Hip hop track for review

[ig88]

Feb 19, 2009, 12:54pm, partyofone wrote:Hey bro,Been on a hip-hop piece myself recently. I think you have a very cool piece going and here's my 2 cents.I think biggest thing is to take any verb off the drums (especially claps) because most modern hip-hop I hear has super dry drums. I agree on removing vocals.For drums sounds I can't rave enough about modernbeats.com. $40 is going to land you a gaggle of SUPER high quality hip hop sounds that are used in chart topping hits. (I sound like a salesman ha ha)- Would you consider this track as a "current style"? Yes and no.. not really what I hear on radio but not necessarily dated sounding either- Is the ending considered a "button ending"? not sure on that one.. I'd think you'd want to end on a drum hit- Does the "gangster lead" sound too dated (I think it might be coming back??) no- Does the vocal sample violate the definition of an instrumental track? no- Does the clarinet violate the definition of hip hop? no (a lot of Dr. Dre uses tons or orchestral stuff)- I feel like I need to add a crash (or other washy element) in the beginning of each chorus (needs to pop more in contrast with the previous part) .. not sure on that oneI agree on the comment about needing to be more rhythmically focused. I'm hearing too much verb somewhere in the mix that is bothering me a bit. Just my opin though.You obviously have chops man. Good luck!If you pay for samples you should not be a producer. Field record and process samples through effects. Seriously no reverb on drums?Are you kidding? The first sign of beginner production is a dry drum kit.

[partyofone]

Well, to each his own I guess.. but I find it impressive that the following songs use the modernbeats drum sounds:Beyonce - "Single Ladies"Chris Brown - "With You"Britney Spears - "Piece of Me"Rihanna - "Hate That I Love You"Of course everyone has their own taste but I consider them pretty successful producers. ;-)And maybe no reverb at all isn't quite right but at least shorter tails with a small room size. IMHO of course though.

[slideboardouts]

Feb 19, 2009, 2:36pm, ig88 wrote:If you pay for samples you should not be a producer. Field record and process samples through effects. Thats a pretty bold and sweeping statement. Not to mention incorrect. Pollow wrote the majority of Ushers last big hit using apple loops, Rhianna's hit "Umbrella" used a garageband drum loop, and as Patrick mentioned Modern Beatz loops and samples are used quite a bit. In fact, a recent ludacris single was done using a horn loop from modern beatz. And that beyonce song, "Single Ladies" I think is what it is called, uses clap samples from modern beatz.There is nothing wrong with buying and using loops and samples, it makes your compositions more dynamic if used properly. What if you need a didgeridoo? I don't even know where to find a didgeridoo, much less a didgeridoo player Thats where buying loops and samples really becomes handy...it gives you access to elements you otherwise wouldn't have (not to mention better gear to record them with). Feb 19, 2009, 2:36pm, ig88 wrote:Seriously no reverb on drums?Are you kidding? The first sign of beginner production is a dry drum kit. Again, you are incorrect. It really depends on the application. A real "sign" of beginner "production" is not using the appropriate tools for the application. Very dry or even completely dry drum kits are used on some very big hits and frequently used library cues.-Steve

[ciskokidd]

Feb 19, 2009, 2:36pm, ig88 wrote:Feb 19, 2009, 12:54pm, partyofone wrote:Hey bro,Been on a hip-hop piece myself recently. I think you have a very cool piece going and here's my 2 cents.I think biggest thing is to take any verb off the drums (especially claps) because most modern hip-hop I hear has super dry drums. I agree on removing vocals.For drums sounds I can't rave enough about modernbeats.com. $40 is going to land you a gaggle of SUPER high quality hip hop sounds that are used in chart topping hits. (I sound like a salesman ha ha)- Would you consider this track as a "current style"? Yes and no.. not really what I hear on radio but not necessarily dated sounding either- Is the ending considered a "button ending"? not sure on that one.. I'd think you'd want to end on a drum hit- Does the "gangster lead" sound too dated (I think it might be coming back??) no- Does the vocal sample violate the definition of an instrumental track? no- Does the clarinet violate the definition of hip hop? no (a lot of Dr. Dre uses tons or orchestral stuff)- I feel like I need to add a crash (or other washy element) in the beginning of each chorus (needs to pop more in contrast with the previous part) .. not sure on that oneI agree on the comment about needing to be more rhythmically focused. I'm hearing too much verb somewhere in the mix that is bothering me a bit. Just my opin though.You obviously have chops man. Good luck!If you pay for samples you should not be a producer. Field record and process samples through effects. Seriously no reverb on drums?Are you kidding? The first sign of beginner production is a dry drum kit. Come on man, almost all modern producers use samples that they paid for. That's why sample libraries are so popular.This is true especially in hip-hop.And yes while a completely dry kit is not happening, modern hip-hop is much more in your face with the drums which means they are using reverb very sparingly.Best,Cisko

[ig88]

Feb 19, 2009, 4:09pm, slideboardouts wrote:Feb 19, 2009, 2:36pm, ig88 wrote:If you pay for samples you should not be a producer. Field record and process samples through effects. Thats a pretty bold and sweeping statement. Not to mention incorrect. Pollow wrote the majority of Ushers last big hit using apple loops, Rhianna's hit "Umbrella" used a garageband drum loop, and as Patrick mentioned Modern Beatz loops and samples are used quite a bit. In fact, a recent ludacris single was done using a horn loop from modern beatz. And that beyonce song, "Single Ladies" I think is what it is called, uses clap samples from modern beatz.There is nothing wrong with buying and using loops and samples, it makes your compositions more dynamic if used properly. What if you need a didgeridoo? I don't even know where to find a didgeridoo, much less a didgeridoo player Thats where buying loops and samples really becomes handy...it gives you access to elements you otherwise wouldn't have (not to mention better gear to record them with). Feb 19, 2009, 2:36pm, ig88 wrote:Seriously no reverb on drums?Are you kidding? The first sign of beginner production is a dry drum kit. Again, you are incorrect. It really depends on the application. A real "sign" of beginner "production" is not using the appropriate tools for the application. Very dry or even completely dry drum kits are used on some very big hits and frequently used library cues.-Steve I apologize for being "bold" i suppose when some one is passionate about their perspective they might express it that way. Maybe we are talking about different things, i am talking about hip hopMADLIBBlockheadElighImmortal Technique That is some flawless production. You are referencing "candy machine" beats that yes sell heavily to our mislead youth who only want a solid 808 and a clap so they can grind on a shallow jock and not spill their cheap can of Pabst. How are you a producer if you use a loop from Garage band? That is a DAW that is given to mac users for free. If my cat had opposable thumbs i could teach it to drag a loop from garage band. And a Digg-a-dooo? we are also on a different page. I am talking about drum loops. Of course every track needs a different approach depending on what you are trying to do. But Hip Hop genre only using dry hits? That is a bold statement

[dommydom]

Feb 19, 2009, 4:09pm, slideboardouts wrote:What if you need a didgeridoo? I don't even know where to find a didgeridoo, much less a didgeridoo player i'm sure my mate Nathan kaye would be more than happy to help with that!http://www.nathankaye.com/***blatent plug over***

[slideboardouts]

Feb 20, 2009, 12:43am, ig88 wrote:Feb 19, 2009, 4:09pm, slideboardouts wrote:Thats a pretty bold and sweeping statement. Not to mention incorrect. Pollow wrote the majority of Ushers last big hit using apple loops, Rhianna's hit "Umbrella" used a garageband drum loop, and as Patrick mentioned Modern Beatz loops and samples are used quite a bit. In fact, a recent ludacris single was done using a horn loop from modern beatz. And that beyonce song, "Single Ladies" I think is what it is called, uses clap samples from modern beatz.There is nothing wrong with buying and using loops and samples, it makes your compositions more dynamic if used properly. What if you need a didgeridoo? I don't even know where to find a didgeridoo, much less a didgeridoo player Thats where buying loops and samples really becomes handy...it gives you access to elements you otherwise wouldn't have (not to mention better gear to record them with). Again, you are incorrect. It really depends on the application. A real "sign" of beginner "production" is not using the appropriate tools for the application. Very dry or even completely dry drum kits are used on some very big hits and frequently used library cues.-Steve I apologize for being "bold" i suppose when some one is passionate about their perspective they might express it that way. Maybe we are talking about different things, i am talking about hip hopMADLIBBlockheadElighImmortal Technique That is some flawless production. You are referencing "candy machine" beats that yes sell heavily to our mislead youth who only want a solid 808 and a clap so they can grind on a shallow jock and not spill their cheap can of Pabst. How are you a producer if you use a loop from Garage band? That is a DAW that is given to mac users for free. If my cat had opposable thumbs i could teach it to drag a loop from garage band. And a Digg-a-dooo? we are also on a different page. I am talking about drum loops. Of course every track needs a different approach depending on what you are trying to do. But Hip Hop genre only using dry hits? That is a bold statementYou sound like you are on some kind of righteous music snob kick here. I'm not going to argue with you about what "true" hip hop production/composition/whatever is or is not. Luckily, I realized years ago that none of that kind of stuff matters. I've signed a ton of hip hop cues using nearly or even completely "dry hits." None of them are righteous enough for you I'm sure, but a contract is a contract and royalties are royalties...and I thoroughly enjoyed writing each piece. Right now I'm collaborating with a guy whose worked with a number of a-list artists and everything I've sent over uses dry drums - not a problem. Our projects are still going forward for both artist and film placement. Again, it depends on the application. Sometimes alot of verb is called for and sometimes it is not.You can do whatever, but don't come on here telling people that they shouldn't be composing hip hop because they use bought samples etc. That comment of yours to Patrick is what really rubbed me the wrong way, especially since Patrick was giving the OP good advice. Not only was your comment incorrect, but it came off as arrogant and its not beneficial to anybody here learning how to better their craft. We're not here on a musical crusade, most of us are here learning how to make a living off of doing what we love to do. Using every resource that we can get our hands on is part of that process.-Steve

[ciskokidd]

Ditto what Steve said!I am so sick of all the so-called purists out there that sit around mocking new production techniques. I've heard the same crap from jazz musicians, rock musicians, hip-hop heads, etc.In the end they are only upset that their stuff isn't on the charts.There's nothing wrong with underground cool stuff. I dig that too, but you get off your snobby trip and allow people to make their music the way they want. They will give you the same in return.Cisko

[ig88]

Well I agree with the above. I am not trying to be a "snob" I just feel that people are very mislead. Ok yes, people love to listen to T-pain and all of that recycled production that has been happening for way too long but when does it end? If producers keep fueling the fire to make money (which is amazing if they can, power to them) where is the line between creating experimental art and just making what people think they want to hear? Art is marketable just people never hear so much beautiful work being created. Once they are exposed a lot of them wondered how they ever could let radio freq's diminish their intelligence. Really? car's? Ho's? A sloppy hook thats a sexual metaphor repeated over and over until its stuck in your head. Charts is one thing, making music that expresses your true emotions, for yourself, maybe making enough to have some top ramen and rent so you can continue doing what you love that is successful to me. Most of what I was talking about was using pre made drum loops is not production IMO. I never specificly insulted anyone, I also never told Patrick he should not be a producer! I only explained there are way more original ways to go about production then purchasing samples. I personally enjoy heated discussions like this. No hard feelings to anyone here.

[ig88]

Honestly this is how i see Charts Hip Hop http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fu ... =450536775