Lyric Writer looking for Composer

[guitarhacker]

I heard a song posted as a vox piano, bass, drum...basic demo. It didn't really sound too good, but I heard the potential in the underlying song. I asked for and received a bundled file. The original demo party asked what I was going to charge...I said "nothing... just want to see what I can do with it." I redid the music totally, fixed the vox issues and sent it back to the demo party who forwarded it to the original writer. I got an email from the original writer, that she was giving both me and the girl singing the demo equal shares 1/3rd each in ownership. Her words...."without our contribution, this song would not be what it is." That willingness to share her song has resulted in a collaboration effort that has continued to yield some really good songs. In the TAXI rally, Jason Blume addressed this collaboration and sharing issue. He said, if 5 people are writing in a room, and one person contributes 50% of the real effort, 3 contribute the next 48%, and the other person is fixing the coffee and contributes one word...... all the writers should share equally....period. Who's to say that it was that one word that "made the song" and resulted in the song being cut. Giving someone a 5% cut is insulting...and again, who's to say that the person who contributed the one word isn't the next Jeff Steele....wouldn't you want to have a share of a few songs with a writer like Jeff... so be careful what bridges you burn.

[oscar41]

All of you on this forum are incredible people. I'm so so grateful for these infos you've all posted. I totally totally agree with Hummingbird, Casey H, Guitarhacker. You guys are so so right. I also understand what Glender and Cardell are saying, so this is my opinion.I'm new to Taxi (joined September 2009). I'm a producer, specializing in hip-hop, r&b and pop. I don't songwrite though I hope to learn it. I would rather spend my time collaborating with someone who's a perfect songwriter while I'm a perfect producer. In this way, 2 or more beautiful minds would create something wonderful. If the songwriter originally writes a song and says that because I'm producing the musical bed, I've contributed less, what happens is that as Guitarhacker said, I'd feel insulted. I'd feel my work is not appreciated. Do you know that I would naturally not put in my very best on the track(s), because of this? So, its actually dangerous to argue any split other than the 50/50. Trust me, even the sound of a bird flying past your window can give you an idea so amazing that it makes the song a hit.So, my dear Glender and Cardell, I understand your arguement and it makes perfect sense to me. But it is important that you understand that, as Hummingbird, Casey H and Guitarhacker rightly said, there would be not hit song (no matter how well you wrote it or how well you sing it) without the other parties involved. So, either you pay upfront for the service (which doesn't guarantee a great job), or you split the ownership (which has better prospects considering that you both would be working on the song repeatedly).Once again, thanks to all of you for your contributions to this thread.

[oscar41]

nylyrics, i'm very interested in listening to your lyrics. Please, is there a link I could use to hear them. You can also contact me on oscarogali@yahoo.com, or send me a private message.thanks.

[glender]

I have to agree chopping it up even seems like the best way to go when collaborating.

[devin]

Some excellent, excellent advice from Casey, Vikki, and Hacker!Another way to get "work for hire" done cheap, is to offer the "deferred payment plan": If the song generates any cash, then you agree to hand some over at that time. In this case, the musician(s) sign the work for hire saying they have no claim to the song, but you have to stay in touch in case the song gets used. You might agree to something like this:"I'll give you the second $1000 that the song makes. So if the song makes nothing, you get nothing. If the song makes $1000, I keep it, and you get nothing. If the song makes $2000, you get $1000. If the song makes $25 000, you still get your $1000." In this case, the deferred payment is usually more than market rate if you were paying immediately. I see it more in folks who are getting established (like many here on the forums!), and don't yet have the music income flowing well enough to pay for musicians out of pocket ahead of time.A very successful person here on the Taxi boards only writes lyrics, yet he has used all kinds of arrangements to bring his songs to life.First he partners with someone who can write music and record/produce the majority of the song, and gives them 50%. Then he offers deferred payment to people that can fill in what's missing (I've done shakers and banjo for his tunes so far...so I guess I have some cases of beer coming! ) His songs are now getting placed into film/TV use, and his lyric writing is getting stronger every month. As his songs get stronger, he has more options of who he partners with.My very first deal was with a song where I did everything except the guitar solo...and try as I might, I couldn't make the tune "click"...so I farmed that part out to someone I had met here on the Taxi forum. I sent the completed bed track, and I said "can you wail over this a bit?"3 days later, I was so BLOWN AWAY when I received the 6 solo guitar tracks for my song, that I called the artist right after I had finished mixing. There was no doubt in my mind that this person's guitar work had significantly improved the song to the point where it was marketable. So instead of carrying through on the "deferred payment" promise, I offered 50% of the song to him immediately. He said "wow, that's generous!"...but I really wanted to thank him (important), and maintain the relationship (more important), as I was new and I didn't have any forwards turn into deals yet. It was a karma thing.Long story short, my next submission of that song resulted in my own deal (for us)...plus he ALSO went on to place the song into two other music libraries that I didn't have access to! So don't forget the BUSINESS power of having a good collaborator with a vested interest in how the song does on your side.P.S. Conventional wisdom now says not to put a non-exclusive song into more than one library...but the industry has made this realization since my first deal (Matto spoke to this point during one of the Rally workshops too..."one deal per song" is the growing consensus now).