Stylus RMX / Stormdrum

[aimusic]

Hi All,Ok so I've had a lot of feedback from Taxi about how my synths sound thin etc... they recommended Stylus RMX, is it worth buying? I'm currently doing (trying to) a lot of stuff aimed at t.v/film/games and need excellent sounds... Or what about Stormdrum? that was another suggestion.I like the look of Spectrasonics Omnisphere, but that's another dicussion closer towards september... :c)B

[gitarrero]

I'd suggest you check them out either online (homepages of the manufacturers, you also find some very informational vid's on youtube) or go into a store where you can check them directly "in action" on a computer.

[ibanez468]

aim,I don't think stylus rmx is really geared towards synth sounds. It's mainly a groove machine plug-in. It's got alot of hip drum & percussion grooves. There are some synth sounds incorporated in the grooves, but they're really not the kind you can manipulate. Atmosphere is more geared towards synth sounds. It's got some huge, wide sounds. And I think even Trilogy has synth sounds, more along the lines of bass. You might want to go to the Spectrasonics website and check the demos out for each one.http://www.spectrasonics.net/instrument ... s.htmlEach one is really worth buying, IMO. These are really the type of sounds I think the screener is looking to hear. Big, phat, up to date sounds. This company has done an excellent job of creating the types of sounds us musicians, composers, & producers are looking for. I know they're pricey, but they're worth it, no question! Hummingbird just recently purchased Stylus RMX, and I think she's hooked!ibanez468

[davewalton]

Quote:Hi All,Ok so I've had a lot of feedback from Taxi about how my synths sound thin etc... they recommended Stylus RMX, is it worth buying? I'm currently doing (trying to) a lot of stuff aimed at t.v/film/games and need excellent sounds... Or what about Stormdrum? that was another suggestion.I like the look of Spectrasonics Omnisphere, but that's another dicussion closer towards september... :c)BThere's going to be a Taxi forum run on Omnisphere when that comes out for sure!Generally speaking, when I started putting together my "instruments", I did a little homework and broke everything up into categories of usefulness and their main use.Stormdrum (and now Stormdrum 2 or whatever) is designed as a "big film score percussion" type thing, like what you might hear in a Hans Zimmer score. Stylus RMX CAN be used as a percussion instrument for film score stuff but it'd have to be a very modern film score. Almost all the RMX beats are processed and it has a very modern, electronica sound and feel. I find Stormdrum to be useless for electronica. All in all, both are extremely useful, I use them all the time but they definitely are, for the most part, targeted for different applications.All the Spectrasonics products are excellent although of the three, I think that Trilogy is the weakest. I'm still happy with Trilogy as a virtual instrument for all kinds of bass but the more I use it the more I see some chinks in the armour. Atmosphere has big sounds, most are geared away from harder electronica, more toward ambient stuff. Nothing can beat a good amount of "homework" getting on the sites, downloading demo tracks and demos if they offer them. And of course posting on this forum. The "how do you use this product" question is really valuable I think. Once I see how others are using a product it really help me define how I might use it or if it's even what I need.HTH,Dave

[zircon]

Frankly, in my experience, the screeners do not know what they're talking about when it comes to drum programming. I got that same "stock" feedback regarding the drums for one of my submissions... except I already use Stylus RMX, so their suggestion didn't even make sense. Not that they were even 'right' anyway as the track that received that comment, which was rejected, was accepted by the library that the listing was for when I submitted it directly. Oops. Out of 20-25 forwards and about that many rejections, I have yet to get a piece of production advice on my electronic music that has been helpful. Arrangement/songwriting, yes. Production, definitely not.The key to making "full" sounds is not necessarily your samples but how you arrange them and how you process them. Some of my favorite sounds are from a $10 sample CD that isn't even produced any more. When I layer three kicks from it together and run them through overdrive, EQ, and sidechaining with my bass, I can get some truly floor-shaking grooves. With synths, things like arrangement, EQ, and FX are even more crucial. If I had to call one technique my 'signature' sound, it's how I can create tons of synth parts and have them playing at once without sounding muddy, and in fact sounding musical... and I can do that with free synths. A super-expensive synth with tons of shiny presets will work too, but if you don't have a good base knowledge on how to use them properly then they are not going to help.I'm not trying to knock some of the Taxi screeners for no reason here. But generally speaking, it's a bad idea to take production advice from anyone other than someone who is themselves a skilled producer, and based on experience it doesn't seem like many of the Taxi screeners giving production advice for synths/drums are that. I suggest creating a network of people who all do pro-level work and consulting them for advice on the topic.

[slideboardouts]

Quote:The key to making "full" sounds is not necessarily your samples but how you arrange them and how you process them. Some of my favorite sounds are from a $10 sample CD that isn't even produced any more. When I layer three kicks from it together and run them through overdrive, EQ, and sidechaining with my bass, I can get some truly floor-shaking grooves. With synths, things like arrangement, EQ, and FX are even more crucial. If I had to call one technique my 'signature' sound, it's how I can create tons of synth parts and have them playing at once without sounding muddy, and in fact sounding musical... and I can do that with free synths. A super-expensive synth with tons of shiny presets will work too, but if you don't have a good base knowledge on how to use them properly then they are not going to help.I totally agree. I mostly do urban, and a kick drum is almost never just one great sounding sample. Its usually 3 kicks layered, EQ'd, and pumped up with compression. Thats how you get that thick punch and tone. The same goes for your synth sounds. What are you using? I would try experimenting with layering, compression, EQ, and effects a little before plunking down the money for more gear.-Steve

[mazz]

Zircon is totally right on about this. If your synths sound thin, then they probably sound thin because you chose thin sounds to begin with or the processing (or lack thereof) that you chose thinned them out.Yes, there are dated synths out there(M1, DX7, etc.) but even those could be made to sound modern with a bit of creative tweakage. I guarantee you that the folks at Spectrasonics used a ton of old and new stuff to make the sounds for Atmosphere and Trilogy.I'll counter my good buddy Dave Walton here a bit on Atmosphere because I think it can be used for any type of electronic music. It has raw synth waveforms and plenty of filtering and enveloping capabilities. That mixed with a good knowledge of outboard/plugin effects processing will get you a good ways down the road. Yes, Atmosphere is known for it's, well, atmospheric sounds but that's only the presets, there's plenty "under the hood" going on. No it won't give Absynth a run for it's money in programming features but it's capable of more than big pads.Also, don't count Stylus out for textures beyond rhythm/percussive. Stylus can import REX files and I've used it for guitar parts, bass lines, and so on via importing REX libraries.I have a lot of gear and software but there's a few go-to items in my studio and Stylus and Atmosphere make appearances on most of the pieces I do. I've spent a lot of time learning how to get below the surface of those programs to make them do my bidding. That's what you need to do with whatever gear you have to pump up your thin synth sounds and put a little meat on those bones!!!Good luck,Mazz

[davewalton]

Quote:I'll counter my good buddy Dave Walton here a bit on Atmosphere because I think it can be used for any type of electronic music. It has raw synth waveforms and plenty of filtering and enveloping capabilities. That mixed with a good knowledge of outboard/plugin effects processing will get you a good ways down the road. Man those "Listen To Mazz" t-shirts are gonna be flyin' off the shelves! And yes, I concede that our learned Mazz is correct. I tend to categorize things by their presets, definitely a narrow point of view. If you were to just use the presents, you'd get a lot of sounds that are reflected by the name... Atmosphere. If you were to take Mazz's advice, you'd get a whole different point of view, a much wider and more accurate point of view. We all agree I think that Atmosphere and Stylus RMX are awesome.When someone says that they're getting "thin sounds" comments from the screeners, I can't help but reflect on my short experience with HoraceJesse at Taxi... the tracks I listened to were almost all universally "thin". They were, for the most part, using the GM sounds from whatever soundcard they had (probably whatever came with the computer). To get into the game quickly, it doesn't make sense to struggle with General Midi sounds from a generic soundcard, spending months (years) developing techniques to enhance those terrible sounds when some really awesome sounds are at your fingertips for a couple hundred bucks. I use some $10 samples too but certainly not exclusively. Zircon's music is VERY good and it's not all coming from a Soundblaster card that came with his Emachines computer. There's quality samples in there too to go along with that quality music and composing. I agree that just throwing money doesn't solve music problems but I heard enough during my short listening session at Taxi to get the sense that many musicians/composers were writing and composing beyond their sounds, the general sounds on their soundcard. Your tool kit needs to be equal to your compositional skills. Having said that, Zircon and Mazz are correct in essentially saying that your engineering/production skills have to be equal to those other things as well. In the end, it's the balance between quality stuff and knowing how to tweak the "not-so-quality" stuff. My general mindset is that if I recommend a particular software something-or-another to someone, I usually do it with the general idea that they can open the package and pretty much get what they want right out of the box. Not everyone is suited to or interested in "programming". If the caveat is that yes, they can get a certain sound but only if they can disassemble the inner workings of the software in question, that recommendation might not work well for everyone. The recommendation from Zircon and Mazz that they learn how to do that, is, in the end, probably the best one. I gotta sell some t-shirts too, you know! HTH,Dave

[matto]

Quote:Hi All,Ok so I've had a lot of feedback from Taxi about how my synths sound thin etc... they recommended Stylus RMX, is it worth buying? I'm currently doing (trying to) a lot of stuff aimed at t.v/film/games and need excellent sounds... Or what about Stormdrum? that was another suggestion.It's really impossible to say what makes your sound "thin" without hearing any of your tracks. Or what would help "fatten it up".But I think despite what zircon says, if you repeatedly get the comment that your tracks sound thin, you'd be smart not to ignore those comments.

[mazz]

You guys are just too level headed!! My story is a cautionary tale: learn how to use your gear, even if you buy really great stuff like Atmosphere and Stylus because those presets have been played out and the real proof is in the creativity and technical expertise of the nut behind the wheel.Just because I buy a $100,000 cello doesn't mean that I'm going to wake up the next morning playing as good as Yo Yo Ma.The gear is a tool, not a panacea.Peace,Mazz