling hard to keep my chin up after getting this return - because I thought I had a winner here. (Don't we always.)Thanks all 3 of you.

[ideascapes]

CK,You've already gotten some good advice here. Bottom line is the instruments sound close mic'd and that's not common for this setting, which is orchestral. The right reverb and mic position (if that's an option in your library) can fix what you have; your composition is quite good and contains many of the elements in the listing.Surprisingly, I did get a forward on this one (I don't usually record much orchestral stuff) and I've made it visible on my page, if you'd like to check it out. Title is "Smiling 'cross the Finish Line." http://www.taxi.com/ideascapesVince

[cameron]

This is not my specialty, but I thought the instruments sounded fine. I thought it sounded more, well "quirky" than "fun". Sounded a bit like 60's sitcom situational background music, like when "I Dream of Jeannie" is sneaking around outside the house and peeking in the window to see what "master" is up to with the girl he just brought home... just before she turns him into a cement statue (or is that "Bewitched"?)Cam

[ckbarlow]

OK, as I type a remix is uploading in which I made volume and reverb adjustments to instrument families per the orch layout. The strings are near 0; the woods range in the -4 to -6; percussion is in the -8 to -10 range. Correspondingly the reverbs got turned up per family, per distance from the conductor/audience. Next time I try an orch arrangement, I'll begin with that in mind; that'll make the end mixing process much easier anyway.

[heinsite]

hi CK--well, to "one up" my friend cam up there, i HAVE no specialty...but...just listening for the first time, HAS to be your new one, as i can't imagine ANY problems with this quality piece!i listened to many of the forwards today on the other page--and damn if this is not a beautifully done piece of music--a real work of art, very wonderful composition with all the bells and whistles of a very nice symphony...and that is probably why you weren't sent through....it's whimsical for sure, but IMHO in a more "adult" kind of way.but damn, this is wonderfully played, wonderfully produced and a top notch musical gem. you'll definitely get through for something else...all the best,warren

[ibanez468]

Feb 17, 2009, 7:22pm, ckbarlow wrote:Thanks very much, and I realized later that it may have looked like I hijacked your happy thread, Ibz, so I'm sorry about that. I just want to get better and I don't know how else except to ask the people who got thru. I really had a crappy last few days (unrelated to music) and I was struggling hard to keep my chin up after getting this return - because I thought I had a winner here. (Don't we always.)Thanks all 3 of you.Oh, hey CK, don't even worry about it. I didn't even give it a thought, cause it didn't feel like a hijack ta' me. You were asking legitimate questions, and getting feedback. So, I don't have a problem with it.And lemme' tell ya' somethin'....you DO have a winner there...for sure it's a winner. I listened to it about 5 or 6 times in a row. It just needs a little treatment, and I'm sure it'll fly next time around. So, keep your head up! This one'll get through eventually. No doubt! ibanez468