Anyone ever heard of a deal like this?

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VanderBoegh
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Anyone ever heard of a deal like this?

Post by VanderBoegh » Wed Jan 17, 2018 5:54 pm

A good friend of mine is cutting his teeth in the licensing world right now. He's been a major musician for decades, opening up for all sorts of huge acts, touring nationally, and running a top-notch recording studio in Boise. So, he's got the musicianship, production chops, and the facilities and gear to make all sorts of killer music.

Like I said, he's starting to make cues now, and he recently got offered a TV licensing deal from a company that he initially hired to run a radio promotion campaign for his recent rock album. I've never heard of this particular company, but my friend was kind enough to forward me the contracts, so I looked them over and gave him my thoughts. I also suggested we also run this through the forums. So, I'll take screenshots of all these replies (or send him the link) so he can see what other people say in regards to this:

The company wants $100 from the composer for each track they sign into their catalog. It seems that this company doesn't collect the publishing royalties, so the writer would take 100% of writers AND 100% of pub. But they have to pay $100 per track to the licensing company. So, my friend is looking at an invoice for $1,000 to represent 10 tracks, and the company promises to shop them to a handful of shows at various cable networks.

That's the main sticking point. I've already given him my opinion, so rather than coloring your opinions with my own thoughts, I'll just stay neutral here and collect replies. I thought it would be good to hear what other people have to say on the matter, and if anyone has ever heard of a deal like this, because I certainly haven't.

If all my homies could chime in with your thoughts, I'll send them along to my friend here in Boise.

Thanks a million!

~~Matt

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markhimley
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Re: Anyone ever heard of a deal like this?

Post by markhimley » Wed Jan 17, 2018 6:01 pm

Does this company have an impressive history of placements? If not, I would never take the deal. However, as you're aware, I'm very green myself. So maybe I'm overlooking something. But the way I understand it, is you're going to make the majority of your royalties from 20% of your cues (approx.). What are the chances that all of these 10 tracks are going to bring in tons of placements? Will they make him $1,000 in royalties, and can you even guarantee that?

Another thing to consider - if they aren't collecting publishing royalties, then what really is their incentive to shop this music? I can't think of any reason why they would be compelled to get placements. From their end, the initial money is all the money they are going to see. That's one benefit, IMO, when the publisher actually retains at least some, if not all, of the publishing royalties. They have incentive to get you placements and make you money, because they also make money.

So I guess unless this company has a long track record of getting juicy placements with nice sync fees, I would avoid it.

Just 2 cents from a very green rookie. :D

I hope this all works out in your friend's favor!

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Re: Anyone ever heard of a deal like this?

Post by Danny » Wed Jan 17, 2018 8:19 pm

Matt,

IMHO, red flags are up.

In a day and age where we rarely get any up front fees, it is a bummer that a Lib actually wants the composer to pay THEM?

He may have to have his songs placed in a TV show about ten times to at least collect the $100 payment. Of course if it's an ad or campaign, that's a different story. So if Toyota picks up one of his tracks and airs a commercial with a $15,000 sync fee, I'm sure the company will have no interest in publishing :lol: :lol: :lol: .

You didn't mention if the rock album has cues by your friend solo or it was performed by his band. If it's an actual band, the songs should collect sync in a majority of reputable Libs throughout the US.

Just my opinion Matt. I'm sure your advice was good considering you are in about 40 more Libs than me :D :D :D .

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Re: Anyone ever heard of a deal like this?

Post by LOCK88 » Wed Jan 17, 2018 9:37 pm

Tell him to run Matt. I'm certain this is what you already told him...
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Re: Anyone ever heard of a deal like this?

Post by edmondredd » Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:23 am

markhimley wrote: Another thing to consider - if they aren't collecting publishing royalties, then what really is their incentive to shop this music? I can't think of any reason why they would be compelled to get placements. From their end, the initial money is all the money they are going to see. That's one benefit, IMO, when the publisher actually retains at least some, if not all, of the publishing royalties. They have incentive to get you placements and make you money, because they also make money.
I guess this sums it up.
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Re: Anyone ever heard of a deal like this?

Post by DesireInspires » Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:55 am

This is not a bad deal, it is a terrible deal. Please tell your friend to stay away from this deal.

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Re: Anyone ever heard of a deal like this?

Post by cosmicdolphin » Thu Jan 18, 2018 9:44 am

Run away..it sounds like a scam

He'd be better of spending his $1,000 on a couple of years Taxi membership and 140 Submissions..I'm sure you told him

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Re: Anyone ever heard of a deal like this?

Post by Tunesmith » Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:51 pm

This is sounds like a steal..not a deal! :shock:

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Re: Anyone ever heard of a deal like this?

Post by eeoo » Thu Jan 18, 2018 1:57 pm

So to make up for his expenses he'd have to make $1000 on 10 tracks that are being pitched to cable shows? So likely no sync money. Let's say all 10 tracks get placements on cable reality shows, how long would it take for 10 tracks to make $1000 in royalties? Hard to say precisely but here's a guess: a long time! And yeah, as has been stated, what's the incentive for this company to pitch those songs once they have his money?

I'm sure I know what your advice to him was Matt.

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Re: Anyone ever heard of a deal like this?

Post by Kolstad » Fri Jan 19, 2018 2:04 am

That absolutely wont fly. The library is basically acting like an agent. So, if that is so, they should not sign the tracks to their catalog, they should ask for the money, shop the tracks, and let the composer get 100% of both sync, master use and backend. The library are only suggesting this because they are well aware that future money will be in sync, more than backend, especially if the shows will be streaming. There is really no incentive left for the composer to sign a deal like that, imo.

And yes, Ive heard about deals like this in the sense that libraries are now trying to design deals that secures their revenue in the streaming future. Its business, but a cold, hard one.

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