Giving a producer co-writer credit

[sgs4u]

Quote:Well, I'm not sure a co-writer credit means he shouldn't get paid for "producing". Again, it depends on what he's doing... a producer can wear a lot of hats. Yeah I'm with you on this one Stick. There are many ways to make deals with producers. If someone isn't strong enough to produce their own music, then they need to get the producer's best work. Whatever it takes to acquire that from a producer and/or musicians, is worth considering. The whole "work for hire" thing is not conducive to teamwork, or creating the best possible piece of music, at least from my perspective. But I also know it's a big can of worms that a lot of people get very uncomfortable discussing. And that is... only my opinion.

[bruciekins]

Surely it all depends on what this producer can bring to the table. If it's Mutt Lange, give him a co-write before he even hears the song. If it's some guy you met in the pub, don't.

[elser]

Asia, you might listen to his ideas first, see if you think they do make the melody stronger. There's a guy in L.A. who's notorious for this, he's got a small track record which sounds impressive to many people and he uses this to make his clients think that his musical ideas are more commercial. I've done a few sessions for him and I've heard quite a few productions he's done for others and I don't think his musical contributions are all that great. He's a decent producer as far knowing the tools in his studio and getting a good professional sound but his songwriting is mediocre, why else would he be attaching himself to all these other songwriters rather than write and sell his own songs? Checkout your producers ideas and make up your own mind about whether they truly make your songs stronger, if they do pay him for it, if they don't, just tell him to be a producer.

[daffsongwriter]

Quote:Thanks for all these great tips guys.What I've concluded from all this, is that I need to be really specific with a producer before beginning to work together about what he considers co-writing (it seems different people have different definitions of what constitutes this), and also that if we are going to agree to a co-writer credit, it will be in lieu of any upfront payment for the producer's services.And to put this in writing!Thanks!Hi, sorry I have come in on this thread now, but on reading through, its actually answered a question I would have had tonight a the studio. I am having a meeting with the Manager of a recording studio, I have never had that experience. Naturally I have some questions for him and have put a thread on recently myself, but I had not thought about the co-writing topic so am really grateful for your thread. Thank you. I am also new to this.Good luck asiabackpacker.Daff x

[daffsongwriter]

Quote:Asia, you might listen to his ideas first, see if you think they do make the melody stronger. There's a guy in L.A. who's notorious for this, he's got a small track record which sounds impressive to many people and he uses this to make his clients think that his musical ideas are more commercial. I've done a few sessions for him and I've heard quite a few productions he's done for others and I don't think his musical contributions are all that great. He's a decent producer as far knowing the tools in his studio and getting a good professional sound but his songwriting is mediocre, why else would he be attaching himself to all these other songwriters rather than write and sell his own songs? Checkout your producers ideas and make up your own mind about whether they truly make your songs stronger, if they do pay him for it, if they don't, just tell him to be a producer.Oh I say, another good point - my keyboard/vocalist tutor who I collaborate with said last night similar lines, not all producers are musicians, their good at their engineering but not necessarily the best to work with on melodies etc, so thank you to you too for raising that point - something I can bear in mind at my meeting tonight.Thanks.Daff x

[diogenes]

Hey, I thought I'd throw my two cents in as this issue has came up alot in my career ( I use that term Loosley). My opinion of what constitutes co-writing is something that altered the music rather than dressed it up. For instance, if when you play your song with just guitar and voice are you doing anything the producer or co-writer came up with? In other words, harmonies and arrangements do not constitute co-writing, IMO. After all, if the producer was merely recording what you brought to the table, then he's just an engineer. Producers are expected to suggest harmonies, arrangements, etc, because they are PRODUCING your song. Thats their job.