Songs With No Chorus?

[dukenemesis]

Whats your opinion of them? Good or a no-go-zone?I've written a few songs with no chorus (never viewed by anyone but me), I think you can pull it off but you have to be careful as the same kind of verse again and again can make the song sound boring to listen too. I can't say I've really listened to much music at all without a chorus.Just interested on what other people thing about it.

[Mark Kaufman]

I just wrote the music for one, "Moonlight Skater" on the Peer to Peer forums.Hey, this is TAXI, so I say go for it. If you only write what you THINK they want to hear, then you will only write what you think they want to hear.But if you watch those listings...there is a home for every good song, somewhere. Maybe not on that radio station that plays all hits all the time...but there are a lot of different markets for songs.

[arkjack]

JMO I think for many markets, they won't consider a song without a VC structure these days. It really depends on how strong the song is in its overall lyrics and the hook has to be beyond dynamite.... more like C4. I'm sure if I think about it I can come up with an example of a song that made hit status with no chorus, but its rare. Dylanesque styles of multi verse songs with no chorus don't seem to get much attention. The format is not really 'suitable' for radio, and if you follow all the songwriting gurus, they emphasize the need for structure to make the song go somewhere and back. Doesn't mean that songs without choruses can't be great, just that it is a hurdle to get something going with it in 'the market'.ArkJack

[Mark Kaufman]

I agree with Arkjack that a song without a chorus is likely to go nowhere.However, I love a good challenge, so:The Sultans of SwingBaker StreetMmm Mmm Mmm?Losing My ReligionMaggie MayWe Can Work It OutYou Never Give Me Your Money (not a hit...but cool!)Positively 4th Street...A lot of songs without a proper chorus often employ one line or phrase (usually the title) that serves as a mini-chorus, like "We Can Work It Out. Or Dylan's It's All Over Now, Baby Blue.

[hazineju]

i do have a few faves that don't have choruses, like "forever in blue jeans" (no groans please, i love neil diamond!) that song is actually more like just the chorus over and over again with a b section thrown in 2x. mosts of the old standards didn't have proper choruses, like "what a wonderful world," "somewhere over the rainbow," "come fly with me," "moon river," "someone to watch over me," "embraceable you," the list goes on and on. but i do agree with the other guys that for today's market or at least for today's pitches it seems like VC structure is pretty imperative for a hit song. and i agree with you that it can be tricky to keep the song interesting and memorable without a chorus.

[milfus]

you can compensate against a missing chorus with a good story progression and title reinforcement, just make sure you have a hook

[diogenes]

A chorus doesn't necessarily have to be the traditional kind with vocals either. The White Stripes "Seven Nation Army" is a good example of that...where they come back to a riff, just without any vocals over it. And Metallica wrote a tone of great songs without traditional hooks, and they're one of the biggest rock band in the world. I say, write what YOU want. Thats what most successful acts have done.

[Casey H]

Interestingly, many great Beatle songs were ABAB or AABA format. They didn't go for chorus-driven lots of times. But everything they touched had a hook running through it.There are also a lot of AAA format songs that were great like "Gentle On My Mind", "The Times They Are a Changing", etc...Sadly, the market for non-chorus songs is pretty dead. For song pitches to publishers/for artists, you haven't got a chance without a killer chorus. You might get away with it for film/TV IF the overall feel and sound was right for the situation, especially if it was for a "replacement track".One of my favorite older songs of mine is at:http://www.broadjam.com/transmit/index. ... ndsq=1It's ABAB format but I think it has a nice hooky feel (ignore lyrical gaffes and production ideas)... At this point, I want to re-do it to fix some lyrics, maybe produce it differently etc. But I will re-do it for ME with no illusions of commercial viability.My few cents... Casey

[mojobone]

Yes, I'd say only for TV/film underscoring; even then you'd want at least AB, even if it's just an electronica sequence for a short dance-club scene.

[dukenemesis]

Jun 10, 2008, 2:56pm, diogenes wrote:A chorus doesn't necessarily have to be the traditional kind with vocals either. The White Stripes "Seven Nation Army" is a good example of that...where they come back to a riff, just without any vocals over it. Thats a good point that. A good riff would work really well as an alternative. Thanks for your input everyone!