Members Contacting Listing Companies -- Ouch!

[davewalton]

This is like carrying water in your hands.

That would be easier actually

On the upside... I think the 15,000 person Taxi membership is pretty darn well behaved in general I think... and that comes from the top down, from Taxi itself, the professionalism at the Rally and on the forum. Continued education and such in that vein... can never go wrong there.

[elser]

Our relationship with Taxi here is similar to that of a booking agent and a performer. If an agent books a performer into a venue, the performer must sign a contract that essentially says any future communication with the venue will take place through the agent and any future attempt by the performer to get booked into the venue must also take place through the agent.

There is the legal, contractual protection, but generally there is also a respect by performers for the booking agent that recognizes his efforts to create new contacts and working partners and his work getting performers booked into their venues.

There are under handed people who once getting booked into a room will go back later without the agent and try to book themselves, but it's considered to be under handed and most people don't do it. Besides the legal protection it's something we just need to talk about amongst ourselves like we're doing right now, as well as in the future so that it becomes common knowledge.

It's a little different with us in that once a relationship is created with a library, Taxi moves into the background, but we still need to recognize and allow Taxi to do it's job, which is establishing those relationships without our interference.

I think.

[Mark Kaufman]

I think.

[djbobm]

This is a tough call and there are a lot of good ideas. I personally trust that Taxi will provide quality leads to to reputable companies. Going to two Road Rallies has given me that trust. As a last resort, I could live with going dark on the forwards but it will bring on the whole mistrust issue from non-true believers.

I think that perhaps the violators really don't know any better. Sure, it is written somewhere in the rules, but let's face it, people don't always read what they are supposed to. I taught public school music for 30 years...I know! If you want someone to know something, you can't leave it up to chance. You have to be bold with an important rule like this. I always enjoy the monthly letters which are well thought-out and well-written, but are probably not read by all members.

I think that on every certificate, it should state boldly: DO NOT CONTACT THIS COMPANY! THEY WILL CONTACT YOU IF THEY ARE INTERESTED IN YOUR MUSIC! (Taxi's relationship with this company and other listings is based on trust. If this trust is violated by our members, Taxi will lose listings from this company and eventually there won't be any listings.)

Of course, some of the other suggestions allowing contacts through Taxi, might be worth a shot.

Taxi is a beautiful thing. It allows us dreamers who don't live in a music center to improve our skills and have contact with the music industry. I don't want this golden opportuntity to evaporate.

Bob

[simonparker]

I have to agree with Bob above.

But I got an idea


Perhaps, since MANY people are using the ONLINE service to submit - how about this:

1) after the screener agrees a song should be forward, an e-mail is sent to the submitting person.
2) INSTEAD OF THAT E-MAIL mentioning who it got forward to, it REFERS you to "Check it out" through the taxi website
3) AT THE WEBSITE, BEFORE YOU GET TO SEE THE COMPANY'S NAME AND/OR CRITIQUE (if applicable), THERE IS A PAGE THAT LISTS THE GROUND RULES. YOU AGREE NOT TO CONTACT THE LISTING PARTY. YOU AGREE THAT YOUR SONG COULD BE IN LIMBO FOR 2 YEARS VIA MUSIC LIBRARY, SUBMIT AND FORGET blah blah...
4) Once you agree, you click a button "I agree" on the screen
5) Then you get to your critique and certificate

A similar process can be used for mail in....

just a thought.

[t4mh]

Our relationship with Taxi here is similar to that of a booking agent and a performer. If an agent books a performer into a venue, the performer must sign a contract that essentially says any future communication with the venue will take place through the agent and any future attempt by the performer to get booked into the venue must also take place through the agent.

There is the legal, contractual protection, but generally there is also a respect by performers for the booking agent that recognizes his efforts to create new contacts and working partners and his work getting performers booked into their venues.

There are under handed people who once getting booked into a room will go back later without the agent and try to book themselves, but it's considered to be under handed and most people don't do it. Besides the legal protection it's something we just need to talk about amongst ourselves like we're doing right now, as well as in the future so that it becomes common knowledge.

It's a little different with us in that once a relationship is created with a library, Taxi moves into the background, but we still need to recognize and allow Taxi to do it's job, which is establishing those relationships without our interference.

I think.

Well this kinda works for me but I don't think TAXI wants to keep up with and handle all of the contracts between everyone of us and libraries. Thats what an agent also does.
Keith

[t4mh]

Well... that really can't be a blanket policy either. What about the companies that accept unsolicited submissions? Obviously we can't be hamstrung from participating in their music submission process just because we had a Taxi forward to them. Some don't mind the contact... there has been more than a few Taxi deals that have been gotten because of professional contact with the forwarding company. Maybe an option for the listing company "Do not contact under any circumstance"... part of the information Taxi gathers for the listing company sign up process. Some will check that box... some won't. *Then* the rule for "any contact with those companies that choose that box, the membership will be terminated. That seems fair and balanced.

I was thinking about that late last night, Dave, and I agree with you. But even with that caveat, something tells me there are probably yet more shades of gray that could make such a new rule fall down. This is like carrying water in your hands. But I think some rule like that is probably the best bet.

Some blanket email from Michael, as well as this thread, will probably cause less of it to happen for a while...but people want what they want, and plenty of them are simply going to bang on every door trying to get it.

Bangin' on doors is exactly what American Business is all about.
Keith

[elser]

Our relationship with Taxi here is similar to that of a booking agent and a performer. If an agent books a performer into a venue, the performer must sign a contract that essentially says any future communication with the venue will take place through the agent and any future attempt by the performer to get booked into the venue must also take place through the agent.

There is the legal, contractual protection, but generally there is also a respect by performers for the booking agent that recognizes his efforts to create new contacts and working partners and his work getting performers booked into their venues.

There are under handed people who once getting booked into a room will go back later without the agent and try to book themselves, but it's considered to be under handed and most people don't do it. Besides the legal protection it's something we just need to talk about amongst ourselves like we're doing right now, as well as in the future so that it becomes common knowledge.

It's a little different with us in that once a relationship is created with a library, Taxi moves into the background, but we still need to recognize and allow Taxi to do it's job, which is establishing those relationships without our interference.

I think.

Well this kinda works for me but I don't think TAXI wants to keep up with and handle all of the contracts between everyone of us and libraries. Thats what an agent also does.
Keith

Your right Keith, that's why I wrote the last sentence. I guess to put it more clearly is that we as Taxi members need to let them do the job we're paying them to do and let it go at that. It's understandable that people want to contact the library on their own, (about forwards) I've thought about it myself, but it needs to become common knowledge that this is unacceptable and will only hurt ones relationship with everyone involved.
Once the relationship is established between a library and a composer that's when the analogy ceases to work.

Still thinking

[ciskokidd]

I have to agree with Bob above.

But I got an idea


Perhaps, since MANY people are using the ONLINE service to submit - how about this:

1) after the screener agrees a song should be forward, an e-mail is sent to the submitting person.
2) INSTEAD OF THAT E-MAIL mentioning who it got forward to, it REFERS you to "Check it out" through the taxi website
3) AT THE WEBSITE, BEFORE YOU GET TO SEE THE COMPANY'S NAME AND/OR CRITIQUE (if applicable), THERE IS A PAGE THAT LISTS THE GROUND RULES. YOU AGREE NOT TO CONTACT THE LISTING PARTY. YOU AGREE THAT YOUR SONG COULD BE IN LIMBO FOR 2 YEARS VIA MUSIC LIBRARY, SUBMIT AND FORGET blah blah...
4) Once you agree, you click a button "I agree" on the screen
5) Then you get to your critique and certificate

A similar process can be used for mail in....

just a thought.

I kind of like this idea, but people tend to not pay attention to disclaimers and such that they have to read. I can tell you I have seldom ever read the disclaimers when installing a piece of software. Most of the time it's yeah, yeah, I know. Just let me get to my new virtual instrument so I can play.

I don't know how many forwards happen per month, but I would suggest that the forwarded party have to contact someone directly at TAXI to get the company's name that they were forwarded to. You could then have the TAXI person verify they are who they are and state in unequivocal terms the rules of engagement.

Yes you may have to hire a person to handle this, but it could go a long way towards lessening the possibility of infraction by the TAXI members who don't know better or should know better. Since Michael is well versed in business, this solution could be weighed between cost of new employee to cost of losing business due to some yo-yo.

That way if a member decides to break the rule they can be banned from TAXI and blacklisted by the offended company as well. You were warned and we have you recorded to prove it.

This way these unprofessional folks will get a good swift lesson in business etiquette.


My 2 cents FWIW

Cisco

[wta]

A BIG thing to keep in mind, in the entertainment biz there are VERY FEW second chances and there is no room for Taxi and their clients for, "Well, we told the artists not to contact you, boy we're really sorry". As we're seeing in this thread's senerio. Michael and Taxi NEED our support as they do what they must...