Screeners paid NOT to forward music?

[hummingbird]

Oct 2, 2008, 3:17pm, wta wrote: LOL! I didn't mean that I don't need to listen to the a las. I ment that I know how to google and artist and find out what they sound like and that the advice given wasn't going to help me as I already new that elementary concept... wow... I don't need further critique on my tunes here either, that is not what is going to help, I need a list things that screeners are looking for that will discount a song from submission, now come on this is not complicated and its least the 3 time I've typed this out! I'm happy and not needing a vent really, but somebody who's in the know please step up to the plate surely I can't be the first person to look for this list! wtaI think if you look at the critique form you will find your question answered. But here's one Jimi posted as a guide here, too.just interpret the questions - i.e.#1 - do not forward anything not on target----Style__ On target for today's market in ________ genre__ Not current sounding__ Hard to classifyStyle Comments:___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________Melody__ Good music in verses__ Verses could be stronger__ Good music in chorus__ Verses/Chorus sound too similar__ Memorable Hook__ Hook not obvious enoughMelody Comments:___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________Structure__ Intro too long__ Well-written structure__ Good sectional contrast__ Not enough sectional contrast__ Could use a bridgeStructure Comments:___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________Lyric__ First line makes me want to hear more__ Engaging__ Cohesive__ Good use of imagery__ Rhymes well__ Communicates emotion to listener__ Lacks focus__ Unique__ Too abstract__ I don't understand it__ Too predictable__ Too many cliches__ Awkward phrasing__ Vocal does not help to sell song__ Vocal does help to sell songLyrcial Comments:___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________Title__ Good title__ So-So title__ Can't determine title by listening__ Could appear in a more strategic place__ Doesn't repeat enough__ Repeats too oftenTitle Comments:___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________OVERALL COMMENTS___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________Now give a rating 1 to 10, 1 being the worst, 10 being the best:__ Music__ Lyrics__ Marketability__ Arrangement__ Production__ EngineeringNOW. Would you walk this into a label credibility on this music? color]__ YES__ NONOW. Give a reason why did or didn't forward this:___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

[wta]

Yes I have this list and in it lays the problem, look at how "relative" this statements are! Not current sounding, Verses could be stronger, Memorable Hook and its just the beginning of the form! What is current sound? Verse stronger or weaker is different with each ear listening same with memorable hook... The whole form is full of these relative issues and I know I speak on behalf of the majority of quiet Taxi members frustrated with all this relativizm. I need a list of "These things will disqualify your song from submission..." and at least we'd have something concrete... wta

[anne]

Hi WTA - nice to meet you.RE: the list of what will definitely get you returned.There isn't one per se but if I had to write one (based on my experience since joining 2 years ago) ...1. Don't send songs that sound dated or markedly period unless that is specifically asked for.2. Don't think that if you send a song that contains one line about (example) Chicago, that it would qualify for a listing for songs about Chicago3. Don't pick one of the a las and make a song that sounds like one - if there are say 3 a las listed, you have to listen to all 3 of them and find what was common between them. The a las can be confusing this way - there were listings in the past that asked used "along the lines of Pat Benatar, AC / DC and Aerosmith. I can see the similarity now, but at that time I just went "huh?"4. Don't use bad songwriting skills, don't try to be so unique its not marketable, don't think a song written in early 80s new wave will qualify as punk or alt rock etc5. Don't use male vocals if female are spec'd out and vice versa6. Don't use crappy samples, cheesy looped drums i.e. same rhythm over and over without variation.7. Don't think because your fans or family like it, that it is automatically good8. Don't think its not worth sending in because your fans or family don't like it9. Don't waste money submitting on listings that you aren't sure about - instead, post the listing and the song here in peer to peer and ask what you need to know (i.e. is this right for this listing, how can I improve this song etc) and you'll get lots of help from others that want you to succeed as much as they want to. 10. Understand the most critical component (besides great writing and performance and broadcast quality recording or better) is being exactly right on target for the listing.11. Don't concentrate on don'ts so much - screeners want to hear great music perfect for the listings and forward it, we want to write that great music, and the industry wants to use that great music. What makes it great? Being exactly what they need at that time for that project.HTH

[wta]

Casey, I thought for fun I start with a list that might be easy to put together from Taxi to their members. It's not negative in the least to have a list of things to disqualify a song. My point relating to the words being to similar in the verse as the chorus is a joke! What does that have to do with a good song or not? Do the words WORK in making it a great song or not, not if you used a phrase in a verse so you can't use it again in the chorus cuz the rules say so. This is the very thing I'm talking about, cookiecutter rules getting in the way of authentic creativity. I'm curious why you have an issue with my request? You want me to go to another resouces to get answers when I thought taxi was here to help... Very curious... wta

[wta]

ahhhh, Anne... Thank you! Can anyone add to this? (I am very thankful Anne you list is a blessing)... wta

[Casey H]

Oct 2, 2008, 3:50pm, wta wrote: Casey, I thought for fun I start with a list that might be easy to put together from Taxi to their members. It's not negative in the least to have a list of things to disqualify a song. My point relating to the words being to similar in the verse as the chorus is a joke! What does that have to do with a good song or not? Do the words WORK in making it a great song or not, not if you used a phrase in a verse so you can't use it again in the chorus cuz the rules say so. This is the very thing I'm talking about, cookiecutter rules getting in the way of authentic creativity. I'm curious why you have an issue with my request? You want me to go to another resouces to get answers when I though taxi was here to help... Very curious... wtaBut you've already concluded that you won't conform to "rules" you don't like so this is all moot.

[geo]

Well ..... seems like you got them all...Peace, Geo

[Casey H]

Oct 2, 2008, 3:17pm, wta wrote: I don't need further critique on my tunes here either wtaOK, first thing that puts you in "do not forward" land... thinking you know it all and no one can teach you anything. Listings should say, "you will not be forwarded if you are not capable of learning from previous reviews what works and doesn't work when matching your submission to listing requirements". Does that help?

[anne]

Hi Wta - thanks. I'm glad it helped. I just put what I learned from Matt and Dave and Casey and Hummingbird and many other people into a "don't" list instead of a "do" list. Of course, this is music so all rules have 1000 exceptions One point here, and this isn't picking on you or anybody else at all. I really craved a "don't" list like you asked for when I first joined. I wanted clarity to the "rules". I got the same kind of answers you did. I couldn't see it at the time because I was pretty overwhelmed with trying to figure out what it would take to succeed. A list would be easy and I wasn't getting a list, and it annoyed me.So I started to post songs and ask questions. OVER AND OVER AND OVER...This made the process much faster than any list would have, and that is why you weren't finding a "list" anywhere easily. Learning to hit the listings right on the head takes a time and patience and practice. It is not like writing a song to play at a club, or even recording your own songs, for the sake of expressing something in you or pleasing fans.It is being able to speak a language to someone who can't understand you, but to do it so well and so passionately that the listener knows exactly what you are expressing to them. You are ET and they are the Gov't ... That is why the form, structure, mechanics etc come into play in the reviews. For this type of writing (tv / film) you HAVE to put it in a framework so the emotion of the music is easily and instantly understood by the listener, without them really concentrating on the music. Oh yeah, and it has to fit the exact need of the people buying it too, by the way.. It isn't rocket science, but it isn't as easy as a rock fight and there is a definite art of its own. If tv/film is what you are pursuing rather than artist listings, then you have to settle back and learn that form of writing. If you are pursuing artist listings, you have to learn that form. It sounds like you are already well on the way of the artist path, but that doesn't mean you can't do tv/film by any means. It just means you may have to approach it differently. We're all here to help. Even if we get touchy at times

[wta]

Casey, wow I did't say I wouldn't conform. why would I ask for the "don't dos" if I would not conform, I'm not going to write every song the way a screener is going to like it but I'll only submit the ones that they will less likely return. Isn't that just smart? I wasn't saying that I would "never" want critiques by others on my music (as I have on a few occasions), its just not my focus at this point and I don't want to get of track from my point. Get the point? Please do me a favor and try not to put words in my mouth, unless they are ones the screeners will forward... that would be great! Anne, this list is just some guidelines for me to watch out for to help me not submit songs that have a "don't do" in them, if I know in advace what a screener is going to red flag then I can save them and myself the wasted time and money going through a process that could otherwise be avoided. Every bit helps, I understand its all about finding the pocket and at the same time its a numbers game. I write for both my audience and myself and if something comes out of that process that the screeners might like then all the better. I've just been recently trying to decide how much precious time to invest in the taxi direction and having a "don't do" list may not help everyone but it will help me so Anne please know you have done a wonderful act of kindness and I hope one day to recpricate... If anyone could add to the list PLEASE do but if you'd like to make unconstructive posts I could start a new thread for that... Oh that could make for a great song... wta wta