clearity on listings.....

[fret17]

Hi folks...I'm a little confused about the intent behind some of the variuos listings....I'm assuming that if a listing is asking for instrumentals the bar means absolute finished media ready product.....But what about a tv/film listing for songs with lyrics ala's...Does that bar suggest that it has to also be media ready for use as is?....And when a listing in say country or pop is looking for songs for their artists, does the bar mean it has to be also radio ready?....The reason I'm asking is because I don't write instrumentals....I just write songs that I hope are hitting the high bar as a commercial contender in that the "Quality of the writing" is there and although simple and clean, the production isn't the full scale deal....I'm thinking ...suppose you just wrote the next best thing to "I swear", and it's solid lyrically and the melody is beautiful....My question is, if the demo was clean...(maybe even just a piano/vocal demo)...would the Taxi screener forward it on his ability to recognize the potencial "Hit Quality" or not forward it because of some high production bar...It seems to be that Industry professionals are suppose to recognize that "hit" aspect regardless, knowing full well the artist is going to make his own version of it any way...
I know I'm sounding lazy because I don't want to wear the production hat (mostly because of lack of gear/time and skill) and paying for a full blown production doesn't seem warranted without knowing up front that it's hit worthy by an Industry pro....
I would greatly appreciate some insight as I feel sometimes that I'm just fooling myself and wasting my time with this ...Thanks guys..(I'm having a bad day..)

[Haywire]

Hey Tom,
I've had the same thought. Especially in those listings where it was made clear that they are looking for a song for an artist/label situation. But unfortunately, alot of the screning people have to hear it as close to the artist's world as possible. Too much song traffic - too much risk - not enough time or imagination!
I would think that if you at least get close to the ala's you have a chance.
Later,
haywire

[davewalton]

Hi folks...I'm a little confused about the intent behind some of the variuos listings....I'm assuming that if a listing is asking for instrumentals the bar means absolute finished media ready product.....But what about a tv/film listing for songs with lyrics ala's...Does that bar suggest that it has to also be media ready for use as is?....

Yes! They have to be able to drop it in and use it as-is... broadcast quality just like any top-label group they might use.

And when a listing in say country or pop is looking for songs for their artists, does the bar mean it has to be also radio ready?....

A song done just as a piano/vocal or guitar/vocal certainly can get forwards (and deals) on these kinds of things. It'll be re-recorded of course anyway and the screeners are and should be focusing on the song itself, not the production in particular. But, it never hurts to have the best sounding demo possible so that they can hear what the song is, not imagine what it might or could be.

There's plenty of Taxi screeners at the Rally and Michael Laskow himself that will tell you that a good piano/vocal demo can and does work. Of what I've seen/heard, the vocal has to *really* sell the song so that vocal performance on a guitar/vocal or piano/vocal really needs to bring goosebumps to the listener. Mediocre vocal delivery will probably kill even the best of undiscovered hits. At the very least a mediocre vocal certainly won't help.

Hope that helps,

Dave

[fret17]

Haywire....Thanks for the reality check ... but don't you think it's sort of strange that the book writing professionals dictate to be yourself and standout with new creative ideas and be part of an evolutinary process so to speak....and the publishers keep asking for ala's...i mean what the hell...I just get frustrated with the whole thing sometimes because THEY say what's a hit....I tell you man ....I don't know if it's the song , the arrangement, the producer or the artist that makes it a hit any more...and I'll tell you another thing...these artists piss me off when they do covers when there's only so much space that a new tune could've filled....on the other hand....if it was MY song they were covering I wouldn't mind that at all now would I.....Well...back to the grind.

[davewalton]

...and I'll tell you another thing...these artists piss me off when they do covers when there's only so much space that a new tune could've filled....

It's the producers and labels actually but I'll give ya a big AMEN on that!

[fret17]

Dave ...thanks for your reply on the piano/vocal thing....it makes sence to me in my situation....My problem is All I really want to do is write a great song, not produce one...I want to be able to leave the production magic to the pros.....and then every month after that get a phone call like "Hey Tom...Write me another one as good as the last one"...ha ha ...that would be Heaven!....

[Casey H]

You CAN pitch a song for an artist with just a guitar & vocal or piano and vocal. However, not only does the song have to be truly great but the vocal has to do a tremendous job selling the song. I've heard some simple demos that worked but I have to say that the vocal performance absolutely kicked butt & blew everyone away.

Most of the time in today's world a more complete demo is much prefered. With home recording so affordable and accessible you are competing with top notch demos. Less and less imagination is used. Why use it? There are thousands of well produced demos sitting on the same desk.

For pitching a song to artists, the key points are:

It's the song first. A great demo can make an OK song very good but it can't make a mediocre song great. Get professional opinions on the song before investing in a pro-demo. If the hook doesn't sound strong with just a guitar and vocal, it's not likely to be a good enough hook period.

A pro demo for a great song that shows the song in the style it is being pitched (polished after write, re-write, review, etc) is the ultimate.

However, an expensive demo for a not so good song is worse than a solid guitar & vocal for a great song.

If you go with a simple demo, make sure the vocal is out front with the lyrics clear and the performance is there-- no off pitch vocal notes, no out of tune guitar, good timing, solid emotion, etc.

Many Nashville demo studios will do a G&V or P&V for you at a price much less expensive than a full blown demo (often $200 or less). Sometimes it's worth doing one of these first. And if you are not a good singer or performer, it's definitely better than pitching your own version.

Casey

[fret17]

Thanks Casey....Both you and Dave have really cleared a strategy path for me and brought clearity on Industry expectations in the different type of demos and pitches..thanks so much....your generosity with your "hard knocks" learning experience is greatly appreciated!

[Haywire]

Hey Tom,
I'll just add my last two bits.
It's true the screeners and clients ask for 'a la's ' and that is because once again, they need to sort of play it safe - following in the path of something that worked and was a hit. So, how does music go forward and get us to new and exciting levels? That happens in little spurts when someone in the chain decides he or she can afford to take a risk and decides that they're gonna use a mandolin in a heavy metal song or a dobro in a hip-hop number...It's a good thing that those risk takers are out there, and you can be that risk taker but you might not get dinner on the table from it...
it's the starving ,uncompromising artist dilemma.

[fret17]

Haywire......Never thought of it in that way before....I think I might like to hear what that would sound like!