German member needs advice for choosing the right PRO

[janbaars]

ASCAP sounds pretty good.
My question is, do we ever get to hold any publishing rights with listings here at Taxi?

Yes, right?

So, I'll have to start an official company for that before I could receive any of those royalties through ASCAP?
Do I understand this correct?

[Russell Landwehr]

ASCAP sounds pretty good.
My question is, do we ever get to hold any publishing rights with listings here at Taxi?

You will find listings that say "direct to supervisor" or something like that. In the listing it will also say that you get to keep your publishing royalties.

So, I'll have to start an official company for that before I could receive any of those royalties through ASCAP?
Do I understand this correct?

I'm not certain you would actually need to create an official company... like an LLC or Corp or DBA...
You MAY be able to register as a publisher using the same name and info you registered as a writer.
I am BMI, perhaps some ASCAP TAXI members can shed light on this.
Or you could ask ASCAP.

Russell

[Samwinski]

so this have been a lot of informations, thanks!
you helped me to sort and consider important things.

After I talked to a business guy from DRMV (Deutscher Rock & Pop Musikerverband) he recommended the PRS in GB,
with which he and many artist made a lot of good experiences, I actually go with them.

... after registration they wrote:
Please only contact us if you have not heard back from us within 21 days of submitting your documentation.
Ahhh ... this time I hope NOT to hear from a library or supervisor

maybe this registration-theme could be an issue for taxi TV

[janbaars]

What do you mean?

Why do you not want to hear back from libraries or supervisors now?

Jan

[Samwinski]

because it seems it can take more than 3 weeks that they accept the registering,
this means the library or supervisor have to wait that time to get my pro no.
they could think I'm not interested or I am very slow in reacting

[janbaars]

So... they need your pro number before they can use it?!

[Kolstad]

My danish pro Koda also needs the administration rights, but I can make special arrangements for library and production music. It is convenient for me, as I don't run a big scale music corporation, and spend very little time on administration (I despise it), so any decision of use outside of library/ production is their's to make. I don't know if you can do the same with Gema in Germany.

If you at some point end up in a legal dispute, your home address will determine which law your works are subdued to, which may or may not cause issues when you first release your music in the UK (and/or in the US). I believe the general rule is that you can only be a member of one Pro per territory. Europe and the US are different territories, which is why it is possible to be a member of one at both coasts at the same time. However, if you do, they may want to split their collection for you, if territories overlap.

Not sure about Prs, they are probably allright. Gema has been scorned hard on some independent blogs, but what I also see is that they really stand up for their members, which isn't such a bad thing for a partner on your side, is it? Gema did stand up against YouTube http://www.theguardian.com/music/musicb ... es-dispute

Prs recently did the same against SoundCloud http://www.musicbusinessworldwide.com/p ... oundcloud/
Prs and Gema will actually be working more together in the future, it seems http://www.musicbusinessworldwide.com/p ... nsing-hub/ The EU have a copyright reform coming in 2017, which probably is why the european PRO's are teaming up.

In the big picture, I'm not sure the Pro's are all that different. You'd want a Pro to fight for your rights and reasonable compensations with both hands and a leg, and my experience with Koda in Denmark is that they are very much aware of the library/tv/film market, and are very cooperative about that. However, these markets are also known for a "race to the bottom" in terms of paying composers and songwriters less and less, so we need strong organizations on our side (including Taxi). The Filmmusic network is a credible source for that view (quote):

"today’s marketplace, a marketplace whose highlights include:
• Declining film and television production
• Declining composer and licensing fees
• Declining corporate spending on industrials and other internal productions
• Far too much music in the marketplace
• Far too many composers competing for a declining number of scoring jobs
• An increasing number of music libraries competing for the same jobs that composers and
songwriters are competing for" (source http://www.filmmusic.net/dlx/Getting_Yo ... _Today.pdf )

That's what you are up against, so, the PRO's represent their members, which are professionals very much challenged in trying to live off of their music. There's a lot at stake for many, so the precautions the Pro's are making may not always be beneficiary for the amateur songwriter trying to cut through the big clutter by lowering the bar of (sound) business principles, but at least there's a reason to it.. as I see it, they are sort of preventing us from jumping off the cliff, as we are continuously pushed, pressed and tempted by market driven contracts, deals and "opportunities".

[andygabrys]

one thing to keep in mind is that there is a "system".

And that system works by being part of a PRO (in some country) and by any publishers or libraries having your personal PRO info and numbers.

It may "hurt" if you get a call from a music supervisor about a piece (and I hope you do get that call) but as Magne quoted, there is a tremendous amount of music out there these days, and there is a lot of competition for every placement. So you might get the call, you might not. It also might take a while for that film / TV show / commercial to actually air, and in that time your registration might have come through. It will also take a PRO minimum of 6 months to pay you for any placement if its on your home soil. If its a foreign placement, it might take an extra year.

so except for up front sync / master use payments (which don't require a PRO to be involved, in North America anyways) the royalties will come when they come.

The most important thing is to just get going on registering yourself as a writer, and if you ever hope to place any music direct-to-supervisor, register your personal publishing company as well.

The whole topic of: "Can I get both my writers and publishers royalties by only being registered as a writer" is hotly contested. i am a member of BMI, and you can get registered and collect as both writer and publisher under their "excess writer's clearance" as Russell (I think) detailed in this thread previously.

However - IF you will get multiple opportunities to earn as writer and publisher (many direct to super ops, film score you have written and retained both writer and publishers share, commercials that go direct to agency allowing you to retain both writers and publishers share) - then it makes sense to register as a publishing company straight off.

I was advised to do just so by my commercial jingle contact at BMI and I have made back the money I spent on the publishing company registration ($150) more than ten-fold only off the publishers share of the royalties from one commercial placement.

Keep in mind, this is my own experience, and is no substitute for proper legal council, and is only applicable in my territory (currently the US) - YMMV.

HTH.

[Kolstad]

Yeah, and if you sign up as a publisher, the same rules don't apply. You can be a member of multiple PRO's as a publisher, because publishers serve writers of different PRO's.