Use of Samples, Loops

[ragani]

As many of you are doing, I am working to develop my ability to write more pieces for music library placements. Twenty-four down, 976 more to go (goal = 1000 quality tracks)! I’ve been using ProTools (I’m a Mac user for music production) for all our commercial CD recordings, and I’ve decided to try out GarageBand (via iLife purchase) to get a touch more experience with faster loop and midi creation for songs. My goal is to eventually move to Logic Express (or the full Logic program). So I have a few questions—are the loops and samples that we find in GarageBand able to be used for commercial sales for TV, films, etc.? Do we have restrictions for selling productions when we’ve used their unaltered samples within our music productions? Once I get familiar with a few things in GarageBand, then I’d like to be able to import some sample sounds to play with and experiment for drums, ear candies, etc. Is EZ Drummer something that could help with additional drum sounds for midi use in GB? Are their loops and samples free and clear for commercials sales to TV, films, etc.?Are samples and loops purchased or free offers through companies such as Groove Monkee (www.groovemonkee.com) or BetaMonkey (www.betamonkeymusic.com) able to be used free and clear for commercial sales too? (And yes, I realize you can’t just resell their loops as is—I’m referring to resale of them when used in my music production.) Has TAXI ever posted listings that don’t allow for use of samples that are free and clear? And what about the free samples found at SoundSnap (www.soundsnap.com)? I read on their website that they are available for commercial use, but I’m wondering if any of you have experience with using these samples for commercial music production.This is just a beginning… after years of PT and acoustic recordings I’m excited to expand my productions into the world of midi, samples, and mixed music production. I’m just hoping I can figure out how to hook up everything up and get off and running!!Thanks so much,Raags

[mazz]

Look at each company's license, virtually all of them post it somewhere on their website. Some restrict usage in music libraries or require that there are other elements combined so the loop is never isolated. Big Fish audio, for instance, distributes a lot of "constrction kit" type loop libraries and they have a pretty restrictive policy on those regarding music libraries. It's somewhat understandable since a "composer" could just combine the loops and call the compostion theirs and license it to a library. East West used to limit library usage but now they only require that the loop be combined with 2 or 3 other elements at any one time. Spectrasonics (Stylus RMX) doesn't limit the usage at all, as I remember.So it's all over the map. Buyer beware! Read the fine print if you think any of your pieces will ever end up on TV (and I hope they do!)With the Garageband loops, I think you're in good shape but don't take my word for it, read the license agreement. At the Road Rally, someone told me they heard an unadorned Garageband loop in a major TV reality show!!Good luck, sounds like you're well on your way to 1K!!! Mazz

[jh]

Quote:someone told me they heard an unadorned Garageband loop in a major TV reality showI read that in Umbrella (Rihanna´s song) the beat is a loop taken from Garageband.- JH

[hummingbird]

I bought some Beta Monkey loops early last year in hopes that they would bring my film/tv music up to the next level. I was disappointed to learn that the obvious use of drum loops (even good quality like BM) is not acceptable in film/tv. Now, on the other hand, I don't think I had the skill to use the loops in such a way that they wouldn't sound so 'loopy' - but I don't know how far you can get with them. The other issue is... drum loops come recorded already & you cannot separate the parts. So if you get the feedback that the kick is too heavy in the mix, all you can do is work with the levels on the entire loop. I wish I'd known to take the money I spent buying 3 different sets of loops... and put it towards EZ Drummer. That's what I would recommend.HTHH'Bird

[mazz]

The thing about drum loops, MIDI or audio, is that you still have to construct a drum part that sounds like a drummer would have played it (if that's what you're going for or what the piece needs). The more options of fills, endings, intros, ride cymbal grooves, etc. they give you within one set of loops, the better to make good sounding drum parts with.Even a stereo mix of a drum loop be eq'd and filtered to change or alter or enhance it's characteristics, to a point. It's kind of like mastering a stereo mix only on the drums instead of the entire mix.Also there's the software Recycle which can be used to chop up the loops and change the tempos, chop them up and re-arrange them, etc. Most DAWs and some samplers have similar functionality these days.The great thing about EZ drummer is that it comes with a ton of MIDI loops which doesn't limit the tempo as much as a REX file or an Acid or AppleLoop file. You can also mix the individual drums and even send them to seperate outputs and process them individually. Also, they have just put out EZ player which, in effect, translates MIDI loops to EZ Drummer format. In other words, if you have a GM mapped MIDI file, it will translate it on the fly so it can trigger EZ drummer with no tweaking on your part. And it's Free! The EZ Drummer Expanders sound great and there are companies such as Groove Monkee that sell MIDI loops pre-mapped to EZ drummer.Blah, Blah, Blah.............. Mazz

[ragani]

That's great information, Mazz... I knew you'd likely be the one to speak to about this tech stuff, and I really appreciate the notes and words of advice you posted. Of course, it does make sense that sample uses would be all over the map, so I will just continue to read the "fine print". Looks like EZ Drummer might be the best option to start with, to get my feet wet with the experience of creating my own rhythms as such. Thanks again!! Thanks also to H'Bird-- that makes sense about loops, and I didn't know that. My "homemade" loops from PT are all editable, and it didn't even occur to me that a purchased loop wouldn't be able to be edited. So thanks for that heads up with purchases. Me thinks the EZ Drummer might be the way to go once I get my little GB up and running. Raags

[matto]

Quote:Looks like EZ Drummer might be the best option to start with, to get my feet wet with the experience of creating my own rhythms as such. Thanks again!! Hey Ragani,if you're thinking about getting EZ Drummer, I would strongly recommend you also check out XLN Audio's Addictive Drums before you make your purchase. It's a little more money, but IMHO (and the opinion of most who have used both) smokes EZD.They have a downloadable demo version so you can try before you buy.mattoP.S. Just for clarification...I have no affiliation whatsoever with XLN...and I DO think EZD is very good.

[mazz]

Matto,Are you using Addictive Drums right now? EZ Drummer is pretty awesome so Addictive must be, well addictive!Mazz

[matto]

Quote:I bought some Beta Monkey loops early last year in hopes that they would bring my film/tv music up to the next level. I was disappointed to learn that the obvious use of drum loops (even good quality like BM) is not acceptable in film/tv. Now, on the one hand, I don't think I had the skill to use the loops in such a way that they wouldn't sound so 'loopy'... Hey Vikki,I think that last sentence might be the key...as well as that word "obvious"... I have certainly used many a drum loop in songs that ended up in film or tv. But of course I tweaked the loops, put them together to create a realistic flow, added extra hits on top when needed etc etc to make it sound like a real drummer performed the whole song. It still takes work to make it sound real, and in fact more than that, it takes experience. No product can really replace that, no matter how amazing...

[matto]

Quote:Matto,Are you using Addictive Drums right now? EZ Drummer is pretty awesome so Addictive must be, well addictive!MazzWell not this very second...I'm typing right now . But yeah I got it recently and it's spectacular. The main difference to EZD is it's faster and more flexible.