Is it the drums?

[DBarnett]

Howdy!
I'd like some help with this return critique on a Swamp Rock request please
The screener must be talking about the drums, right?
Any advice on what needs to change to sound "Live"?
I did get a forward with a different piece, same request
Thanks for your time

https://www.taxi.com/members/GJH3rS9kRt ... k-you-down

What I like most about this song
I like the theme, the guitar sounds, the swampy vibe and all the ideas. This was a fun listen.

I think you could improve this song by
This has nice guitar parts, but it needs more of a live sounding groove and slightly less overall repetition.

I returned or forwarded this song because
This is a little too receive and needs more of a live sounding groove. [I think they meant "repetitive" not receive?]
From the listing:
"The more your pieces sound like they're being performed by real musicians playing real instruments, the better!"

A Bunch of SWAMP ROCK INSTRUMENTAL CUES are needed by an extremely busy Music Library with a tremendously long list of killer placements in Hit TV Shows!

This Library is on the hunt for a bunch of Mid-to-Up-Tempo Instrumental Cues that could be found on a playlist with the following references:

Swamp People (from 0:10 to 0:30)

"Moonshine & Gasoline" by Blues Saraceno

Duck Dynasty (from 13:49 to 14:14)

Although one of the references has vocals, please submit Instrumental Cues only for this pitch.

Please submit top-notch Swamp Rock Instrumental Cues with twangy guitar riffs, great rhythms, and a healthy dose of Southern charm. Craft your Cues around a singular motif and mood, and create a sense of forward momentum and dynamics by layering instrumentation in and out as they progress. Please be sure that your production and any virtual instruments or samples you use are high-quality and not dated. The more your pieces sound like they're being performed by real musicians playing real instruments, the better!

[johnnyrowing]

Dave,
Given the critique . . . yea . . . probably the drums. They are pretty "perfect". Maybe a little bit more slop - less quantization? As another idea, do the drums sound like they are in a different space than the rest of the track? Maybe some global reverb - compression - or tape saturation?

I throw out all of the above "post critique". You shared this track with the board and I didn't spot any of these issues. But, I'm still "big-time" growing with my mixing and engineering ears. In fact, you sharing your track both before and after critiques is really helpful. It helps me.

In the end though, I really like your track.


Hey, isn't this a couple in a row where you - at least - got 1 forward?

Best wishes to you man,
Johnny

[OwenGrech]

Hi Dave. From what I could hear the hi hat sounds a bit programmed (especially in the intro from 0:07) - it is a bit rigid - in the sense that it feels like it has the same velocity on every hit), same thing with the crashes (from 1:04).
I am by no means an expert but this is what my ears are hearing

One thing I find works for me is to grab a drum groove played by a real human being in EZ drummer (or any other midi pack of your choice) and either use the whole thing as is or just grab the hi hat part (or/and cymbals) if the drum pattern is different than what I need and then build the kick, snare and toms around that to my taste as personally I find it difficult and tedious to emulate a hi hat pattern properly since you have to play around with the velocity a lot!

Well that's my 2c for what it's worth

PS. I think that this is a very nice track with some nice arrangements and slick playing which could be easily re submitted next time around.

tc
owen

[DBarnett]

Dave,
Given the critique . . . yea . . . probably the drums. They are pretty "perfect". Maybe a little bit more slop - less quantization? As another idea, do the drums sound like they are in a different space than the rest of the track? Maybe some global reverb - compression - or tape saturation?

I throw out all of the above "post critique". You shared this track with the board and I didn't spot any of these issues. But, I'm still "big-time" growing with my mixing and engineering ears. In fact, you sharing your track both before and after critiques is really helpful. It helps me.

In the end though, I really like your track.


Hey, isn't this a couple in a row where you - at least - got 1 forward?

Best wishes to you man,
Johnny

Hi Johnny!
I'll play with those suggestions, thanks
Since it's my creation I didn't know if I couldn't tell if the groove doesn't fit, if that makes sense?
Sometimes I go ear blind lol Agreed, growing and learning everyday as we should
I agree that it is helpful to read the critiques and re-listen
I have had a couple of forwards recently
Thanks buddy!!

[DBarnett]

Hi Dave. From what I could hear the hi hat sounds a bit programmed (especially in the intro from 0:07) - it is a bit rigid - in the sense that it feels like it has the same velocity on every hit), same thing with the crashes (from 1:04).
I am by no means an expert but this is what my ears are hearing

One thing I find works for me is to grab a drum groove played by a real human being in EZ drummer (or any other midi pack of your choice) and either use the whole thing as is or just grab the hi hat part (or/and cymbals) if the drum pattern is different than what I need and then build the kick, snare and toms around that to my taste as personally I find it difficult and tedious to emulate a hi hat pattern properly since you have to play around with the velocity a lot!

Well that's my 2c for what it's worth

PS. I think that this is a very nice track with some nice arrangements and slick playing which could be easily re submitted next time around.

tc
owen

Thanks Owen!
On my re-listen the HH stood out to me also, so now I'm sure I'll try to humanize that
BTW I am using EZ Drummer 2, I've been thinking about going to Superior Drummer, not sure if you can just upgrade?
Anyhow I will play with the grooves and see if I can't get something more organic going
Thanks brother!

[AlanHall]

Dave,
I remember this piece from an earlier thread, liked it then and like it now. Plenty swampy for this old soul. And congrats on the other cue that got forwarded!

I probably wouldn't have paid attention to the drums if other posters hadn't mentioned them, but with that critical ear the hi-hat (and all the cymbals generally) sound too clean and present for the piece.
One thing Andy Gabras told me was to listen to the first 7 seconds of a piece to learn the ambience, levels, etc (basically the 'space' that the ensemble exists within). Given that, the guitar intro makes me expect a lot less hi-fi from the entire piece. Does that make sense?

...and I hate to mention it, but the open hi-hat on the "and" of four sounds like my very first drum machine back in the 80s. It suggests a drum loop to me. Maybe that's the 'repetitive/artificial' ding the reviewer gave you?

[funsongs]

at a quick glance... my guess is the 'r' word might have been meant to be 'reserved'...
as in, a live drummer might give it more punch and dynamics. (famous last word.)
In which case - back to my original listen to this: I was 'Jonesin' for much more 'sloppy/open'-sounding hi-hats...
hard-hitting.

[AlanHall]

at a quick glance... my guess is the 'r' word might have been meant to be 'reserved'...
as in, a live drummer might give it more punch and dynamics. (famous last word.)

good hypothesis! +1

[DBarnett]

at a quick glance... my guess is the 'r' word might have been meant to be 'reserved'...
as in, a live drummer might give it more punch and dynamics. (famous last word.)

good hypothesis! +1

Thanks Alan and Peter!
This is all really good stuff! Now if I just remember to employ it every time LOL
I have become more and more aware that programming the drums is a big deal

[eeoo]

Yeah I think it's the drums. I would try a different kit, this one sounds so studio slick and clean. Dirtier kit with more of a room ambiance and like you did to your other cue, dirty them up!