My latest beef.... WAIT! There's more.

[mojobone]

Well, of course, Steve and Glen are right. Our opinions won't make the business any more fair. But if this site isn't about learning to make value judgements about music, what are we here for?

[sgs4u]

Feb 10, 2009, 11:19am, mojobone wrote:Well, of course, Steve and Glen are right. Our opinions won't make the business any more fair. But if this site isn't about learning to make value judgements about music, what are we here for?Glenn and I rarely agree about anything, and I'm uncomfortable with the thought. hehe But stranger things have happened in my life. Mojo, I agree this forum is usually about learning. And I have learned so much here it's staggering. I have noticed that discussions about value judgements as they pertain to the world of the "music buying public," are usually filled with more opinion than fact. A bit like politics or religion. People tend to voice their opinions strongly, but that doesn't make them more valid. And I ain't scared to take a stand when I feel like it anymore. ( was I ever? hmm) I used to be quite fearful that big brother was watching & reading everything I wrote here. Finished with that part now. What I love about this forum is understanding how my or anyone else's music relates to the listings that Taxi offers. Whether Etta James has a reason to be pissed off doesn't matter much to me. Whether Beyonce is a fabulous singer doesn't matter that much either. I pay attention to anyone that sells one million units. Their credibility and longevity (from the buying public's perspective) is in those numbers. Then again, that's just my opinion. That's my opinion based on trying to learn why something sells, and why something else does not. Exchanging opinions is a wonderful part of how the world works, much like talking about the weather. Easy to do, but not much deeper purpose than connecting with like minds. People need to connect and voicing opinions is a great way to do it. I generally say something when I see an opinion being bandied about that suggests we should all do things one way, or choose one thing. After 2 years, I'm still hanging around for 2 reasons: 1) I learn from my own and other members' discussions about why something got forwarded or not. A crucial part of that is understanding how to make a piece more relevant to the end user, and of course how to keep myself aware of changes in current recording techniques, genres and the changing biz of selling music. I get to learn lots about what I don't know much about. 2) The social interaction with members on this forum has really helped me connect with like-minded artists, and feel connected to my own sense of purpose. This forum is a pretty safe haven, to be a writer/producer. To be successful with Taxi's system, there are a few guidelines I never learned much about, by playing in bands. I have learned to care a great deal about my friends and my co-horts. Now I'm doing my best to apply that same thinking to all the people in the business that I don't know. Because if I can learn how to "Help" someone at Capitol Nashville, that's gonna come in handy. For a couple of decades, I always looks at things from a "me versus them" perspective. As if someone wanted to steal my song, or take what's rightfully mine. I have used this forum to constantly teach myself that connecting is more important than money. My latest beef... wait, there's more! is people using one sentence of someone's post, to form an opinion to respond to, instead of understanding the context of how the whole post relates to the entire discussion. In the large scheme of things tho, I don't worry too much about what other people think of me or my opinions. I call those moments mouse farts in the wind.

[diogenes]

Feb 10, 2009, 12:55pm, sgs4u wrote:Feb 10, 2009, 11:19am, mojobone wrote:Well, of course, Steve and Glen are right. Our opinions won't make the business any more fair. But if this site isn't about learning to make value judgements about music, what are we here for?Glenn and I rarely agree about anything, and I'm uncomfortable with the thought. hehe But stranger things have happened in my life. Mojo, I agree this forum is usually about learning. And I have learned so much here it's staggering. I have noticed that discussions about value judgements as they pertain to the world of the "music buying public," are usually filled with more opinion than fact. A bit like politics or religion. People tend to voice their opinions strongly, but that doesn't make them more valid. And I ain't scared to take a stand when I feel like it anymore. ( was I ever? hmm) I used to be quite fearful that big brother was watching & reading everything I wrote here. Finished with that part now. What I love about this forum is understanding how my or anyone else's music relates to the listings that Taxi offers. Whether Etta James has a reason to be pissed off doesn't matter much to me. Whether Beyonce is a fabulous singer doesn't matter that much either. I pay attention to anyone that sells one million units. Their credibility and longevity (from the buying public's perspective) is in those numbers. Then again, that's just my opinion. That's my opinion based on trying to learn why something sells, and why something else does not. Exchanging opinions is a wonderful part of how the world works, much like talking about the weather. Easy to do, but not much deeper purpose than connecting with like minds. People need to connect and voicing opinions is a great way to do it. I generally say something when I see an opinion being bandied about that suggests we should all do things one way, or choose one thing. After 2 years, I'm still hanging around for 2 reasons: 1) I learn from my own and other members' discussions about why something got forwarded or not. A crucial part of that is understanding how to make a piece more relevant to the end user, and of course how to keep myself aware of changes in current recording techniques, genres and the changing biz of selling music. I get to learn lots about what I don't know much about. 2) The social interaction with members on this forum has really helped me connect with like-minded artists, and feel connected to my own sense of purpose. This forum is a pretty safe haven, to be a writer/producer. To be successful with Taxi's system, there are a few guidelines I never learned much about, by playing in bands. I have learned to care a great deal about my friends and my co-horts. Now I'm doing my best to apply that same thinking to all the people in the business that I don't know. Because if I can learn how to "Help" someone at Capitol Nashville, that's gonna come in handy. For a couple of decades, I always looks at things from a "me versus them" perspective. As if someone wanted to steal my song, or take what's rightfully mine. I have used this forum to constantly teach myself that connecting is more important than money. My latest beef... wait, there's more! is people using one sentence of someone's post, to form an opinion to respond to, instead of understanding the context of how the whole post relates to the entire discussion. In the large scheme of things tho, I don't worry too much about what other people think of me or my opinions. I call those moments mouse farts in the wind. That was good too. I totally agree with this.

[squids]

Feb 10, 2009, 10:09am, sgs4u wrote:Feb 9, 2009, 10:15pm, squids wrote:[quote author=sgs4u board=general thread=12073 post=119818 time=1234245178]Because it's fun?? Is it fun to point out why one singer is less important than the other? It is fun to discuss differing views of things. If you'd like to misconstrue what I said, please feel free but I gathered that the forums were for discussion and discussion sometimes centers around opinions and tastes and therein we learn something too. You mentioned the community here in one of your other responses. I cannot name a community, either IRL or online, that does not thrive in a freely expressed environment where people feel safe to disagree without being criticized. Everyone has stated that these are their opinions, they aren't fact, although fact is thrown in there. I didn't say Beyonce was unimportant, I said she was a different kind of singer than the singer she portrays in Cadillac Records. I also said probably she'll be considered a classic when she ages as well. The fact that I don't like her was my own opinion. A discussion about why they're different singers helps everyone hone their intellect and education.So yeah, I like education and intellect and I think it's fun to discuss this stuff, agree to disagree, see different sides of something. If you'd like to deride me for that because I won't make it a fair playing field, please refer to ggalen's post on why it isn't and pm me privately, it might save space!

[southpaw]

*While i was writing my post, my computer froze, when i rebooted some things i was going to say had been touched on, but i will still right my original response.*I reread this thread, and now and realize that Mazz's last post put the nail in the coffin.Quote:Quote:Are you guys joking when you downplay how talented Beyonce is? She's not my favorite artist either, but please don't kid yourselves! She has an outstanding voice that is probably about one in a million.Please.. One in a million? ..I can call at least two female R&B singers, just off hand, who can blow beyonces voice out of the water, period. I knew someone would take that line out of context.. If you read the last line of the paragraph it clearly states, that is NOT MY MAIN POINT. You have just clearly contradicted yourself.Quote:Beyonce is one in a million. And would you be so foolish to decide not to have Beyonce sing one of your songs, because you think there are "better" singers? Yes, the other singers you believe to be awesome, are also equally talented. You personal preferences dictate to YOU, who is good and who isn't. But your preferences aren't going to convince me. Beyonce is no Christina, but Christina is one in 10,000,000 to me. Then again that's just my opinion. And I'm only adding to this thread because I find it hilarious that people will write on a public forum, judge who's talent is more better, and pretend that their opinion SHOULD matter. 1) ...Who said anything about not letting her sing one of my songs. That would be a great credit that would give me better exposure and leverage to get my songs heard. 2) Of course my opinion matters. It doesnt matter to you. And you'd be foolish to let it effect you, when it so clearly matters so little. This is a thread of opinions and perspectives..... I find it hilarious when, for example, when i say something like, "Wendy's food is much better than Mcdonalds food", and then someone sharply retorts back with "well that is just your opinion!.." ...OBVIOUSLY. This is a debate. And an apporpriate one for this forum. (oh ya, i forgot to add, that is just my opinion. )Quote:I just don't get why saying one person is more talented, even matters... We're all allowed to like and enjoy whomever rocks our world. While you're pointing at the person who doesn't deserve what she got, you're showing the world what a whiner you are. haha.Look it. I cant believe you are still repeating this.. SURE, in the GRAND SCHEME OF LIFE,comparing levels of talent, is not going to change anything or truly matter.. YES. you are right.... But now, you are now taking a stab at me, saying that i am whining. At no point in my last post was i whining. I made my statements, i outlined my points, and i made no snide remarks to anyone personally. So i call your B.S. Quote:Posted by steve à gilbert on Today at 1:09pmToday at 1:15am, squids wrote:Today at 12:52am, steve à gilbert wrote:[quote author=mazz board=general thread=12073 post=119790 time=1234233849] How can any of them be less important than the other? What is the point of analyzing that? Because it's fun??Is it fun to point out why one singer is less important than the other? Ok, you win. Go right ahead. You misunderstand. This is not a contest, this is a forum. And adding to mojos point, what better place is there to debate opinions and perspectives on topics relavent to our business than a forum.....?

[anne]

So, can we all agree on:A) whether or not we like the genre of music being performed, talent is talentB) whether or not we like the style of the performance, talent is talentC) whether or not we like the performer of a type of music, talent is talentD) whether the quality of any material being performed is something we rate highly or not, a stellar performance of that material takes talentE) whether the performance of material is something we rate highly or not, creating stellar material for that performance takes talentF) if the material and the performance suck, at least there is always great production to admireG) if there is nothing in the production, performance, or material that is worth a positive comment or even some vague positive feeling, then maybe we should just pitch it.... I have enjoyed reading this thread very much. I LOVE when people can talk about things and enjoy a debate instead of taking verbal swipes at each other because of differing opinions!I'm wondering what your opinions are of this, given the above parameters. **WARNING: ADULT LANGUAGE IN THE VIDEO***

[squids]

I agree with everything except F and since you're Anne and I still got to get with you about some work (so now I'm a complete doofus for getting sidetracked and missing our big op), but if the material and performance suck, chances are they suck cuz of the producer's choices so I'm afraid that whole thing's gonna be a wash.But otherwise, I completely agree!! Where's the video?? Did I miss it??

[anne]

I didn't post the link correctly, somehow - Here is another attempt - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9zKJ5nNC18I get what your saying about (F) in my list.... I hadn't thought of the production sucking as well, since I'm such an optimist by nature

[sgs4u]

Feb 11, 2009, 9:22am, anne wrote:I didn't post the link correctly, somehow - Here is another attempt - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9zKJ5nNC18I get what your saying about (F) in my list.... I hadn't thought of the production sucking as well, since I'm such an optimist by nature WHOA! I'm always interested in what you guys think is interesting, so I clicked on the link. I love the song & video but I almost castrated myself leaping for the volume control. I'm sitting here in the living room with my 4 year old daughter. Geez, didn't you know that Anne?

[southpaw]

Thats classic Anne. Nice.Didnt that one go diamond?