What's your procedure for new songs?

[Keithm]

Hi everybody. I apologize if these questions have been asked before but I couldn't find it listed.

When working on a song for a submission, what is your normal process of copyrighting the song and registering it with your PRO etc.
For example, many Taxi listings have deadlines only a few days out.
As soon as you finish a song, do you submit it for copyright and also submit it to your PRO?
What if the Prod Co. requests changes to the song structure? Wouldn't you have to submit a new copyright?
I hope that makes sense. Just wondering what your normal procedures are as far as tracking and registering songs.
Thank you

[ottlukk]

I note you're sort of new on these boards. I won't comment on copyright, or PRO's. Would be interesting to see a link to your music, however.
Ott

[mojobone]

As you no doubt guessed, it's a pretty common question. Copyright registration is a relatively large expense for me, so I don't bother, 'til a deal is on the table. I suspect most writers working with libraries and publishers don't, either. The reason? It's hard to get most people working in the business to even listen to your song, let alone steal it, and as it was put to me, "you should be so lucky" as to have someone steal your song. A song, under most circumstances, is pretty much worth nothing, 'til somebody spends ten grand promoting it. I am not a lawyer, and your mileage may vary, whatever and ever, amen.

[simonparker]

Regarding Mojo's comments, I would agree - it's so hard to get people to listen to your songs, it might not be worth the $35/song cost. Just some perspective on songs getting ripped off - at best recollection - most legal cases on copyright infringement deal with songs that are "derivative" of previous works (i.e. George Harrison's "My Sweet Lord" taken from "He's so Fine" by the Chiffons, or "Girlfriend" by Avril Lavigne having elements of the Rubinoos "I Want to be your boyfriend"). I rarely see anything coming to fruition (settlement or court case) from an unknown songwriter claiming a hit song was his/hers. I'm sure they're out there, I just don't see/read a whole of it, since in my opinion its most likely frivolous to begin with.

Likewise, if I were a successful writer, and I heard of an unknown writer suing a hit songwriter for stealing their song, I would stay FAR away from that unknown songwriter. There would be no way on earth I would write with someone with an unproven record who would bring a lawsuit against a songwriter with a proven track record. Just food for thought before getting 'excited' about getting a copyright and suing people for 'ripping off tunes'.

[Keithm]

Thanks all. That makes sense.
What about with your PRO? Do you immediately register your completed songs to your PRO? Sorry, I have to learn more about that process too.
Thanks

[eeoo]

The publishers I work with register the cues I send them, i just provide them with my PRO info. I don't know if all publishers work this way.

eo

[T&V Marino]

Hi Keith,

It's true -- you really don't have to copyright your songs "till a deal is on the table," as Mojo so aptly put it. About every 12-24 months, we make a list of all of our new songs and register them with the U.S. Copyright Office all at the same time. We pay ONE fee and it saves a lot of time and money. You can do as many songs as possible that you can squeeze onto a CD (this may be different if you file electronically).

Now, regarding the question you had about registering the song with your PRO, here is a word of caution: be very careful when you register a song. It is EXTREMELY difficult to change the information once you've entered the song in the catalog!!!! We learned this the hard way last year when we signed 10 older songs to a publisher. The publisher had to change the TITLE of each song and re-register it and it was a BIG hassle!!!

Hope that helps!

~ Tracey & Vance Marino

[maryshaw]

Tracey, Vance, and Mojo - thanks for the great tips!

And thank you Keith for asking the question. I've been out of the game for a while (re-joined in September) and was wondering the same thing

To add to Keith's question - I remember Michael sending out a note about having our ducks in a row if and when a deal is on the table re: Ad agencies and copyright/PRO info. I know that registering the PRO stuff is pretty easy and quick online, at least with BMI. How fast is the turnaround with the U.S. copyright office if a client needs it asap?

Thanks,
Mary

[ChristopherSwain]

It's hard to get most people working in the business to even listen to your song, let alone steal it, .

yes haha sadly very true but befor I knew this and I thought I was half decent and steal-able, I did send it in the post 3 times to myself recorded delievery.

BTW Angels by Robbie Williams was stolen, Angels was probably number 1 in 30 countries and earnt millions and million has been covered and covered, the guy who wrote it got $7,000 dollars.

lucky he had a scratch tape and proved he had involvement, but sad he wrote a song about his still born son and Robbie Williams lied that he wrote it.

[Keithm]

Great information everyone! Wow. Thanks