Scoring an Indie Documentary - what to charge?

[VanderBoegh]

If anybody has ever done custom scoring work, could you please shoot me a private message and let me know what might be reasonable to charge for scoring an indie film?

I was recently approached by a former student of mine who is part of a production team finishing up a Ghost Hunting documentary. They want a local musician to score the film, and they approached me and one other person, asking each if we could score a 2-minute clip to show our style (basically, it would be our spec showcase). They'll pick the person they like better of the two, and then talk business.

I'm kinda getting the cart ahead of the horse here, but what would be a decent fee to charge? Here are some of the details:

Film Time: approx 90 minutes
Music Time: approx 80% of the film, or about 70 minutes (seems incredibly high to me, but that's what they said)
Budget: unknown
Music Style: dramedy / urban comedy (it's comedians doing the ghost hunting, so it's whimsical). These are two specialty genres of mine, so I know I can do them fast, but they're not by any means super quick to compose.

I estimate I could do this entire film if I took 2-3 weeks of solid work, and backburnering every other library request I that may pop up. So I'd lose that potential royalty revenue, and have to consider those implications.

I have a ballpark number in mind, but would like to hear from some of you that have done this stuff. Can anybody out there lend a fella some insider info?

Thanks in advance!!

~~Matt

[cassmcentee]

Call Taxi and run a Listing!
Be the music supervisor!

[andygabrys]

no cart before the horse here.

Either you figure out a fee or you don't do it. You are too busy to just take on a no money film just to write music for a no-money film right?

[funsongs]

Come up with some kind of realistic formula:

2.5 years-worth of diapers & infant supplies
+ parttime nanny-care for all the hours you'll spend on the film project (@ $15/hr?)
+ your professional producer/composer hourly rate (one of my buddies gets $130/hr)
+ estimate of loss of funds from other projects =
Subtotal =
+ 10% profit (standard reasonable corporate rate)

= Badda-bing, badda-boom...
(is that close to your ballpark number, Professor?)

[Kolstad]

No insider information, just a few trusted resources to help you crack the code:

http://filmandgamecomposers.com/guides/ ... ose-music/
http://thinkspaceeducation.com/when-wor ... r-nothing/

If you don't know the film budget, you can't really 1) say 5-10% of that, so you are left with either 2) an hourly rate beased on an estimate, 3) a flat rate per minute of music, or 4) working for free keeping all the rights and gain some experience and publicity (put it in the contract).

[Paulie]

Or you could ask for the John Williams "Star Wars" Special: 1% of film profits.

Actually, George Lucas gave that to Williams on his own specifically to recognize the impact Williams' music had on the film and audience. Pretty sweet of him.

[sansharbour]

Matt

I would say figure out a sum that you think would be worth your time.

If they choose you then give it to them

I know a re enactor who is very knowledgeable about period clothing. He has been a period clothing consultant on all of the Pirates of the Caribbean movies.
He said that he always throws out a ridiculous number to them and they always pay it.

Your guys aren't Disney but you get the picture.

Don

[jonnybutter]

I used to do a lot of long form post scoring, and I would generally estimate a day rate, and then add about 20%. It always seems to take longer than you think it will to score something long, and sometimes the producers come back with changes, etc. In your case, I would figure in opportunity costs too, since you're in demand with the libraries.

Agree with you: hard to believe they will use 70 minutes of music!

[VanderBoegh]

Thanks everyone! I really appreciate the thoughts and comments and time - and I always appreciate the sage advice of Andy Gabrys, whom I talked to rather extensively over emails about this.

For those who are interested, I ended up quoting them a price of $4,500 - $6,000 for the 70 minutes of music, which comes out to about $65 - $85 per minute of music (far short of what the professionals - even for indie films - charge). And as Andy and I guessed, it was about 4x over their budget.

So, it would have been $1,000 for a solid - and I mean solid - month of work.

I waved goodbye and wished them good luck.

Go figure, the other guy who I was in competition with for this scoring job is willing to do the project for $1,000. Which is pretty representative of the big hurdle us dedicated musicians typically face... we're always up against people who are willing to work for peanuts - or even work for free - just for the "exposure". What the producers don't understand though, is that the freebie composers make freebie quality music. And I'm confident enough in my work to know that I'm worth charging a good chunk of money for it. Sometimes that means walking away from something in order to preserve the integrity of your product.

~~Matt

[funsongs]

Go figure, the other guy who I was in competition with for this scoring job is willing to do the project for $1,000. Which is pretty representative of the big hurdle us dedicated musicians typically face... we're always up against people who are willing to work for peanuts - or even work for free - just for the "exposure". What the producers don't understand though, is that the freebie composers make freebie quality music. And I'm confident enough in my work to know that I'm worth charging a good chunk of money for it. Sometimes that means walking away from something in order to preserve the integrity of your product.
~~Matt

Well... if the saying "you get what you pay for" holds true in that person's case, he should be easily recognized in a crowd:
the dude with the hugely bruised & dented forehead.
And, you'll be glad you made the choice you have.