What Am I Missing?

Tell Your Friends about Gear that you love

Moderators: admin, mdc, TAXIstaff

User avatar
billhewett
Impressive
Impressive
Posts: 320
Joined: Fri Aug 09, 2013 4:46 pm
Gender: Male
Location: San Francisco, CA
Contact:

Re: What Am I Missing?

Post by billhewett » Wed Nov 01, 2017 9:15 pm

Do you need to record vocals in only one style, or many different styles? If you need to record different styles then it might be worth having a few different mid-priced mics rather than one expensive mic.

I am not a god enough singer to worry about having super nice mics, but I do have three different mics that I use for different styles of singing, and I usually test at least two of them for each vocal track I record:
1. MXL 4000 multi-pattern large diaphragm condenser
2. Cheap ribbon mic (modified)
3. Shure SM7B (dynamic)
(I also have a FetHead that I use to boost the ribbon and SM7B)

The SM7B is the only great mic in my collection, but I've never gotten any complaints abut the sound quality of my vocal recordings. (the actual singing quality and pitch are a different story...)

But going back to what people have said before, with the equipment you currently have you should be able to achieve the sound you want with in the box plugins. You also might want to focus more on room treatment and mic placement. Are you using a vocal booth? If so then try recording without it. (in general stay away from vocal booths... but that's a whole other topic) What is your position in the room? Is the diaphragm at, above, or below mouth level? Have you tried singing into the mic off axis? Have you tried different distances from the mic? (proximity effect on a cardioid or figure 8 mic makes a huge difference).

My apologies if this is all stuff you know and have tried, but I figure it is always worth mentioning just in case.

Hope this helps!

-Bill

User avatar
cosmicdolphin
Serious Musician
Serious Musician
Posts: 1199
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:46 pm
Gender: Male
Contact:

Re: What Am I Missing?

Post by cosmicdolphin » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:35 am

macktastic wrote: I know I need gear to achieve that though.
It's not the gear..It's the ear. There's' no magic bullet or special sauce gear ( analogue or otherwise ) that will transform your mixes. Consider that...

1. A great song is a great song even with an average mix..A mediocre song is still mediocre even with a stellar mix

2. Arrangement is key. Without a great arrangement a great mix will be difficult.

3. Source sounds are vital. Starting out with great sounds will elevate the mix before you even start.

4. If you can't hear it - you can't mix it. Investing in the acoustic treatment of your mix environment will mean that we all hear what you are hearing.

5. If all the above are in place then the mix will be relatively simple and achievable with all the tools you already have

Whilst I can't help you with 1 & 2 , for no.3 check out Splice.com and for no.4 Sonarworks is a great tool ..as is Auralex..I use both.

Mark

User avatar
macktastic
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 16
Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2017 10:31 am
Gender: Male
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Contact:

Re: What Am I Missing?

Post by macktastic » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:47 am

OK what i mean by punchy analog is, when I hear my favorite rap song, I notice the beat and the vocals sound separated. The music I make I try to emulate it but my mix I feel still doesn't give me that. I'm assuming with the equipment these engineers are using I will never get achieve that. I know some of the mixing basics like EQ, Compression, Busses, etc. But I'm assuming my mic isn't clear enough for what I'm wanting to achieve.
I must add I'm wearing multiple hats. (producer, artist, engineer, etc)
Kolstad wrote:You should be able to get a punchy analog sound, in the box. Its not so much what hardware you’ve got, but more what you do with it, and the software plugins. What may help you is to get real specific with what you want to hear (what analog sound?), and then look for knowledge on how to achieve it. “Punch” is something you can get from setting your compressors right, but listening to some of your mixes, you dont seem to arrange your music with beefy kicks, subs and all that. So just a thought, maybe its not the gear at all?

Len911
Total Pro
Total Pro
Posts: 5351
Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2009 4:13 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Peculiar, MO
Contact:

Re: What Am I Missing?

Post by Len911 » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:44 pm

I notice the beat and the vocals sound separated. I'm assuming my mic isn't clear enough for what I'm wanting to achieve.
Maybe you are confusing punch with gain? A natural inclination is to turn up the volume. That may be what is drowning out the mic? This little video on the Sonnox Trans Mod shows what you can do by not turning up the gain and just affecting the gain on the transients or initial attacks. It's very possible that the beat is not as loud as you perceive it to be in your favorite rap song.
https://youtu.be/cDCagmgKgaM

*Not to try to sell you or anything, but Sonnox is having their 50% off sale during November.
https://soundcloud.com/huck-sawyer-finn
Not an expert on contemporary music

User avatar
macktastic
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 16
Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2017 10:31 am
Gender: Male
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Contact:

Re: What Am I Missing?

Post by macktastic » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:44 pm

Any suggestions? Like I said previously I'm producing, writing, and engineering my own tracks. I'm welcome to any basic information I may be missing.

Kolstad wrote:You should be able to get a punchy analog sound, in the box. Its not so much what hardware you’ve got, but more what you do with it, and the software plugins. What may help you is to get real specific with what you want to hear (what analog sound?), and then look for knowledge on how to achieve it. “Punch” is something you can get from setting your compressors right, but listening to some of your mixes, you dont seem to arrange your music with beefy kicks, subs and all that. So just a thought, maybe its not the gear at all?

lesmac
Serious Musician
Serious Musician
Posts: 1450
Joined: Thu Jul 04, 2013 7:53 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Tasmania Australia
Contact:

Re: What Am I Missing?

Post by lesmac » Fri Nov 03, 2017 12:03 am

by macktastic » Fri Nov 03, 2017 4:44 pm
Any suggestions? Like I said previously I'm producing, writing, and engineering my own tracks. I'm welcome to any basic information I may be missing.
So is nearly everybody else here and now its time to roll up your sleeves and get in and do the work. if you take the time to absorb what has been suggested already you should have plenty to be going on with. I doubt you got where you are now by letting other people do it all for you.

Len911
Total Pro
Total Pro
Posts: 5351
Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2009 4:13 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Peculiar, MO
Contact:

Re: What Am I Missing?

Post by Len911 » Fri Nov 03, 2017 4:38 am

lesmac wrote:
by macktastic » Fri Nov 03, 2017 4:44 pm
Any suggestions? Like I said previously I'm producing, writing, and engineering my own tracks. I'm welcome to any basic information I may be missing.
So is nearly everybody else here and now its time to roll up your sleeves and get in and do the work. if you take the time to absorb what has been suggested already you should have plenty to be going on with. I doubt you got where you are now by letting other people do it all for you.
I'm all out of suggestions. It's like I'm speaking a foreign language and ignored or not taken seriously. What are you missing? What am I missing? :| Whatever it is I'm sure through a sincere discussion it can eventually be figured out. I don't think anyone here on the forum who is trying to help is paid for it. Maybe a quicker and more professional opinion is to spend the $20 or so and get a custom critique. You'll get an expert for your genre and can ask any question you like.
https://soundcloud.com/huck-sawyer-finn
Not an expert on contemporary music

User avatar
mojobone
King of the World
King of the World
Posts: 11750
Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 4:20 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Up in Indiana, where the tall corn grows
Contact:

Re: What Am I Missing?

Post by mojobone » Fri Nov 03, 2017 9:26 pm

There are better and worse mic choices, (maybe an SM7/Cloudlifter combo would be more effective) but I suspect what's missing is a bit more isolation; try an SE Electronics Reflection filter behind the mic and some baffling behind the vocalist. That should get things dry and tight; kissing the mic signal with an electro-optical hardware leveling amp could help, too. ART makes a stunning two-chennel unit for under $300, but I suspect your Presonus channel strip can do something similar. There are however, some hiphop artists that will not spit without a particular box from Avalon.

Inexpensive Chinese mics tend not to take compression/EQ all that well; you try to get definition but what comes out is usually excessive sibilance. It's also common for condenser mics to pick up too much room.
The Straight Stuff; Roots, Rock & Soul

http://twangfu.wordpress.com
http://twitter.com/mojo_bone

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 30 guests