Troubleshooting a Pro Tools 9073 Error Code

[mrwonderful]

Hi Campers, well it's really time to chase down what's been going on with my rig - a faithful servant for years, troublefree for the most part. It's been getting slowly worse since this summer, first letting me run 2 hours or so but now the window has shrunk to about 25 minutes after which it chokes and displays the ubiquitous '-9073' error code.

It's a Macbook Pro 17" Intel Core 2 Duo 2.33 gigs running my great-running Pt 003 Factory setup. Along the chain of troubleshooting items - perhaps most suspect at this point - is my Western Digital 500 gig external drive. It's only about 1/3 full but it's got some years on it. (BTW I just upped the Mac's internal memory to 4 gigs and saw no difference.) And, for the record, the drive in the Mac is about 1/2 full.

So, a suggestion to re-initialize (as in blow out what's in it) the drive is now under consideration. Naturally I've got a backup...I would make DAMN sure the backup was viable, then basically empty the drive and re-load it from the backup. The thinking is this would in effect be performing a 'defrag' on the drive.

Any thoughts?

Jordy

[pboss]

It could be a hardware (drive) issue or even cable. I personally would borrow a 7200 rpm drive if you don't have one, just to run a test. My approach would be to attempt to eliminate the drive hardware as well as the cable as the cause of the problem. (hopefully it IS the problem, easy to fix). It's a test that might take an hour and does not require you to go thru the hassle of cleaning up your existing drive that you use for recording.

1. swap cables with a cable that you think is working fine (or buy a new one). If you still have the problem, go on to step 2.

2. wash your hair. er... I mean to say hook up the 'tester' drive and start a project on there. Quickest to copy an existing project, but if you still had problems on the test drive, you could run a more detailed test by trashing that folder and do a clean project from scratch - start a brand new PT folder and then import audio files onto the tracks - whatever is the minimum you might find to reproduce the problem. (It could even be a corrupted audio file but I doubt it).

If you really want to get detailed to try to reproduce the issue, then after you have those audio files onto new tracks, throw a bunch of plugins on those channels. Best to test each step, to see where you encounter a problem. The idea is to see at what stage of building up this new test project you encounter an error. A quick search on your error code does point to fragmented disc or a disc too slow as a possible problem.

If you can't easily get another 7200 drive to test, yeah, your plan to back up and then defrag the thing is the most direct option. Even though it's only 1/3 of the way full, it may be fragmented, or the hardware maybe wonky. Personally, I would simply go buy a large external drive, with a good spin rate, and literally just start using that as the main recording drive. Back up or copy your project files as needed. That is the simplest quickest fix if you don't have time, but you would just have to cross your fingers that was indeed the issue. Your drive is talking to you, and it is saying, "I may not be here much longer". Act accordingly.

Either way, since it's a somewhat new problem for you, and based on your info, it seems easy and cheap enough to fix, or at least to test a fix. I mean a few hundred bucks on a new drive is not a bad fix considering your whole system.

Let us know how your outcome goes...

[andygabrys]

the 9073 codes often have to do with some of the "optimizations" that Avid feels are necessary (that funny enough most other systems run in spite of).

have you run through these steps?:

http://avid.force.com/pkb/articles/en_U ... cType=1078

[mrwonderful]

First, thanks to BOTH of you for your ideas!

'andy'...link duly noted...I will pursue this. I have a new 'genius' around here I'm 'getting ready to know better'. He doesn't really know PTools but he knows Mac, in fact has one identical to mine, apparently. (does it for a living) He may be of some help in the near future. I can bring some of this text to him, he might be helpful in 'splaining it to me.

I'm fairly gifted musically but when it comes to computers, their filing structures and how they talk to each other I'm (except for some modicum of intuition) basically a caveman.

BTW,I think I forgot to mention it's an older version of both Mac (10.4.1 Tiger) and Pro Tools (7.3.1 I believe).

now, 'pboss', ya know, it COULD be something as stupid as a wire. I've jiggled-but-not-replaced, and just like ANY other wire, they sometimes just magically crap out, even if they've not been moved much/at all.

I AM, overall, a pretty good troubleshooter - and that's why I like the logic of eliminating the drive (and wires) from the equation. After replacing wires, I can disengage the main drive altogether and work with the backup (also 7200 RPM, natch) and see what happens.

More I might have mentioned...the main culprit seems to be TIME (a thermal issue in the drive? It certainly hasn't FELT any warmer, I've checked.) In other words it doesn't seem to be affected by # of tracks (happens regardless of track count), # of instanced plugins (can/will happen with NONE), or density of edits (I normally compose on a standalone sequencer, do 95% of edits there, and then fly everything over to PTools in sync.) My main reverb is a nice outboard Lexicon, so I'm not eating up CPU using 'verb in-the-box, tho I will use PT delays. When I do use things like Melodyne, EastWest Orchestral or MOTU Ethnic, I render everything back to audio ASAP to minimize processor load issues. Bear in mind that this is a system/workflow that's been wonderfully functional for years, until this summer.

So...is it the amount of TIME it's been on? It seems to happen - now - about 25 minutes after powerup, regardless if I'm running the transport or making changes while NOT rolling. And I agree...she's letting me down easy, saying 'I won't be here much longer'. I just finished a masterpiece of an album (on it since a year ago exactly) and recently limped to the finish line. And what a finish! I couldn't be happier...now it's time to see once and for all what's up with 'my Honey'.

Thanks again for your input...I'll keep you posted as this may help us all!

best, Jordy

[pboss]

Jordy, here's a question for you - when you record-enable a track, and hit "go" - does it lag a few seconds until the actual recording starts? Is there any difference in the time now vs back when things worked better? If it's lagging after you say, "OK, start recording audio to this particular track" - then it's looking for hard drive space to write it to, which would indicate a drive too full for it to handle well / fragmentation. Just a thought..

[mrwonderful]

Hi Patty,

Good suggestion, I will re-check this and look more closely. I BELIEVE that when I first power up and run a session there is little or no lag time. After a while is when it starts to hesitate, I think I remember noticing that tendency. I WILL check this out.

The drive itself is MAYBE half full, but there is the likelihood of some fragmented data. Also, I realized that ALL THESE YEARS I've been using a USB connection between the Mac and the drive, when there was/is a firewire 800 port right next to the USB all along. (DUH) (Keeping in mind everything's been running fine however.) So, I went to a firewire connection, like the existing one between the Mac and my 003 console. Doesn't seem to make a diff, but there's still value in narrowing-down what it the problem and isn't.

And what the narrowing-down is revealing is the drive being the issue, still. So, I will pursue the emptying-out/re-initializing idea and then re-load from my backup.

ALSO, I have done some prelim checks on making sure the backup will deliver when I need it to. While I apparently can't run the session from the backup (it tells me it is for 'transfer' only, a designation I do NOT remember giving it, so there's a ? about that too, I've tried reassigning it to have play/record functionality inside the Workspace screen but it won't let me do it), I have made a 'test' session on the main, copied it to the backup, deleted it from the main like it never existed, and then successfully loaded it back from the backup. I am understandably nervous about clearing the drive (it's years of work) but these tests, and the kind wisdom I've gotten from you and a few others, bump up the ol' confidence factor a bit.

After all is tried and troubleshot and it's found to be the drive itself just being worn out, might you have any suggestion on a replacement that WILL run my PT sessions? NOT just for 'transfer' like the existing one but one that can actually REPLACE the drive that's fading?

I appreciate your input on this, Patty. Like I've said, while I'm no genius in the strict computer side of things, when everything works it works GREAT (I've even managed to impress my wife with my self-taught PT acumen! ) Also I've noticed you're a Berklee-ite! I was there from '70 to '73, got lured away by a band working full-time. Never went back to it, sometimes I think I woulda-shoulda-coulda.

I'll let you know what I next uncover, but I like your logic - thanks for checking my thinking on this!

Cheers, Jordy

[pboss]

...Berklee-ite! I was there from '70 to '73, got lured away by a band working full-time...

- well, you know the joke at Berklee is that the famous ones are the ones who don't graduate.

Regarding your drive, I would just flat-out go get a large drive, that has the highest cable connection possible to your machine (whatever that might be, usb or firewire, etc), get a new short cable, and make sure the drive is at least at 7200 RPM spin rate. The risk is that you spend money and it's not the drive. But you can always use a drive later. Run some utilities on your own computer for good measure. Just see how the new drive behaves on a brand new session (don't copy one from your old drive, just in case something about the session data is messing things up.)

Let your questionable disc stay unconnected while you do all of this. I have a strong feeling that there is either something funky with the physical hard drive (they have moving parts and they do wear out). You don't have to figure out what is wrong. You just have to fix it, and this may be easy with a new drive. Let us know how it goes.

[Silversun]

How did you get on with this? A quick check I sometimes do in these circumstances is to do a save session copy on to the internal hard drive with all audio files copied. If the session isn't too heavy it should run okay.Disconnect the external so the session doesnt ref original files and see if it plays okay. If so then the external drive is dodgy probably.

[mrwonderful]

That's the thing about the drives, the pre-solid state ones as mine is: they DO have moving parts and WILL suffer eventually for it. So I'm practically convinced I should nix the re-load idea and just get a new drive. What the heck - drives are CHEAP anymore, and certainly I'll need one sooner or later, plus my aggravation (actually the elimination thereof) is ALSO worth something!

silversun, i will also try your excellent suggestion, I should be able to figure out how to do that, which would only further confirm what I already suspect but from another angle. (told ya, i kind of 'like' troubleshooting, you just have to be COMPLETELY methodical and scientific about it.)

I know my spelling's off here but did you ever hear of 'Ocam's Razor'? It's a scientific premise (I learned it from the movie 'Contact') that all other things being equal, the most likely explanation tends to be the right one. gotta love it...I use that one almost every day!

Yeah, Berkleeite! I heard my first year there (back in the hallowed halls of 'Parkview Chambers') there was like a 90% dropout rate. I defiantly stated 'well I'm not going to be one of those'...NOW look at me! I appreciate the remark 'the famous ones are those who didn't graduate'. Well I'm not exactly 'famous' but I am very happy to practice my craft with a modicum of quality and integrity intact.

this all happened at the 'best' possible time, as I'm kind of 'between' projects. I just finished a big full length one of Ambient/deep chill stuff, learning the ropes of Surround 5.1 at the same time no less. This wonderful system doesn't owe me a thing, but I like to say 'love your gear and it will love you back'.

thanks again for your input and BTW, Silversun, I REALLY dug the 'Us against the World track!! Great mix, and great sound on the vocals!

all the best, I'll keep you up to speed with this, it can only help all of us in the end.

jordy

[Silversun]

thanks again for your input and BTW, Silversun, I REALLY dug the 'Us against the World track!! Great mix, and great sound on the vocals!

Why than you kindly ! I just get dragged along on the coat tails of the other guys in the team.

Saving a copy is pretty easy. YOu just go to the file menu and under the usual Save and Save as option there is a Save copy as. Hit that and make sure the option to "copy all audio files" is checked in the dialogue box. This will rewrite all the audio files to a completely new session..... which also writes them in a 'defragged' order to your hard drive. Its also a great way to back up finished sessions because you know any audio used in the session will be copied.