Thinking outside the box.

[charlie2]

Also thinking...maybe we,'re confusing arrangments with melodies.
I know arrangements could sound dated but melodies are just a series of notes.
If one played an old melody in a new arrangement wouldnt it take on that era?

[cosmicdolphin]

Also thinking...maybe we,'re confusing arrangments with melodies.
I know arrangements could sound dated but melodies are just a series of notes.
If one played an old melody in a new arrangement wouldnt it take on that era?

Melodic form has changed constantly over the years. This episode of Taxi TV is well worth a watch.

https://youtu.be/Li8nQmUZInE

[charlie2]

Yes. I do admit that melodies change with time.

But is it so wrong to use an older melody in a newer context,?
An old melody w a new arrangement etc. In fact maybe even tweeting the old melody a bit to make it modern sounding. Because just bc something is newer or modern doesnt mean its better

After all...its just a series of notes.

[cosmicdolphin]

But is it so wrong to use an older melody in a newer context,?

Not a case of wrong or right. If it's not what they asked for you're just decreasing your chances to get something forwarded, signed and then ultimately placed.

[DesireInspires]

It all comes down to what sounds good. That should be what it's all about.

I hate to break it to you but it not only has to sound great it's got to sound like what they want.

Generally what they want is contemporary and not dated sounding material. They want stuff that sounds like now. Unless it's a specific request for something that is retro of course

Does it matter that much ? Erm yes.

Why would someone spend all that time and money only to put dated sounding music into their new TV show ? These shows have audiences in certain demographics. They're just not going to use music that's outside of that and risk their ratings dropping. It's not a battle you can win.

If you want to change the musical landscape and bring back the good old days then go ahead and be an artist instead and plough your own furrow, nobody's stopping you

Music Licensing is not art, it's a service industry. If you can't supply what the customer wants then it's likely not for you.

Alan makes some great points which I'd echo.

Mark

Damn, you kept it 100!

That makes sense though. Older musicians who are not in touch with current melodies and sounds should collaborate with younger people to make music. There are plenty of 20 to 30 year olds out here who cannot play an instrument who could benefit from a guitar player, piano player, etc.

It’s a business. Act accordingly.

[cosmicdolphin]

Damn, you kept it 100!

That makes sense though. Older musicians who are not in touch with current melodies and sounds should collaborate with younger people to make music. There are plenty of 20 to 30 year olds out here who cannot play an instrument who could benefit from a guitar player, piano player, etc.

It’s a business. Act accordingly.

Thanks DI

Well I'd be no good a counsellor that's for sure ! I'd probably quite like to be the Screener

If you saw the Taxi Tv I put the link to you'll see how much stuff is dated, it's like 75-80% of it. I think what happens is Taxi attracts a lot of older musicians who maybe want to get back into it in later life, but who haven't listened to new music for a long time and they don't realise what people are listening to now.

Then it's a shock because all their friends and family say that their music is great when actually it's just dated and below the bar. So they either have to accept that and start listening and learning the current stuff ( like I did ) or they get all defensive , stay in denial and eventually quit because nobody ' gets ' their musical genius and everyone who ever did any good is a sell out.


Mark

[charlie2]

Who said I didnt know current melodies?

How did this conversation get so twisted and hostile to older experienced people?

Lol hello?

[RPaul]

Here, this sounds almost like early 1980s. But it is 2020 (okay, Dec. 2019 ).

https://youtu.be/J7p4bzqLvCw

Only for comparisons, take the start of this - and there possibly is 80s stuff (some Aha song?) that sounds even more similar:
https://youtu.be/oMHLkcc9I9c

At least on the production front (no comments on melodies for these two specific examples), these two felt like they were from vastly different eras, despite any influences from one era on the other. For example, on the first one, there was a riser toward the end of the introduction -- I don't recall hearing that in the 80s. There was also a heavily ("overly" IMHO) tuned vocal, which wouldn't have existed back then. It was almost all synths from what I noted from the musical tracks. On the second, the guitars start pretty early in the piece (and really come in big in the chorus), then it gets to that unmistakably 80s piano sound. The drums sound 80s-ish, too. And sounds, in general, sound "dated" (i.e. if they were trying to pass for today). Perhaps the sounds on the first one may have been influenced by some 80s tracks (not this one, though), but they still sounded modern.

Quite honestly, I am one of those people who wrestles with the "dated sounds" comment on some of my submissions, especially when I'm using synths that weren't even released a year ago, no less a few years back, in some cases (e.g. Massive X). But, in these two examples, the "dated-ness" of the second video, compared to a modern track that may well have 80s influences, is pretty extreme to my ears.

Others have already commented on melodies, and that is another area where I'm having a tough time, but one thing I have recognized is the fairly different phrasing due to modern lyrics. Just haven't gotten there yet in terms of my own writing, though I actually did get one recent song I'd written rejected due to sounding too modern for a dated pitch.

Rick

[charlie2]

I was'nt in particular referring to the taxi business when I made this thread. If taxi tells you they want it a particular way then do it that way.

I'm just questioning why things got so anal. Like if someone says that a drum fill or keyboard is dated I'm wondering... is it all that important?

Is focusing on this taking us away from the important aspects of the song? How aesthetic it is?
What the song makes us feel? How effective the music moves people. Etc.

The human brain can only deal with so many things at once. It seems like the music is kind of taking a back seat in all this. Composers are spending their time trying not to sound dated when they should be spending it writing better songs. Remember...we have to write 300 songs before getting a good one. And 500 good ones before getting a great one. The human lifespan is only so long.

[AlanHall]

I was'nt in particular referring to the taxi business when I made this thread. If taxi tells you they want it a particular way then do it that way.

I'm just questioning why things got so anal. Like if someone says that drum fill or keyboard is dated I'm kind of saying..."who gives a flying f...? Isnt it about the song? What the song makes us feel?
I'm sad that the music is kind of taking a back seat in this business.

Once again...do what taxi says...they know their stuff and I'm sure their music super visions also know their stuff...but...I'll like to see us progress in a better direction.

I would be hesitant to project what Taxi needs to service its clients onto the music business in general. Especially in the day where one can put music videos on youtu.be and let the world decide. If a particular artist doesn't become super famous that way, they can only blame their.. uh, business model. To be appealing (and drive sales/success), the 'works' have to be acceptable and desirable. If it is less than ideal, it draws a smaller share. That may be fine for you or me, and that kind of outside thinking has led to many interesting footnotes* in the music history books.

* Erik Satie was pretty popular and famous around Paris. But today, beyond classical musicians not many people would recognize the name like they would Beethoven or Wagner.