Re: My Complaint...

[mazz]

Hi,I'd have to agree with the screener on this one. The piece is good but there's really nothing innovative or cutting edge about it, particularly with regards to production techniques. Stylistically it's right, but it's not ultra cutting edge and not particularly engaging, at least compared to the a las.The synth sound is pretty static and if you listen to Chemical Brothers, they're always making filter changes and other processing, particularly for transitions. Your drums are well programmed but they need some further processing to make them more in the style production-wise. During the breakdown, I wanted to hear the drums get really smashed or distorted or lo-fied or chopped up or something to make them different from what has come before.A lot of this style of music does sound repetitive but there's stuff going on in the production that keeps it moving along and it almost never feels static. In your piece, the sections feel a bit too static to my ears and to the screeners as well.All of this, of course, is my opinion and I hope it doesn't come off as harsh because I don't mean it that way. You have the chops to produce, I suggest you dig deeper and analyze the genre more thoroughly so you can find your voice and a fresh approach while still staying true to the genre. Not an easy task but doable given the tools you have at your disposal. It just didn't sound to me like you went as far as you could have with this one.Hope this helps!! Keep going!!Mazz

[vicky]

Quote:Do you want innovation or duplication???Mr. SunshineThis is a reoccurring question IMO...and the answer is "both"...for film and TV, light on the innovation, and for artist listings heavier on the innovation; if you're interested in super-innovative stuff, best to not only use Taxi, but also the grass-roots approach that has worked for artists for eons....fan-base, CD sales, etc.....the screener wrote....Quote:little things that could make your work stand out from the crowd...this screener isn't necessarily talking about innovation...just the little things that make a song unique....I think "innovation" is code for "not-dated"....that's just my take....there's plenty of room to mix innovation and give the listing what it wants....good luck with your music....vtbp

[mazz]

Jan 11, 2009, 10:03am, mrsunshine wrote:I basically outlined a track called Wild, Sweet and Cool by The Crystal Method. It's funny they mentioned shorter sections because I halved about every section in that song...their breaks and sections go on forever in this track....with your comments in mind, would you contrast and compare my submission to this forward?http://taxi.proboards27.com/index.cgi?b ... =11572From a production standpoint, the forwarded piece grabs me from the beginning with cool sounds that, to my ears are fresh. A cool effect on what sounds like tablas, lots of movement in the stereo spectrum, very punchy mix, little things popping in and out. This genre is very ADD oriented for as repetitive as it is I don't go out to dance clubs so as a stationary listener, IMO sometimes sections in this style go on for too long, but here it seemed just on the edge of "OK, OK, give me a new sound!".Like Vicky said, there's lots of room for doing stuff in this genre that hasn't been heard before but is still in the style. With modern synths and VIs that have sometimes thousands of patches and lots modulation options and filter types, it's pretty easy to find interesting sounds. Of course, the artistry comes in with which ones to choose, where to put them and not make it sound gimmicky.It's easy to listen to a genre and hear the big picture stuff: repetitive, simple riffs, synths, drum loops, and so forth. I've done it and completely missed the essence of what's below the surface that sets the top artists apart. I think you found the broad outlines but maybe just steep yourself in the style (if you want to) and listen more deeply into the music to hear what the a las do that makes them successful.The forwarded piece has more of the elements the listing asked for but your piece is fairly close, it just needed more variation of sounds and more up to date sounds. It's a tricky nut to crack but you'll get it.Mazz

[mazz]

Jan 11, 2009, 10:03am, mrsunshine wrote:I basically outlined a track called Wild, Sweet and Cool by The Crystal Method. It's funny they mentioned shorter sections because I halved about every section in that song...their breaks and sections go on forever in this track....with your comments in mind, would you contrast and compare my submission to this forward?http://taxi.proboards27.com/index.cgi?b ... d=11572I'm listening to that Crystal Method track now. There's so many little things going on in the background (ear candy) and the main sounds are right up front and cutting edge. There are repetitive elements for sure but the little things they do really help propel it forward on an interest level. Listen to the little noise bursts and things that sound like record scratching, or the way the guitar pans from right to left. Every 4 bars or so a new sound comes in or goes out. These guys are your competition for this genre. Even if it's for Film/TV, the fact that the client mentions them means they are looking for stuff that approaches this quality.Trying to hit the quality level of the Chemical Brothers is a worthy exercise and will only serve to improve your music. Analyze every aspect of that track minutely and try to decode their production techniques. It's not about copying but about assimilating and bringing it back out in your own way.Mazz

[vicky]

Quote:This company handles single songs for Film/TV licensing, as well as signing long-term Artist and/or Pub deals - be sure to attach your Photo/Bio if you'd like to be considered for an Artist deal.it looks like this listing is a little less common, because it both artist and film/tv in one listing....I think "innovation" used by the screener is a reference to 'newer' sounding mix and sounds....I try to remember that when they list alas, not to go back to a recording that is already 10 years old for a reference........for example...did you know that super current soul has about three bass tracks running....where some are so low in the mix that it's a shadow bass part....and I've never heard anything like it....Also the blame-game with screeners isn't going to get you far...If you do something really innovative....one screener will give it super low scores and another will just love it.....that is the way it supposed to be....also innovative doesn't mean good.......also innovative isn't too friendly with commercial, so being able to master that is the highest bad-ass way of working IMO... ...ps......re-work this song and you're there....Mazz had some great points.....I hope this helps....vtbp

[andreh]

Mr Sunshine-Good effort on your track; you're partway there for sure. Aside from what's been mentioned already on this thread, one thing that seems to be missing (or at least not as obvious as it could be) in your track is ATTITUDE. This comes from the sounds you choose/create, the notes you play, and the way the parts are mixed together.Your main synth part is pretty meaty, but when the drums kick in they're somewhat laid back in feel and production; I'd mix them a lot hotter and with a punchy/aggressive compression setting.And then nothing else with attitude comes in to grab the listener's attention.On the forward you reference, there is a lot of sexiness and attitude in the falling synth lines, and the drums are punchier and more present in the mix. I' don't particularly care for the bleepy synths in that track, but they do contrast the other parts well...something that isn't true about your two main synth parts that sort of run together tonally.Keep at it, and try not to let the sting of criticism get you down...it's something we all feel but it really only makes you better!André

[vicky]

Quote:Keep at it, and try not to let the sting of criticism get you down...it's something we all feel but it really only makes you better!great advice to all...vtbp

[davewalton]

Jan 11, 2009, 9:27am, mrsunshine wrote:I guess the first thing that I'd like to address is the a la(s)...My understanding is, we are supposed to listen and emulate (to a certain extent) what the listing party has requested. I mean basically it's damned if you do, damned if you don't!! When I feel inspired to wonder off to musical passages unknown, I get slapped with "not close enough to requested artists"...when I use the a la(s) listed to create something similar in that genre I get "could be even more innovation in the same vein", WHAT??? Do you want innovation or duplication???Generally speaking, film/tv listings are wanting music that sounds like it could be from some of the "ala" bands. Not easy in and of itself. Artist pitches are a MUCH higher bar... you basically have to try to make those "ala" bands obsolete by being a step higher on the musical evolutionary scale. This listing is unusual... a "hybrid" but because this could involve an artist deal, it's a very high-bar listing. The words "cutting edge and engaging" are key here.Think of it this way. If you took this track and played it for Ken Jordan and Scott Kirkland (The Crystal Method), would this song be likely to impress them in a big way?. I think the mindset for any listing with the possibility of an artist deal is that your music needs to be at a level in both production and originality, so that the "ala's" would be carrying YOUR music on their iPod and playing it for all their friends. One production thing that stuck out... the drums. Crystal Methods drum tracks are simple but they're a major supporting structure of their music... they pretty much blow your speaker cones out onto the middle of the floor. The drums on your track, (particularly the drum break at 1:16)... very light, very dated... almost exactly like the funk drum opening to "Ebony Jam", Tower Of Power circa 1975. The drums are an element of this track that really needs to be wholly replaced in both their sound and style. I like to listen to "Legion Of Boom" (Crystal Method). Particularly tracks like "Acetone" or "True Grit". For any artist pitch you'd have to *start* at that point and then move up and innovate from there. HTH,Dave

[andreh]

Jan 11, 2009, 1:56pm, mrsunshine wrote:lets compare apples to apples...my track to Taxi forward not mine to Prodigy, Crystal Method, etc...IMO, you should be comparing your music to both; what Taxi considers "forwardable" and the ala's mentioned in the listing can both be considered targets to hit.Fortunately for you, there are plenty of comments in this thread about all of the above to learn from! André

[mazz]

Did Mr. Sunshine bail out on us?